Thinking out loud: Need to run All Seasons

[StE92ve]

For whatever reason, I need to run on All Seasons. Even though it's an option to order the 86 with A/S instead of summer tires, the OEM Bridgestone Turanza EL400-02 seems to be a poor alternative to the OEM Michelin Primacy HP, which from my research, isn't great on it's own. So, I was thinking not to select the no-cost option of the Bridgestones and sell the Michelins right after delivery at a good discount ($246/tire from Tire Rack). But looking around, it doesn't look like there's a market for the OEM Michelins. Maybe I'll just drive them hard until the temps drop below 40 and get the A/S of my choice at that time.

Am I wrong about the secondary market for the OEM Michelins?

[Celica00]

Originally Posted by StE92ve

For whatever reason, I need to run on All Seasons. Even though it's an option to order the 86 with A/S instead of summer tires, the OEM Bridgestone Turanza EL400-02 seems to be a poor alternative to the OEM Michelin Primacy HP, which from my research, isn't great on it's own. So, I was thinking not to select the no-cost option of the Bridgestones and sell the Michelins right after delivery at a good discount ($246/tire from Tire Rack). But looking around, it doesn't look like there's a market for the OEM Michelins. Maybe I'll just drive them hard until the temps drop below 40 and get the A/S of my choice at that time.

Am I wrong about the secondary market for the OEM Michelins?

If you're already willing to buy a new set of tires when the temp drops below 40, then why not enjoy the summer tires and get dedicated winter tires when the time comes?

[HaXx]

Originally Posted by StE92ve

Am I wrong about the secondary market for the OEM Michelins?

there is zero market for the oe tires on here, but if you put up an ad saying 215/45/17 MICHELIN TIRES or whatever size they are, on facebook marketplace they will absolutely sell, especially in new condition. you can sell anything on fb marketplace with good pictures its crazy. it has so much more traffic than the forums classifieds

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by Celica00

If you're already willing to buy a new set of tires when the temp drops below 40, then why not enjoy the summer tires and get dedicated winter tires when the time comes?

This, you're north enough to warrant steelies and winter tires for 3-4 months.

[StE92ve]

Originally Posted by Celica00

If you're already willing to buy a new set of tires when the temp drops below 40, then why not enjoy the summer tires and get dedicated winter tires when the time comes?

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

This, you're north enough to warrant steelies and winter tires for 3-4 months.

If I had the room to store a second set of wheels/tires, that would be the most preferable way to go. But, I don't so there's got be a compromise if I want a fun car. Ultra high performance all seasons will let me drive year round except on snow and ice. I have another CX-5 for the snow and no one should be driving around when it ices.

[HaXx]

i find it so weird that car companies are so good at cutting corners to drive prices down to make an end product that is so affordable and attainable, but when they decide on tires toyota/subaru put EXTRREMELY pricey tires. i mean they use a cheaper volume knob to save 3cents on each unit, but instead of putting on an amazing set of conti extremecontact dws 06 for $130/tire (tiretack), they put on a tire that costs $246??

there must be something going on so that when normies replace their tires at the dealership michelin gets a payday, i see no reason that the primacy hp costs so much more. other than they know people replace them bc theyre OE, so they just double the price and people are none the wiser

Michelin Cup2 (918 Spyder OE) are cheaper than the primacy HP, feel free to explain that to me

[Mr.ac]

Originally Posted by HaXx

i find it so weird that car companies are so good at cutting corners to drive prices down to make an end product that is so affordable and attainable, but when they decide on tires toyota/subaru put EXTRREMELY pricey tires. i mean they use a cheaper volume knob to save 3cents on each unit, but instead of putting on an amazing set of conti extremecontact dws 06 for $130/tire (tiretack), they put on a tire that costs $246??

there must be something going on so that when normies replace their tires at the dealership michelin gets a payday, i see no reason that the primacy hp costs so much more. other than they know people replace them bc theyre OE, so they just double the price and people are none the wiser

Michelin Cup2 (918 Spyder OE) are cheaper than the primacy HP, feel free to explain that to me

I been saying that for years.
But then again, a sucker is born every minute. If a sales man can sale you all season for a sports car, you deserve the whole shaft with no lube.

[churchx]

