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Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting What these cars were built for! |
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08-18-2015, 10:50 AM | #29 | ||
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http://www.ft86speedfactory.com/ft-8...l#.VdNF2pf76jk Both the ones you've listed are purely cosmetic. Quote:
I really wouldn't want to run a race car on a UEL header, the very different runner lengths could lead to different EGT's on the two heads, and can also change how much each back scavenges compared to the other (could change AFR).
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08-18-2015, 11:53 AM | #30 | |
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08-18-2015, 11:58 AM | #31 | ||
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If you'd prefer not to remove the bumper to clean the filter then the TRD intake would be the best as it provides the most airbox volume. Grimmspeed is very good, but not the best for a race application IMO. Quote:
Do you have any pictures of the cooling ducts from inside the wheel wells? TMG refuses to sell these to anyone but their actual race car customers....
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08-18-2015, 12:54 PM | #33 | |
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yes the "boxer sound", the "rumble" .. but it's also known as "sound of inefficiency"
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08-18-2015, 01:15 PM | #34 | ||
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meh UEL makes great power N/A with E85 and boosted with a C30-94 Rotrex with E85 UEL sounds amazing and performs flawlessly on track/race cars including my own, @phastafrican 's , @The Slow One 's and @smbstyle 's cars which are all tracked heavily. No doubt the ACE 4-2-1 EL will outperform everything, but the majority of EL headers are on par with the quality UELs based on the dynos I've observed. Coil packs fail on both types of headers including stock. It's irrelevant. The coils cant take the heat and perform at high rpms for a long time. It's a well documented issue.
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08-18-2015, 01:23 PM | #35 |
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Not knocking your car Ian, but the ACE made a couple whp less on California 91, with you on e85. It would easily add 15-20whp to your setup, if not more!
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08-18-2015, 01:27 PM | #36 |
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Doubt it. Not without more compression. Maybe +3 to 5whp as-is. Not worth it
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08-18-2015, 01:39 PM | #37 | |
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I believe Porsche and Subaru/Toyota has their own reasons to pick EL over the UEL , and I trust their judgment more than the "Billy's header shop" in Texas Haven't you already gone through a few coil packs yourself? Have you ever considered EL as an option since with the FI torque dip is not an issue and EL header yields more gains
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08-18-2015, 02:23 PM | #38 |
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Yes I've lost two coils on the passengers side. I've considered EL but I don't like the sound. At the end of the day UEL is my preference and nothing more. The difference in power is not significant enough for me to consider the other option. I prefer UEL turbo kits on these cars too. Call me crazy
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08-18-2015, 02:37 PM | #39 | |
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in my case, I know that I won't be getting much by going with an aftermarket header due to FI and I would much rather running an OEM header but I have to do it only because of the material :/ Thanks to Subaru for giving us a middle finger on that department (just like the lack of the more powerful option) not considering FI yet?
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08-18-2015, 02:45 PM | #40 | |
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E85's big advantage is that it allows for the majority of the inefficiencies of many headers to be masked. E85 is proven to add a solid 35whp to an otherwise stock car with tune, but on the Ace, it's worth 12-15whp at best, NA. The primary issue is that during the exhaust stroke, the FA20 has difficulty pushing out the exhaust gas. No header will allow for 100% evacuation, but a higher flowing header will allow for more evacuation of the cylinder. If you pull more exhaust gas out of the cylinder, then less is remaining, when the exhaust valve closes, and the next intake stroke begins. This means the intake charge is cooler, allowing for more aggressive timing. Now, E85 evaporates exceptionally well, and when it atomizes and evaporates, it absorbs heat out of the intake charge, which, allows for more timing. At some point, adding more ignition advance timing doesn't yield more torque. This is MBT. On most headers, you cannot be anywhere CLOSE to MBT, but the addition of E85 allows you to get there. The Ace is already at MBT, so the gains of E85 are minimal. As an aside, Hondas are know for exceptionally well flowing heads and headers. The K20 and F2xC engines also gain 10-15whp at best, with an E85 tune. The primary reason for the Ace being able to flow better, is scavenging. The runner lengths are calculated to overlap at specific intervals. The exhaust gas pulse traveling out of one cylinder will overlap with the exhaust stroke of another, which adds a "suction" effect (Bernoulli), which allows for more evacuation of the other cylinder. For the pulses to overlap with that specificity, it turns out that the runners need to be long. Very long. Hence, the design. Now, when you add FI to the mix, the Ace header's benefits get multiplied... its almost scary. Ghetto, totally unscientific overlay of the Ace torque graph vs Ian's dyno. Ignore the "torque dip". This is a phantom dip that results from cam timing not keeping up with quick dynp ramp times. Altering the ramp time alters where the dip is, and is not exhibited on actual road testing. Solid Green = Ace header + front pipe + CA 91 Dotted blue = Ace header, stock front pipe + CA 91 Last edited by CSG Mike; 08-18-2015 at 03:31 PM. |
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08-18-2015, 05:11 PM | #41 |
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You're hitting MBT on California 91 with the ACE header?? That's beyond impressive!
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08-18-2015, 07:01 PM | #42 |
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great I have just bought a JDL UEL, not I need to get an ACE 4-2-1 ... stop the madness
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