How is this not an RX8?

[7thgear]

k i'm looking online and i see this,

http://www.edmunds.com/mazda/rx-8/20...tyle=101185419

the 2010 manual models are listed at 3065 lb, so at +250-300 lb more i would not put it in the same category as an FRS.

[scorcherjf]

lol was it a series 1 or series 2? Go for the R3 if anything! =)

Originally Posted by 7thgear

i just showed a picture of an RX8 to my wife, she texted me back.

- nooo
- terrible terrible
- do not want

hahahah.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by scorcherjf

lol was it a series 1 or series 2? Go for the R3 if anything! =)

i showed her a 2010 R3 in white (same colour that we want to get the FRS in)

no go, her top pics right now are either an old Miata (with the pop up lights), a Mini Cooper (which actually is an amazing car, but its wrong wheel drive), and this little thing that we hope to get in June

[Steve]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

It seems like some people like

Handling > Power

and

Power < Handling

But me I like an equal share of both

Power = Handling

[scorcherjf]

JCW Mini or the BRZ would be what I would compare. The miata is a vert as well as only a 2 seater - depends what you're looking for I guess. Mini would be more practical but BRZ would definitely be more rewarding to drive (just being RWD alone I think).

Originally Posted by 7thgear

i showed her a 2010 R3 in white (same colour that we want to get the FRS in)

no go, her top pics right now are either an old Miata (with the pop up lights), a Mini Cooper (which actually is an amazing car, but its wrong wheel drive), and this little thing that we hope to get in June

[Vasilis]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

But the point is...everyday folks don't want to have to add oil or worry about flooding. People barely can be bothered to pump gas and fill-up their tires these days.

I loved the RX-8, but it was just too quirky for the masses (this equals poor sales and eventual termination)...which is a shame because it really was an enjoyable ride.

I have to address some things as an owner

You are talking about regular people. I think people here are more than that, they're enthusiasts. Sure my girlfriend can't be bothered to do this and I don't blame her, it's just transportation...However if you can't be bothered to check oil and add if needed every 600 or so miles you shouldn't own anything near a sports car I believe Don't forget that it doesn't BURN oil, it uses it for lubrication and note that consumption is also linked to usage. If you don't push it, it won't need that much.

And I don't mean you personally ofcourse, I mean anyone who thinks like that.

The termination was mostly due to problems meeting the CO2 emissions and the MPG issue hurting sales. Other than that the RX8 is the best selling rotary car of all times if i'm not mistaken
Its termination was after a 8 year production cycle, it's time for it to stop being produced... Even the S2000 was terminated after 10 years and no successor in sight and I don't consider it a failure in any way!

I have to admit those of us who have access to JDM original models are more happy overall with their purchases than the guys with the LHD ones for some reason...
Also the 3065lbs made me go and check my original paperwork and check the last MOT and even ask a few other owners of RX8s here. We all have about 1310kg in our paperwork give or take 3kg (1310kg = 2888lbs). So I don't know WHY it's listed as 3065... For sure we are not missing any safety features - Most of us are missing navi + sunroof + power seats tho... Combined weight of all these around 80kg = 176lbs?
I don't know to be honest :P

Btw:
Flooding is exaggerated, it happens when you switch on the car then off again within less than 1 minute. Personally, I never flooded mine and we have 1 driveway with 4 cars and mine is always the last one in the row... I do a lot of these short trips out of the garage and back in again and I *NEVER* flooded it. It takes literally 1 to 3 minutes max to be "safe" to switch it off...

Nothing like 20 minutes or other crap I heard on forums here or somewhere else


That being said, not all of us like to check tire pressure + oil every time we fill up so I just hope the GT86 is more user friendly and brings more people in contact with spirited driving with safety, economy and low maintenance.
I hope more companies follow this concept which I find doubtful. Maybe next rotary car will be in the same concept but I believe it's going to be an RX7 FD successor (meaning competing with the big boys, 2 seats and a turbo :P)

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by Guff

Hahahhahahahahahahha

Those are both the same thing....

Yeah I caught it at last minute.

[Guff]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

Yeah I caught it at last minute.

We all make mistakes...

[Lonewolf]

Originally Posted by Vasilis

I have to address some things as an owner

You are talking about regular people. I think people here are more than that, they're enthusiasts. Sure my girlfriend can't be bothered to do this and I don't blame her, it's just transportation...However if you can't be bothered to check oil and add if needed every 600 or so miles you shouldn't own anything near a sports car I believe Don't forget that it doesn't BURN oil, it uses it for lubrication and note that consumption is also linked to usage. If you don't push it, it won't need that much.

And I don't mean you personally ofcourse, I mean anyone who thinks like that.

The termination was mostly due to problems meeting the CO2 emissions and the MPG issue hurting sales. Other than that the RX8 is the best selling rotary car of all times if i'm not mistaken
Its termination was after a 8 year production cycle, it's time for it to stop being produced... Even the S2000 was terminated after 10 years and no successor in sight and I don't consider it a failure in any way!

