Who says we need more horsepower? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

LeeMaster · 01-10-2013, 11:29 PM

The Toyota GT86 that lapped faster than a Ferrari at Tsukuba did not need any additional power just to be fast. It just needed to lose 500 lbs.

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...uto-salon.html

dorifuto · 01-10-2013, 11:36 PM

Yeah, screw side windows made of glass.

ayau · 01-10-2013, 11:40 PM

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFHYWg8rwU0"]86 TRD Griffon Concept -Coming Soon- - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2A8-eRDOXq4"]Incar | 86 TRD Griffon Concept -PV- - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgN4I3VMLMU"]86 TRD Griffon Concept -PV- - YouTube[/ame]

http://www.trdparts.jp/86concept_2013/

racecaresuaceb · 01-10-2013, 11:46 PM

The "faster than 458" claim is quite surprising considering the drop in lb/hp was very impressive but nothing close to 458 levels. Must have been a tight track with short straights.

BRZ MT LTD =2774/200 = 13.87 lb/hp
86 Griffon concept = 2280/200 = 11.40 lb/hp
458 Italia = 3358/562 = 5.97 lb/hp o_O

(BRZ and 458 numbers from Feb 2012 Car and Driver Lighting Lap comparo)

86BRZ · 01-10-2013, 11:57 PM

I found losing 100 lbs is already very difficult target for a usable street car and getting very expensive for more weight loss.

ayau · 01-10-2013, 11:57 PM

Specs (use Google translate):

http://www.gazooracing.com/autosalon...list/trd86.asp

http://www.trdparts.jp/86concept_201...fon/index.html

fatoni · 01-11-2013, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racecaresuaceb

The "faster than 458" claim is quite surprising considering the drop in lb/hp was very impressive but nothing close to 458 levels. Must have been a tight track with short straights.

BRZ MT LTD =2774/200 = 13.87 lb/hp
86 Griffon concept = 2280/200 = 11.40 lb/hp
458 Italia = 3358/562 = 5.97 lb/hp o_O

(BRZ and 458 numbers from Feb 2012 Car and Driver Lighting Lap comparo)

thats exactly it. that track is tskuba. its hardly a road course and power and aero mean next to nothing. its all about weight and mechanical grip there as far as i can tell. combine that with the fact that the italia is meant to handle at much higher speeds and its obvious why it is "slow." its like they made that car specifically for this track.

LeeMaster · 01-11-2013, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racecaresuaceb

The "faster than 458" claim is quite surprising considering the drop in lb/hp was very impressive but nothing close to 458 levels. Must have been a tight track with short straights.

BRZ MT LTD =2774/200 = 13.87 lb/hp
86 Griffon concept = 2280/200 = 11.40 lb/hp
458 Italia = 3358/562 = 5.97 lb/hp o_O

(BRZ and 458 numbers from Feb 2012 Car and Driver Lighting Lap comparo)

Tsukuba = agile, agility, fast car.

There are straight roads in Tsukuba that evens out the playing field for cars that cant turn but but we are still comparing a Ferrari.

Pekingduck · 01-11-2013, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by racecaresuaceb

The "faster than 458" claim is quite surprising considering the drop in lb/hp was very impressive but nothing close to 458 levels. Must have been a tight track with short straights.

BRZ MT LTD =2774/200 = 13.87 lb/hp
86 Griffon concept = 2280/200 = 11.40 lb/hp
458 Italia = 3358/562 = 5.97 lb/hp o_O

(BRZ and 458 numbers from Feb 2012 Car and Driver Lighting Lap comparo)

Can not compare pure hp to weight ratio. have to take in consideration of the GT86 being prep for that course, the engineer behind the car, suspension is full race, chassis prep, some type of minor breathing mods to the engine, race slick, extensive aero, it is a tighter course, etc...

More power would be nice though...

whaap · 01-11-2013, 12:31 AM

I'll be the first to admit the car is great just the way it comes out of the box but I will also admit another 20 hp would be a hoot.

