Honda CR-Z

[S2KtoFT86]

Originally Posted by Axel

nah... there will always be ppl who will buy boring cars (CR-Z).. but not even the Honda fanbois are impressed with that turd. But since S2KtoCRZ doesn't care to impress anyone (or have much fun in a DD), that car was designed for him. Too bad it won't even get much gas mileage, in fact, it really does nothing well. Predict it will have a very short life. Then S2KtoCRZ can add it to his extinction collection as he looks for his next turd DD...

Of course, some of us actually want to have fun in our DD too... not just brag about our garage queens.

To each his own... just don't get on ft86club and push your idea that what you now own and envision buying is that entertaining... it ain't.

It's quite funny that you get so offended over someone liking something that you do not. You seem to forget that I still have my S2000 to provide driving enjoyment, which I intend to keep. To say that an S2000 is not entertaining is completely your opinion and could be the opinion of those here. That's fine. They're like assholes. However, there's quite a few people on s2ki that would beg to differ, even after getting more expensive sports cars. Again, totally their opinion.

It's also hilarious that you continue to use "extinct". Sure the S2000 isn't made anymore but the aftermarket is still there in huge numbers and new products are still being developed. Hardly extinct as you might say.

Would you talk this bullshit to the hotrodders and classic car collectors who have a shit load more money than you? You would get laughed out of their car show because those cars are extinct as well.

I was actually trying to have an intelligent discussion but it appears that those on this board are no better than the high hp number guys that think anything less is absurd, with regards to the "if it ain't RWD, it ain't good." You are no different.

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

Big words considering we haven't even seen a near-production version sprinting around a track yet. Orrr any production FT's being taken in by tuning shops and then time attacked, professionally raced, etc. We have no official numbers (besides 2.0L and the concepts dimensions) regarding anything that could hint that the FT will not be a superb competitor of the now extinct S2K.

So still is a big hypothetical there.

You keep basing it off of a 40 HP supposed difference (supposed coming because we don't know FT's final HP numbers), when in all likeliness, the FT will be lighter, and have a lower center of gravity. 40 HP is NOT a zomg difference. Its a good difference, especially in low-displacement engine's, but you can't anchor an entire argument of 'better' based on that HP difference.

Its fine you're very very proud of your roadster, but making claims that the S2K will be superior to the FT is just mindless blabber.

The 200 hp is coming from the folks that are arguing for a 200hp RWD Coupe. I simply responded that I have a 240hp RWD car to satisfy those needs, nothing more. You are right that I shouldn't make claims without data, but hey, that's what everyone else here is doing about the Type R CR-Z. Don't forget that's what this whole discussion is about, not the stock CR-Z. I think most have forgotten that.

The stock CR-Z is a POS, even Honda fans, s2000 fans, will admit to. The Type R is something different though which needs to be looked at on it's own merits, not those of the stock CR-Z.

I assumed that this car culture could appreciate cars for what they are, and not take the attitude "if it ain't RWD, it ain't shit." I assumed wrong it looks like.

[Axel]

If the only cars available in the world were fwd, then we wouldn't have a choice... Thankfully, some manufacturers make rwd, or are considering bringing them out. My point is that all things being equal, and given the choice, if you're interested in getting more fun out of your driving most enthusiasts will opt for the RWD. If you don't care (and most drivers in the world don't) you can settle for the lower cost "appliance" spacesaving FWD drivetrains.

but why would you... after driving the s2k?

[S2KtoFT86]

Originally Posted by Axel

If the only cars available in the world were fwd, then we wouldn't have a choice... Thankfully, some manufacturers make rwd, or are considering bringing them out. My point is that all things being equal, and given the choice, if you're interested in getting more fun out of your driving most enthusiasts will opt for the RWD. If you don't care (and most drivers in the world don't) you can settle for the lower cost "appliance" spacesaving FWD drivetrains.

but why would you... after driving the s2k?