I have to admit those of us who have access to JDM original models are more happy overall with their purchases than the guys with the LHD ones for some reason...
Also the 3065lbs made me go and check my original paperwork and check the last MOT and even ask a few other owners of RX8s here. We all have about 1310kg in our paperwork give or take 3kg (1310kg = 2888lbs). So I don't know WHY it's listed as 3065... For sure we are not missing any safety features - Most of us are missing navi + sunroof + power seats tho... Combined weight of all these around 80kg = 176lbs?
I don't know to be honest :P

Btw:
Flooding is exaggerated, it happens when you switch on the car then off again within less than 1 minute. Personally, I never flooded mine and we have 1 driveway with 4 cars and mine is always the last one in the row... I do a lot of these short trips out of the garage and back in again and I *NEVER* flooded it. It takes literally 1 to 3 minutes max to be "safe" to switch it off...

Nothing like 20 minutes or other crap I heard on forums here or somewhere else


That being said, not all of us like to check tire pressure + oil every time we fill up so I just hope the GT86 is more user friendly and brings more people in contact with spirited driving with safety, economy and low maintenance.
I hope more companies follow this concept which I find doubtful. Maybe next rotary car will be in the same concept but I believe it's going to be an RX7 FD successor (meaning competing with the big boys, 2 seats and a turbo :P)

The emissions and fuel economy did play a big part in the RX-8's demise, but sales were utterly anemic the last three years here in the states.

I really wanted a 16X motor in a new RX too

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Vasilis

Other than that the RX8 is the best selling rotary car of all times if i'm not mistaken

According to post #120 on page 6, you're mistaken. Looks like the FB and FC both sold more.

Cool car, I very nearly bought one! But while I love the concept of the rotary, an S2000 or Mazdaspeed3 engine would have done this car a world of good...

[Vasilis]

Yeah I wasn't sure about that as i said - thanks for correcting me

But a MSP3 or S2000 engine as you would say would maybe make a more reliable car but it would lose its uniqueness and probably the car wouldn't have the same balance...

The real life MPG of the MSP3 2.3 turbo isn't that far from the Renesis anyway.
You can argue that the MSP3 is marginally faster to 0-60 sprint but on a track from what I've seen the 8 is faster...


One good thing is that the chassis is very capable and can tolerate much more HP than stock. People with FI on the RX8s are pretty happy with their performance yet there are always risks (+ high cost) when using aftermarket FI kits...

I know people who went turbo on the 8 and they say that it totally puts the car in a different league...Myself? I'd go supercharger, don't want to lose the 9000 rpm redline :P

To be honest, everytime I get behind the wheel of another car with a piston engine, it just feels crude and rough in comparison, even if the piston engine can be more powerful and the car faster. Since most of us do our driving in public roads, a lot of these discussions on needing more power or power is not enough or its gutless are really pointless... Even an MX5 NA with its "anemic" horsepower output is plenty fast for day to day use on public roads, an RX8 is surely plenty fast :P

[Guff]

