BRZ vs GSR/MX5/STi/Speed3

[jeebus]

Now that I've had my BRZ for enough miles to feel it's my own (almost 3k), I feel compelled to compare it to a few other cars I've owned. I decided to only compare to cars of similar price and/or vehicle type. I've had a few much cheaper and a few much more expensive cars that I won't bother including here.

BRZ vs 1998 Acura Integra GSR:

I feel these cars have a lot of similarities. Low on torque, high-RPM HP peak, lightweight, barely 4 seaters, etc.

Build Quality: The Integra wins here. Everything was put together nicely, the car was extremely reliable, etc. The BRZ isn't far off, but the rattles, pops, idle chirp...they make the car feel cheap. Especially since it's NEW.

Acceleration: The BRZ is faster, but barely. At least the BRZ has some low-end grunt. But the Integra didn't have a stupid torque hole. I'd almost call this a wash...slight edge to the BRZ.

Braking: BRZ by a wide margin. The integra brakes were adequate, that's it.

Handling: BRZ takes honors with better feel, less roll, and the RWD + LSD combo.

Seating: BRZ has better fitting seats with more support. Integra had all leather. I still give the win to BRZ because the seats feel great.

Transmission: Integra. Honda shifter feel is hard to beat. In this case, it's not beaten.

MPG: Although rated similarly, I find the BRZ averages 29MPG vs the 23MPG I got with my GSR.

Fun Factor: BRZ. Hard to argue with RWD with balance this good.

Value: The inflation adjusted MSRP of the 1998 GSR is $29,600. That gives the edge to the $3k cheaper BRZ.



BRZ vs 1999 Mazda Miata w/leather + LSD

Obviously these cars share a common bond. They set out to do very similar things.

Build Quality: Miata wins. The interior is put together well. The car was dead nuts reliable too.

Acceleration: BRZ. Miata wasn't very fast but the motor felt peppy and predictable.

Braking: BRZ by a lot, again. Miata brakes were sketch. Mine had no ABS either.

Handling: Both feel similar but the BRZ is easier to manage on the limit and more capable of long drifts.

Seating: The miata seats were leather but they sucked. BRZ is much better here.

Transmission: Wash. Better shift feel in miata, worse gearing for daily driving.

MPG: 29 vs 26. Advantage BRZ

Fun Factor: BRZ. Barely.

Value: The inflation adjusted MSRP of the 1999 Miata is $31,800! Pricey! BRZ has the edge.



BRZ vs 2004 WRX STi

Not exactly the same type of car, but often the same type of buyer.

Build Quality: BRZ actually wins here. The STi was a tin can with cheap....everything.

Acceleration: Uh, STi. Duh.

Braking: Hmmm...I want to say STi but I like the BRZ brake feel more. I'll go STi just because of the brembos.

Handling: Although grippy, I never liked the handling feel of the STi. It was understeer(y) and bumpy on all but glass roads.

Seating: Close one here. I still say BRZ wins.

Transmission: BRZ. The STi trans was even more mechanical/notchy/loud. Plus it was geared retarded.

MPG: LOL. 18 vs 29. Yeah...STi was thirsty.

Fun Factor: BRZ. It was fun accelerating like a hoon, but the BRZ brings more smiles.

Value: The inflation adjusted MSRP of the 2004 STi is $39k!!!!! BRZ is a great deal compared to this thing.



BRZ vs 2010 Mazdaspeed3

Once again...different type of car, similar buyer.

Build Quality: Mazda by a mile. The interior was a nice place to be. The car felt well put together. Nothing ever went wrong. No weird noises either.

Acceleration: Another shocker....Speed3 FTW.

Braking: The feel and stopping power was better in the Speed3. They aren't too far off though.

Handling: The BRZ takes the cake here again. The Speed3 handled well, but the FWD was a big limiting factor. Plus the car felt more rough over bumpy roads than the BRZ does.

Seating: The Speed3 seats were decent, but the BRZ seats are better.

Transmission: BRZ. The Speed3 was rubbery and often grinded gears if shifted too fast.

MPG: 22 vs 29. Advantage BRZ again.

Fun Factor: BRZ. Loved spooling up the turbo in the speed, hated the torque steer.

Value: The inflation adjusted MSRP of the 2010 Speed3 is $25,300. So for once, the BRZ loses this category. These cars are very similarly equipped stock as well.


Conclusion:

The BRZ is a great choice for someone that cares about handling, braking, seat comfort, and gas mileage; all without spending much money.

It's a terrible choice if you care about build quality, acceleration, and prefer buttery smooth shifters.

[8987846]

i like your review...it's a good one.
i personal think the exterior of 2013 Hyundai Genesis Coupe is better than BRZ, and its interior quality is far more advance than BRZ. since i have been waiting for my brz for 5 months, i began to think should i take the brz or switch to Genesis?

[jeebus]

The Genesis coupe is a nicer, faster, car. It won't feel nearly as fun.

You decide what matters.

[RoryTate]

I traded a 2010 Genesis 2.0T in for a BRZ Sport Tech (Limited in the US). The BRZ is much more expensive (Canadian market) than the 2010 Genesis, not so much with the 2013 Genesis. Not having driven a 2013 Genesis, I can't comment on it any further than that.

After 8k km on the BRZ, I can say that I miss the turbo from the Genesis big time and the 66lb of torque deficit. What I miss most is where the peak torque was delivered : 217lb-ft@2000rpm vs 151lb-ft@6400rpm. Passing now requires dropping two gears and flooring it, where before I could pass easily in 6th after a little spooling. That is the only gripe I have about the BRZ in comparison. Everything else about the BRZ is pure gold.