And i'm saying from time to time that most cases of popping up "how it should come from factory" simply stem from people not knowing all the reasons behind certain carmaker decisions, and just pushing own very subjective preferences onto rest.
Primacies are expensive? Yes. But also have relatively stiff sidewall (=better handling feel), and low rolling resistance (=better posted economy & emission numbers). In some countries it may mean paying extra to gov-t to sell car with worse economy/emission numbers (thus obviously that extra cost passed onto customers, very probably resulting in more then what primacies vs contis costs). Do i speculate/guessing regarding tire choice too? Yes, but i don't want to blame toyobaru if i don't know all the reasons behind, about technical, market research/statistic, local regulations in misc. countries.
There are also many other cases of pushing subjectivity and blaming manufacturer of not making 100% exact product tailored to what some particular person wishes. For example about wheel/tire flushness, how it "should be". Forgetting that twins are world-wide car, and some countries requiring ability to fit snow chains. Or that more spaced out wheels (especially if paired with stickier tires) will chip paint on car sides. Or mods to make car more track specialized/capable, ignoring that 9/10 of owners will never track or lack advanced driving skills, and those 9/10 don't need +100-1K$ to price sticker for more track capability they won't use. Or if car should be prelowered "from factory", ignoring that some are not happy even with stock twins ground clearance.
But i want it! But i think that's better for everybody! But i want to not have to pay for mods i did to my car!
I highly doubt that Cup2 will last as long mileage as Primacies. Will for same mileage 2-4 sets of Cup2 still be cheaper then Primacies? And won't more money spent on increased fuel usage per life of tire set make up much bigger number then tires cost, and obviously more then delta of tire set prices between two?

[DarkPira7e]

If you're accepting that you need to compromise your vehicle's tire to be able to drive in almost all weather conditions, the only thing you should be looking at is cold weather performance.

Any tire can be driven on hot dry pavement. But if you're compromising because you want the car to be safe in cold temperatures, then you need to focus on that. I still can't fathom that you have two vehicles but can't stash a stack of 4 tires away to be swapped out seasonally.

Maybe the compromise you should be making lies elsewhere? Don't drive the sports car in winter at all, or find room in your life for tires to be stored. Obviously I don't know your circumstances- but I do know life in the northeast and I see enough people who compromised on their tire choice in the ditch come November's first snowstorm.

[Spuds]

OEM tires are good for learning how the car behaves at the limit at very slow and relatively safe speeds. However, op is running out of time before they get a bit hard... I drove year round on them (including some time in NY/NE) for 2 years. They do still work in the cold, but any dusting of snow is pretty dangerous. I also had another car I would drive any time it even threatened to snow.

[Ernest72]

OP, do the experiment yourself and see what you like.
But here is my experience.

On my 04 WRX I have summers and winters (snows). This is the best performance for all the conditions you will see. However, we only get about 8-10 days of snow so I drive my soft snows on dry pavement most of the time. This is not ideal, but the snows are great for those days when needed. I used to run all seasons and they were fine and I survived, but they never performed as well on those snow days. They got me home but I would not want to go out if I did not have to. With the snows I make an excuse to get out there because it’s so much fun.

Because I have the WRX, I have summers and all seasons on my BRZ. This is a good compromise for winter, because the BRZ will not see much snow, if any other than a dusting. So why have soft snows when I can get a good all season.

I think you will survive either way. In some ways the less grip of the all seasons can be more fun. You just have to try it and see what you like. If your job never requires you to have to drive in snow then all seasons might have the edge. If you must go out in snow, then you should get snow tires and just deal with the softer tires in the dry.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Ernest72

However, we only get about 8-10 days of snow so I drive my soft snows on dry pavement most of the time. This is not ideal, but the snows are great for those days when needed.

That's where performance winter tires are supposed to shine - cold, dry weather driving. They still outperform all-season tires in snow/ice by a wide margin, but aren't as good as studless winter tires for heavy snowfall, and should offer great dry and wet traction when the temperatures are low. I'm getting Pirelli Sotozero 3 this fall for my BRZ (stock size mounted on the stock wheels).

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by HaXx

i find it so weird that car companies are so good at cutting corners to drive prices down to make an end product that is so affordable and attainable, but when they decide on tires toyota/subaru put EXTRREMELY pricey tires.

They weren't pricey at the time of development. Toyota takes so goddamn long to put a new car out that by the time the car hit production Michelin had significantly reduced the supply of the Primacy HP to the USA due to poor sales driving the price of the tire up for the North American market.

In Europe and Japan the tire sells much better so it's cheaper.
$130 USD according to this UK retailer which imho is a reasonable price for the tire. Especially considering practically everything is more expensive in Europe than the Americas. It's probably still real cheap for them to slap these tires on at the factory due to a bulk deal in place and their availability in Japan, maybe $100/corner?
https://www.mytyres.co.uk/cgi-bin/rs...n&typ=D-113237


Blame it on soccer moms and office drones buying all seasons when they live in fuckin California, Texas and Florida at the advice of shitty large retailers who give guidance based on nationwide 'worst case scenarios' for liability reduction when a grand touring summer tire like the Primacy HP is far more appropriate.

[mrg666]

I drive with all seasons too since I hate driving with winter tires. Although I have a set of snow tires, I buy all seasons to enjoy my car in the winter as well. I have a second car for snowy days now and I don't even install the winter tires on my FRS anymore. Plus, we frequently have heavy rains in the summer and all seasons are better with heavy rain.

Today, I have just ordered Goodyear Eagle F1s to replace my General G-Max AS05 tires that I have been very much satisfied in the last three years. Eagle F1s were on sale and I will try new tires. Excited about that.