FRS faster than BRZ? Tell me why I should still get the BRZ.

[Phaedrus29]

Originally Posted by SkullWorks

...(as stated but i know you can't read)...

...so since you missed it the critical thinking part is where you draw real conclusions from statements and facts rather than just believing what some kid that probably can't drive is whining about on the interwebs...

Not to mention if you are buying this car to go fast you are probably buying the wrong car (whichever you buy)

I'm confused...are these comments directed towards me? Why the hostility? I'm trying to ask a serious question based on a theme running through a number of the recent reviews. Are these reviews from Inside Line, Automobile mag, Motor Trend, and Motor Authority written by kids who can't drive? I'm very confused by what you're saying...it must be my illiteracy and lack of intellectual ability.

[engee]

Originally Posted by wu_dot_com

damn, its that close for the premium BRZ vs FR-S, what about the limited?

too lazy to do the search.

Per Ichitaka's post
FR-S MT: 2,758 lbs

Per Subaru's site
BRZ Premium MT: 2,762 lbs
BRZ Limited MT: 2,776 lbs

Weight is most definitely not a factor unless you believe 4-18 lbs make a difference. Your normal body weight fluctuates by 2 lbs day to day.

If you do believe that makes a difference and you on the big boned side, I suggest you go on a diet.

[DarkSunrise]

What's the difference in spring rates between the two? Has anyone gotten actual data on that?

Seems like a collosal waste of money for Toyota to test, develop, and manufacture a separate set of springs for the FR-S if all that effort ended up making a negligable difference in handling.

But.. stranger things have happened.

[uspspro]

OMG This thread is ridiculous.

You could probably take two FRS (same specs) and run different times because of manufacturing tolerances in the engine, tires, dampers, etc...

[SkullWorks]

my message was aimed at anyone who had issue, specifically at you yes, but not exclusively.

Jason's thoughts on why the times were different were even quoted in this post atleast once,

show me some hard proof that the FRs is faster than the BRz by an amount that is even potentially worth talking about, same day same driver, then we can talk about it, short of that happening this whole conversation is about people that are probably over extended to buy this car anyway convincing themselves that they are buying the FRs because it is "faster" (albeit by .1 or .2 seconds to sixty in an unimpressive run to 60 anyway) rather than the reality of because it is cheaper.

So again, if you are buying this car because it is fast, then you are making a bad choice to start, in order for these cars to be fast you are gonna need to knock a couple WHOLE seconds off the times not a couple tenths.

My reaction time at the strip varies more than the recorded variances in the 0-60 tests,

heck on an unfamiliar transmission my accumulated time out of gear in a 1/4 mile run may vary by more than the recorded variances in the 0-60 tests,

The cars are different in so many little ways that to buy one over the other blindly because it gets to 60 (potentially) a little tiny itsy bitty bit faster is kinda missing the whole point of the car, because the prius is gonna pass both cars on the straight any way lol

[zoomzoomers]

Originally Posted by SkullWorks

my message was aimed at anyone who had issue, specifically at you yes, but not exclusively.

Jason's thoughts on why the times were different were even quoted in this post atleast once,

show me some hard proof that the FRs is faster than the BRz by an amount that is even potentially worth talking about, same day same driver, then we can talk about it, short of that happening this whole conversation is about people that are probably over extended to buy this car anyway convincing themselves that they are buying the FRs because it is "faster" (albeit by .1 or .2 seconds to sixty in an unimpressive run to 60 anyway) rather than the reality of because it is cheaper.

So again, if you are buying this car because it is fast, then you are making a bad choice to start, in order for these cars to be fast you are gonna need to knock a couple WHOLE seconds off the times not a couple tenths.

My reaction time at the strip varies more than the recorded variances in the 0-60 tests,

heck on an unfamiliar transmission my accumulated time out of gear in a 1/4 mile run may vary by more than the recorded variances in the 0-60 tests,

The cars are different in so many little ways that to buy one over the other blindly because it gets to 60 (potentially) a little tiny itsy bitty bit faster is kinda missing the whole point of the car, because the prius is gonna pass both cars on the straight any way lol

^ Agreed

[Phaedrus29]

Originally Posted by SkullWorks

show me some hard proof that the FRs is faster than the BRz by an amount that is even potentially worth talking about, same day same driver, then we can talk about it, short of that happening this whole conversation is about people that are probably over extended to buy this car anyway convincing themselves that they are buying the FRs because it is "faster" (albeit by .1 or .2 seconds to sixty in an unimpressive run to 60 anyway) rather than the reality of because it is cheaper.