Originally Posted by iShaveWithKatana

Let me preface this by saying that I actually like the Toybaru Twins. I like the exterior, the clean interior, the philosophy of the car (and what the engineers are trying to accomplish; they should be lauded for going the purist route), and that I even would appear to like the performance of this twin set on the track. Having said that, it's not in the same class as the RX-8. I drive an Audi S4 now, but owned a RX-8 6MT for 3 years and actually wish that I had kept it. Here's a quick run down of why the RX-8 is a unique car, with far more positive attributes than negative ones, and some attributes that cars that cost 3x as much can't match: 1) 1st & Foremost - The handling. With a limited slip differential, carbon fiber drivetrain, exact 50/50 weight distribution, and an extremely low center of gravity, putting power down from a light weight and low planted motor that has very compact dimensions, you - really - will be hard pressed to find a car that can match the handling of an RX-8 at any price point less than 80k or more. This isn't just my opinion, but that of many well known and more independent publications and automotive gurus who've consistently placed the RX-8 as one of the 10 best handling cars of all time. TTAC, which is brutally honest in its reviews of cars, consistently spoke of the RX-8 as being among the best handling cars, at any price point (Johnny Lieberman pushed his opinion that it handled as well as exotic territory). That it gives a composed ride in daily driving while handling as well as it does is the real mystery sauce. 2) The performance of the Renesis - No, the Renesis Rotary is not going to match 0-60 times with torque laden V6 or V8 pony plants, or the higher strung side of the FI 4 bangers like that found in the STi or Evo, but a manual RX-8 in the hands of capable driver is going to be able to consistently wring out true 0-60 times at just about the 6 second mark, without having to resort to abusing the clutch (I know this from experience), and while not great, that's not bad, especially considering there's a smooth, linear pull, and that once you're in the sweet spot of 5000 to 6500 rpm (with a 9500 redline), you'll care even less about 0-60 times. 3) Steering - With a magnesium rack, and possibly one of the most neutral and well weighted electric-assisted steering systems ever engineered (you think that I exaggerate even slightly? Go drive an RX-8, but only a manual, please), few cars track as true with the tactile feedback of the RX-8, with literally no kickback through the steering rack over rough pavement (thanks to that marvelous magnesium). 4) Clutch/Stick - It's outstanding. I will say that some older Acuras, BMWs and Porsches had a snick-snickier stick, but the clutch feel and travel is as good as it gets with the RX-8, and the action of the stick is in the upper 90% percentile. 5) Brakes - All I know is that even the stock brakes are great, rivaling the upgraded track pack specials in many performance cars, with a reported 60-0 stopping distance of 112 feet or so. Fade was not a problem under all but the most brake fluid boiling track days, in which case, upgrading is always a good idea anyways. 6) Practicality - How many of you have sat in the back of an RX-8? It has the most usable space, actually able to seat 2 full sized adults more easily than any car in its class, and when it comes to not having to decide to compromise because you schlep kids around, few cars that have the dynamics of the RX-8 are as practical in this regard. Hockey gear, rear facing child seats, other stuff, it all fits back there, and the trunk is a decent size, too. 7) Winter driving - This was the biggest surprise to me. If you stick some Nokians, Blizzaks or other proper snow shoes on the 8, it does incredibly well in even deep snow (I'm speaking up to 8&quot; or so), and has a capable ABS & ESC system to complement the winter driveability. As with all cars of this type, don't even think about driving it in even a dusting of snow with the summer rubber, because you won't even make it up a modest driveway. I like my S4. I miss my RX-8. In fact, I miss it so much that I've considered buying one of the remaining 2011s. The FT86/BRZ was the natural go to replacement for the now discontinued RX-8, and I do like what I've seen about it, but as the reviews come in, I'm growing less confident that it's in the same league as the RX-8 in terms of handling or stock straight line performance. Of course, the FT86/BRZ is going to be much easier/less expensive to add FI to if one is so inclined, and that's huge, it will get better fuel economy, it should prove reliable, and the boxer motor is a proven platform from which to make great leaps in terms of power. I'm cheering the tuners on when it comes to FT86/BRZ mods. I think the car has a lot of potential, but in stock form, it was teased for a long, long time, and like with everything so teased, there are some letdowns that have started to make themselves known if the early reviews are to be believed. But as they say, the real test will be in the actual driving, when these twin vehicles are more widely available, and real people report in.

HOLY BLOCK OF TEXT BATMAN.


If it wasn't so late, i'd read. But until then...

tl;dr

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by iShaveWithKatana

1) 1st & Foremost - The handling.

There are cars that handle as well as or better than the RX-8. S2000 to name one. Elise/Exige also. FR-S/BRZ will be 300 lb. lighter weight than the RX-8, with similar width tires. Good handling, on par with the RX-8, expect it.

With a limited slip differential,

FR-S/BRZ have.

carbon fiber drivetrain,

c/f drive*SHAFT*. Fine, but nothing magic here...

exact 50/50 weight distribution,

Fine again, but at this level of power/weight, less weight with "worse" f/r balance isn't going to hurt the FR-S/BRZ as much as you might think. FWIW, 50/50 isn't "perfect" anyway. The RX-8 and FR-S/BRZ both have about 1500 lb. on the front wheels. RX-8 has 1500 lb. on the rear wheels, FR-S/BRZ ~300 lb. less (empty). If one thought that 50/50 were more important than less weight, he could simply add 300 lb. to the back of the FR-S/BRZ and have it, without weighing more than the rX-8. But at this power/weight level, lighter weight is more important than "exact" 50/50.

and an extremely low center of gravity,

As low as the FR-S/BRZ? Maybe, maybe not. They both have a low c.g.

putting power down from a light weight and low planted motor that has very compact dimensions, you - really - will be hard pressed to find a car that can match the handling of an RX-8 at any price point less than 80k or more.

Utter B.S. RX-8 handles brilliantly, I almost bought one. But it doesn't handle any better than an S2000 or a mildly tweaked Miata.

2) The performance of the Renesis -

95mph in the quarter, with 22mpg? No thanks... FR-S/BRZ have about the same real-world power/weight as the RX-8, but will give upwards of 50% better fuel economy.


I love the rX-8, and very nearly bought one. But it's a fatally flawed car with the rotary. I love the concept of the rotary, but in the real world it only gives OK performance with ABYSMAL fuel mileage.

RX-8 with an S2000 (or MS3!) engine would have been fricking BRILLIANT.

[Gardus@Supersprint]

If the Rx-8 had a 4 pots (turbo maybe?) or a L or V6 I actually would have thought about it when I bought the Clio RS.

But I guess the "magic" of then handling of the rx-8 and also the layout of the seats and boot came from the small and light engine so it would probably be a worse car *exept* for the fuel and oil consumption.

With gas at 1.9 €/liter it really is a pointless car.