Grishbok · 01-11-2013, 12:38 AM

in all fairness, on a super tight-track a smart-car can outpace a 458. I don't think comparing the gt86 to a 458 is particularly valid, in any regard.

carbonBLUE · 01-11-2013, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grishbok

in all fairness, on a super tight-track a smart-car can outpace a 458. I don't think comparing the gt86 to a 458 is particularly valid, in any regard.

A stock 86 is also 13 seconds slower on the same track

rice_classic · 01-11-2013, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

A stock 86 is also 13 seconds slower on the same track

The stock 86 also has: Stock suspesion, tires, brakes, alignment, etc etc.

This car isn't just 500lbs lighter. It has highly tuned race suspension, brakes and really really sticky tires. Just look at the entry in turn 1. I didn't think he was going to make it. Just stunning amounts of grip.

Now, let's go do this test at Suzuka and see how the Griffon 86 compares to a "stock" Ferrari 458.

carbonBLUE · 01-11-2013, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rice_classic

The stock 86 also has: Stock suspesion, tires, brakes, alignment, etc etc.

This car isn't just 500lbs lighter. It has highly tuned race suspension, brakes and really really sticky tires. Just look at the entry in turn 1. I didn't think he was going to make it. Just stunning amounts of grip.

Now, let's go do this test at Suzuka and see how the Griffon 86 compares to a "stock" Ferrari 458.

Hks striped an 86 and put suspension, intake, exhaust, lightweight rims and only posted a 1:07.44, im still wondering how they shaved another 6 seconds off to post a 1:01

01-10-2013, 11:29 PM	#1
LeeMaster Red wine Join Date: Oct 2012 Drives: Subaru BRZ(R.I.P) Location: Denied Posts: 1,176 Thanks: 1,268 Thanked 342 Times in 240 Posts Mentioned: 13 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Who says we need more horsepower? The Toyota GT86 that lapped faster than a Ferrari at Tsukuba did not need any additional power just to be fast. It just needed to lose 500 lbs. http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...uto-salon.html __________________

01-10-2013, 11:57 PM	#6
ayau Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Drives: Some rust bucket Location: Polar ice cap Posts: 3,058 Thanks: 312 Thanked 1,046 Times in 556 Posts Mentioned: 37 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Specs (use Google translate): http://www.gazooracing.com/autosalon...list/trd86.asp http://www.trdparts.jp/86concept_201...fon/index.html Last edited by ayau; 01-11-2013 at 12:10 AM.

01-11-2013, 12:38 AM	#11
Grishbok Volunteer Fire and Rescue Join Date: Jul 2012 Drives: Ambulance... sideways. Location: No. VA Posts: 546 Thanks: 97 Thanked 350 Times in 166 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	in all fairness, on a super tight-track a smart-car can outpace a 458. I don't think comparing the gt86 to a 458 is particularly valid, in any regard. __________________ It's more fun to drive a slow car fast, than a fast car slow.

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01-10-2013, 11:36 PM	#2
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ayau Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Drives: Some rust bucket Location: Polar ice cap Posts: 3,058 Thanks: 312 Thanked 1,046 Times in 556 Posts Mentioned: 37 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFHYWg8rwU0"]86 TRD Griffon Concept -Coming Soon- - YouTube[/ame] [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2A8-eRDOXq4"]Incar \| 86 TRD Griffon Concept -PV- - YouTube[/ame] [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgN4I3VMLMU"]86 TRD Griffon Concept -PV- - YouTube[/ame] http://www.trdparts.jp/86concept_2013/

01-10-2013, 11:57 PM	#5
86BRZ Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Drives: BRZ Limited arrived on 9/1/2012 Location: Silicon Valley Posts: 563 Thanks: 312 Thanked 145 Times in 105 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	I found losing 100 lbs is already very difficult target for a usable street car and getting very expensive for more weight loss.

01-11-2013, 12:31 AM	#10
whaap Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Drives: '13 FR-S firestorm, 6 mt - '11 CR-V Location: Tucson Posts: 2,133 Thanks: 243 Thanked 1,387 Times in 657 Posts Mentioned: 36 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'll be the first to admit the car is great just the way it comes out of the box but I will also admit another 20 hp would be a hoot.

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