OK, fair enough. But did you read the quotes I posted in the thread from the recent reviews? I'm not relying on some kid on the interwebs or some fanboys trying to make themselves feel better about buying the FRS. I'm talking about these FRS reviews from these reputable (?) online sources saying that the FRS "may even surpass its Subaru twin", is "just a bit more fun", "a bit better-suited to those with as much taste for a well-carved apex and corner-entry tossability as for outright speed", "more playful", "more neutral at the limit", "notably quicker and faster than the BRZ", and that "more experienced drivers might prefer the Scion", and that "the Subaru...trails right behind".

These are quotes from these reviews, not from forum discussion.

And in response to uspspro, I don't see how the thread is ridiculous...if anything, wouldn't it be these reviews that are making these claims about the FRS>BRZ?

[WhiteGDB]

Most of those quote have nothing to do with the FRS being faster, which was your original question. Most are comments about the driving feel and handling characteristics.

Just buy the FRS and then you can be the bench racing champion.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by engee

Per Ichitaka's post
FR-S MT: 2,758 lbs

Per Subaru's site
BRZ Premium MT: 2,762 lbs
BRZ Limited MT: 2,776 lbs

Weight is most definitely not a factor unless you believe 4-18 lbs make a difference. Your normal body weight fluctuates by 2 lbs day to day.

If you do believe that makes a difference and you on the big boned side, I suggest you go on a diet.

Speaking of losing weight and before anyone goes all on me, I'm serious about this question.

I'm buying the FR-S as sort of "congratulations, keep it up" present for myself because I recently lost 80 lbs (heading to 100lb). Assuming the above weight is sans driver, that means that the car + me now would weight 2.6% less than when I started, and when I'm completely done will weigh 3.3% less.

Any way to calculate what a difference that might make in 0 - 60 or other such performance measurements?

I want to make a placard for the car that reminds me every time I get in it, how much speed I've added to it by hitting my goal.

[engee]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Speaking of losing weight and before anyone goes all on me, I'm serious about this question.

I'm buying the FR-S as sort of "congratulations, keep it up" present for myself because I recently lost 80 lbs (heading to 100lb). Assuming the above weight is sans driver, that means that the car + me now would weight 2.6% less than when I started, and when I'm completely done will weigh 3.3% less.

Any way to calculate what a difference that might make in 0 - 60 or other such performance measurements?

I want to make a placard for the car that reminds me every time I get in it, how much speed I've added to it by hitting my goal.

Congrats but I'm pretty sure those weights are purely the car. I think you need to add your weight plus the weight of the car (which is what I listed).

There really isn't a way to calculate what difference it makes. In the grand scheme of things, the extra 20 lbs that you want to lose is not going to improve the car in any significant way. This is also taking into the other facts that you really can't recreate the same 0-60 launch over and over with consistency and keeping all other variables the same. Even at a drag strip, no one ever runs the same exact time every single time.

However, I think you'll see significant improvement in your health, fitness, and overall confidence. :happy0180:

[samsam5886]

Scion updated their site with official weight at 2,785 lbs?! I thought the FR-S was going to end up lighter than BRZ. Why is the FR-S heavier by 20 pounds?!

[ayau]

Originally Posted by samsam5886

Scion updated their site with official weight at 2,785 lbs?! I thought the FR-S was going to end up lighter than BRZ. Why is the FR-S heavier by 20 pounds?!

i wouldn't worry about it.

the curb weight will vary depending on how much liquid was in the car.

the FRS should be lighter if everything was equal, but the difference will only be 10lbs or so.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Official documentation says 2758. Website says 2785. It's a typo.

[chulooz]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Speaking of losing weight and before anyone goes all on me, I'm serious about this question.

I'm buying the FR-S as sort of "congratulations, keep it up" present for myself because I recently lost 80 lbs (heading to 100lb). Assuming the above weight is sans driver, that means that the car + me now would weight 2.6% less than when I started, and when I'm completely done will weigh 3.3% less.

Any way to calculate what a difference that might make in 0 - 60 or other such performance measurements?

Practically speaking you can guess ~100lbs = ~0.1 at the strip but thats hardly exact.