Simply because the CR-X was fun, the Delsol was fun, and the ITR was fun. They all, s2000 included, provide a different driving experience. I wasn't saying I was definitely going to get this thing. I mean, when was the last Type R that the US got? Hell, there are a ton of cool cars on the horizon.

[Gost]

its going to be a sad day for the Type-R badge. I don't think this is going to end up being nearly as fun as the CR-X, mostly due to safety regulations that are in place now a days. I'd rather drive a old beat up DA9 than one of the newer Civic Si.

[Midship Runabout]

Originally Posted by S2KtoFT86

I mean, when was the last Type R that the US got? Hell

Seriously.

I just dont see the point in making a type r. I mean (being a toyota guy) if trd or anyone came out with a prius GTS or whatever would i be all over it? no. its still a hybrid. and i personally dont like hybrids. yes i know the "potential" of the instant torque electric motors but still, not my thing. im sure in a few years there will be a electric car that will be making me eat my words, but the CR-Z type R will not be it... maybe the tesla roadster...

ps. im glad you changed back to the white ft in your sig s2ktoft86

[S2KtoFT86]

Originally Posted by Dixie Normous

Seriously.

I just dont see the point in making a type r. I mean (being a toyota guy) if trd or anyone came out with a prius GTS or whatever would i be all over it? no. its still a hybrid. and i personally dont like hybrids. yes i know the "potential" of the instant torque electric motors but still, not my thing. im sure in a few years there will be a electric car that will be making me eat my words, but the CR-Z type R will not be it... maybe the tesla roadster...

ps. im glad you changed back to the white ft in your sig s2ktoft86

I just want to see what happens and what the final numbers will be anyway. I wasn't going to get a FT on day one, maybe wait a year or two and by then, maybe the Type R will be around.

Not sure what's gonna happen with Tesla since 3 of their execs just died in a plane crash. I hope they can survive this.

Re:ps: Yeah, me too. The white on black S1's is just too clean and I love it.

[vh_supra26]

DETROIT — Honda’s telling anyone who will listen that the CR-Z hybrid is the new CR-X.

Not everyone’s buying it.

We’re as guilty as anyone of believing the hype, and I’ll withhold judgment until driving one. But Sam Smith over at Jalopnik isn’t waiting. He’s made a pretty good argument that the CR-Z hybrid, unveiled in production trim here at the North American International Auto Show, is a pretender to the throne.

“It’s a hybrid, it looks cool, and it’s likely to be more entertaining than most green cars,” he writes in his post. “But to my mind, it’s a perfect example of product Fail.”


Still awesome after all the years. Photo: Honda

For the record, Smith owns a 1989 CR-X Si. I’ve owned a ‘90 Si, just like the one pictured at right, and an ‘87 HF. Both were fantastic cars. Even the 58-horsepower(!) HF made a winding road lots of fun. The CR-X proved a car could offer decent performance, excellent handling and superlative fuel economy in an attractive package.

Smith is right in saying the CR-Z doesn’t measure up on paper. It weighs 2,670 pounds and has just 122 horsepower to haul all that bulk. The first-gen CR-X weighed between 1,713 and 1,978 pounds and produced as much as 135 horsepower depending upon the trim level and year. What’s more, the CR-Z is built on the same platform as the 2010 Insight, a car that offers all the driving excitement of a shopping cart.

There’s more than performance at issue here. A lot of people are harping about the car’s 36 mpg (combined), saying it’s appalling for a compact hybrid two-seater. The loudest critics note that the ‘89 CR-X HF got 41 in the city and 50 on the highway under current EPA standards. They’re comparing apples to oranges. The ‘89 HF produced 62 horsepower and weighed 836 pounds less than the CR-Z. It also didn’t have airbags, or traction control, or a six-speaker audio system, or power everything, or navi, or…. All that stuff adds weight, which is an enemy of fuel economy.

But the guys at Jalopnik don’t care much about that, and Smith’s point is simple: The CR-Z is not the new CR-X. It’s not a car that, as he put it, will “make any winding road its bitch” like the CR-X.