The big thing for me against the Genesis was the characteristics in a few inches of snow. The ass end would want to kick out or twitch every time I would pull away (due to all the torque being available just off idle), and I found it very unstable at speed in snow (the traction control in a word, sucked). I used quality snow ties (Blizzak WS-70) and experimented with different amounts of weight in the trunk, the result was the same: my girlfriend's Yaris outperformed the Genesis in snow, period. Here's hoping Subaru's experience in TC will shine for me in the coming months.

[jeebus]

LOL, snow. I haven't even driven my BRZ on a wet road yet.

[Re~Mix]

Genesis has a mediocre shifter and feels like a whale. Nice power and interior though.

Are you correlating build qualty to interior quality? Personally, i care more about the engine/suspension/chassis/drivetrain build than I do my cup holder.

Subaru and Toyota built this car for a reason, and the is the first time i've seen anyone upset about the shifting.

[Coheed]

I do like the comparison to the GSR. Though I haven't driven the BRZ yet, I can say my Nissans have all had better shift feel to the GSR's sloppy shifter. The honda shifters I've never been impressed with. They just don't feel like they are positively in gear. But perhaps that is just my preferences. They shift really smooth, but they feel sloppy once in gear and I've never liked that.

Of course, driving these cars on the racetrack always seems to reveal their subtle weaknesses.

[jeebus]

Originally Posted by Re~Mix

Are you correlating build qualty to interior quality? Personally, i care more about the engine/suspension/chassis/drivetrain build than I do my cup holder.

Subaru and Toyota built this car for a reason, and the is the first time i've seen anyone upset about the shifting.

build quality is based on many factors. Interior rattles, mechanical issues, etc. So far I've dealt with popping/clicking from the deck lid, door rattles, chirpy idles, etc. The overall build quality on these cars is lacking.

as for the shifter not upset, it just isn't fantastic.

[jeebus]

Originally Posted by Coheed

I do like the comparison to the GSR. Though I haven't driven the BRZ yet, I can say my Nissans have all had better shift feel to the GSR's sloppy shifter. The honda shifters I've never been impressed with. They just don't feel like they are positively in gear. But perhaps that is just my preferences. They shift really smooth, but they feel sloppy once in gear and I've never liked that.

Of course, driving these cars on the racetrack always seems to reveal their subtle weaknesses.

say wha? My GSR shifter had no slop at all. Every nissan I've driven has.

[DarkSunrise]

Agree. I used to own an STI and GS-R, and have also spent a lot of time hooning Miatas around back roads. I agree with pretty much everything you said, although I think the Miata top down was more fun than my current FR-S. It's close (the Miata's handling isn't as well balanced and it pitches and rolls more), but ultimately it's hard to beat the visceral experience of top-down motoring.

[jeebus]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Agree. I used to own an STI and GS-R, and have also spent a lot of time hooning Miatas around back roads. I agree with pretty much everything you said, although I think the Miata top down was more fun than my current FR-S. It's close (the Miata's handling isn't as well balanced and it pitches and rolls more), but ultimately it's hard to beat the visceral experience of top-down motoring.

Top down it was pretty fun. I'll admit that. More so than the BRZ. But top up it was less fun.

[Re~Mix]

Originally Posted by jeebus

build quality is based on many factors. Interior rattles, mechanical issues, etc. So far I've dealt with popping/clicking from the deck lid, door rattles, chirpy idles, etc. The overall build quality on these cars is lacking.

Ahh, I think we're all hoping this is just first generation issues. All in all, happy I didn't end up with the MX-5 or GTI I had my eye on.

[Captain Insano]

I like all your reviews, I also owned a MY04 STi too and only disagree with a few points on that one, some comments...

I think the MY04 STi when it came to the USDM was totally badass, raw, and such a unique car I don't think I'll ever quite love another car like I loved that car. And your review of the MY04 STi transmission was spot on. It was absolutely bullet proof... But I think they made that car more geared for a 2.0L turbo engine (EJ207) with peaky power than a 2.5L turbo engine (EJ257) with a small turbo for that size engine that was very good with torque (at that time) for a 4 cylinder turbo engine. Those gear ratios were good for a more peak hungry engine like a 2.0L, but way too close for a car that felt closer to a small 8 cylinder than a 4 cylinder engine to me. The result was a transmission that was SUPER durable, but with gear ratios that felt a little too close for that engine (these are all my subjective opinions).

Acceleration - yep agree with you. No comparison STi is better.

MPG - yep agree again, no comparison BRZ is better.

Seats - yep, agree again. I loved those STi seats when I bought the car. But comparing now the BRZ seats to those STi seats, I do like the BRZ seats a bit more.

Value - yep, BRZ wins for me. I can haul all my kids in it, but still enjoy a sports car nature of the car when they aren't with me. STi had that too and actually had 4 doors, but the BRZ is way cheaper.

I can't agree that the STi handles better. Although you feel more understeer at the limit, the MY04 STi would hand the BRZ it's ass on a track. Any track, take your pic. It obviously does handle better, even though you could feel some understeer at the limit in an unmodified MY04 STi (that was quite easy to tune out with a few modifications as well).

While you might like the feel of the BRZ brakes more, the MY04 STi brakes are better. Even for that car which was a little bit heavier than the BRZ stock for stock.

Interior on MY04 STi was sooo sparse, but I loved that about it. Totally purposeful for practicality (4 doors & AWD) and performance at the same time at a great bargain for a car of its capabilities at that time period. But you are right, the interior if the BRZ if you are comparing is much better.

At the end of the day, I find myself loving both cars for totally different reasons. The BRZ to me is just so FUN. It FEELs like a race car to me without having ridiculous power. This is where I think you have the opinion it handles better, because the way it FEELs.

[whaap]

I agree with your comments regarding the Miata MX-5. Prior to my FR-S I owned a '99 and an '02.