I really hope that’s not the case, because the hybrid segment needs a sports car. Perhaps more importantly, Honda needs a sports car. It needs a new CR-X as much as we do.

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2010/01...#ixzz0fzogD3qP

[vh_supra26]

Toyota Answers Honda CR-Z With Sport Hybrid Concept: 392 HP, 0-60 4.5 sec, City EV Mode

Today at the 2010 Tokyo Auto Salon, Toyota, in conjunction with its Gazoo Racing development team, launched the GRMN Sports Hybrid concept car (that last link is to a Japanese page that is translated with Google translate… some of the translation is a really good laugh).
Reportedly, the car is based on the outgoing MR2 platform and packs a serious punch by combining a 3.3 liter V6 to drive the rear wheels and an electric motor to power the front wheels using the company’s THSII hybrid system. The 4WD sports car develops 392 horsepower and apparently can go from 0-60 in under 4.5 seconds. Not only that, Autocar UK is reporting that the car has the ability to drive in electric vehicle mode in the city.


Autocar UK also claims that Toyota “insiders” say a car based on this platform could go on sale sometime in 2011 as an answer to Honda’s recently announced CR-Z. Apparently Toyota execs are miffed that Honda stole the limelight with the world’s first mass market sports hybrid—although based on reader reaction to the CR-Z, using the phrase “sports car” to describe the CR-Z is a stretch. So far reaction to the CR-Z has been incredibly subdued due to it coming up short on everything from fuel economy to performance.

If Toyota could pull off a mass market sports hybrid that actually had killer performance coupled with even reasonable fuel economy—and perhaps an EV mode—it would clearly be the hands down winner versus Honda. Personally I always loved the MR2 platform and imagining an eco sports car based on it has me salivating.

http://gas2.org/2010/01/15/toyota-an...-city-ev-mode/

[vh_supra26]

GRMN Toyota iQ Supercharged ConceptAnd it is this combination that could very well put Honda's CR-Z to shame. Honda is calling its CR-Z "the world's first hybrid sports car." But from reports leaking out of Honda, the CR-Z's "lukewarm performance" can only be defined as a 'sporty specialty car' not a 'sports car.' In contrast, the widened 4WD MR-S hybrid develops near supercar performance and reportedly sprints from zero to 60 mph in under 4.5 seconds, making it -- arguably -- the first true hybrid sports car. One insider says that Toyoda and his board members are fully behind this project which means that we could well see this car on the road by the end of 2011.

Hiromu Naruse poses in front of the GRMN Sports Hybrid ConceptAs it happens, Motor Trend has driven a version of this car. The MR-S hybrid first took shape some six years ago, and back in 2005, we were invited to take the prototype for a short two lap spin at a race track in northern Japan. With its development overseen by Toyota's 'meister' test driver Hiromu Naruse, the car was super quick off the mark, firmly planted in the corners and boasted well-weighted steering with negligible understeer. And the rear wheel drive cutting in after the electric fronts was indistinguishable.

The bottom line? Toyota has promised much with its pledge to build a new lineup of cars offering more passion and fun. But if this strong display at the Tokyo Auto Salon is any indication of things to come, then we have a lot to look forward to.

http://www.motortrend.com/

[S2KtoFT86]

Originally Posted by vh_supra26

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2010/01...#ixzz0fzogD3qP

I love how everyone continues going on about the stock CR-Z. Look at the thread title. It says "CR-Z Type R." That's what this discussion is about, not the stock piece of shit CR-Z.

[Axel]

Originally Posted by S2KtoFT86

I love how everyone continues going on about the stock CR-Z. Look at the thread title. It says "CR-Z Type R." That's what this discussion is about, not the stock piece of shit CR-Z.

we get confused easily...

[S2KtoFT86]

Originally Posted by Axel

we get confused easily...

Apparently that's the Toyota crowd.

[S2KtoFT86]

Will it be affordable? Not likely.

[Matador]

R