Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB - View Single Post

Aali1011 · 01-12-2013, 04:43 AM

So this is very interesting to say the least and is helping me decide between a BRZ Limited or a FR-S. So the retrofitsource has the H.I.D retrofit kit for the car awesome one more reason to get the FR-S and save some case. Now onto the push button start and proximity key/PKE(Passive Keyless Entry) So the PKE system in the BRZ limited being utilized is the Toyota based system now as far as the immobilizer is concerned it is a Subaru based system.

My conclusion regarding this is based off how the systems work and what is needed to work with them. The PKE system works just like a Toyota/Lexus's LITERALLY. Trying to put a remote start in the FR-S/BRZ for example is a good way to explain the immobilizer system. So the immobilizer in most newer Subaru vehicles requires you to either Option A) Give up a key and use what is known as a 556uw in the industry. This module takes a key hides it inside and reads the chip from the key while the car is trying to start. The chip has lets say a "password" for the car to start. If the password isn't there you guessed it no remote start or regular start. It was very common to see people go and get keys cut from the Home Depot or Lowes after finding out how much a key from the dealership costs. So while the key fits in the door lock cylinder and can lock and unlock the car when put in the ignition cylinder it will turn and do nothing. Option B is the use of a newer bypass module which "learns" the code from the key and allows it to start. So after going through a programming procedure with one of the keys the module learns the code and then supplies the vehicle with the code when trying to remote start. Don't have to give up a expensive key but needless to say the module isn't cheap either.

Now regarding Option B the module I speak of has some tricks up its sleeve. Essentially in certain cars it can learn and replicate through data a lot of the features of the car examples are Unlock, Lock, Alarm Arm, Alarm Disarm, Fuel Door, Trunk Open etc etc etc. If it is a function that is done electronically there is a good chance the module can duplicate it through data. So the thing that sucks about the FR-S/BRZ is the module can only do one or the other so it can either be a bypass for the key or it can learn all the functions of the car and replicate them for you through data. so you may now be asking "Whats the benefit of the module replicating how to unlock my car or open the fuel door?" WELL instead of having to run a wire to that trigger its being done through data! 10x easier and a lot quicker. So essentially for remote start purposes you need two of the data based modules to make things easy at least.

So for this advanced key system to make things easier as 086A has suggested using a module to learn the key so it doesn't have to be present and another to take car of the lock and unlock and factory alarm arm and disarm. Here is what I like about this system. It has a push button start.... and that is about it. DEI(Directed Electronics) the makers of Viper, Python, Avital, Clifford and countless other brands have their own PKE system. I have yet to see it in person BUT the major thing I like about it is that is can be used in conjunction with one of their remote start/alarms or even with their crappy smart start system(The smart phone POS). Also you can have up to 3 antennas placed in the vehicle to make the detection field of the PKE. What I don't like about either system in regards to what I want to do is that you essentially need to have a car key, the proximity piece and a FOB.

I get that with the advanced key system having just the slim fob will do your starting and locking and unlocking BUT if for any given reason something goes wrong or lets the the battery dies and the system loses programming if you don't have a key you are screwed. The same goes for the DEI system. You would need the proximity piece and if you had an alarm/remote start the key for that. If the OEM system was in place you would only need the key and a fob.

I think the predicament I am in is that I want the added safety of the alarm system and the convenience of a remote start plus the PKE and not a key and two FOBs. If the remote start was the sole thing in there without the advanced key system for the push buttong start you could wire something up similar to what the S2000's had for a push button start. So key in the ignition and start the car by holding down the button. I will be following this tread carefully and seeing what options arise.

01-12-2013, 04:43 AM	#102
Aali1011 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Drives: 99.5 Audi A4 Location: United States Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	So this is very interesting to say the least and is helping me decide between a BRZ Limited or a FR-S. So the retrofitsource has the H.I.D retrofit kit for the car awesome one more reason to get the FR-S and save some case. Now onto the push button start and proximity key/PKE(Passive Keyless Entry) So the PKE system in the BRZ limited being utilized is the Toyota based system now as far as the immobilizer is concerned it is a Subaru based system. My conclusion regarding this is based off how the systems work and what is needed to work with them. The PKE system works just like a Toyota/Lexus's LITERALLY. Trying to put a remote start in the FR-S/BRZ for example is a good way to explain the immobilizer system. So the immobilizer in most newer Subaru vehicles requires you to either Option A) Give up a key and use what is known as a 556uw in the industry. This module takes a key hides it inside and reads the chip from the key while the car is trying to start. The chip has lets say a "password" for the car to start. If the password isn't there you guessed it no remote start or regular start. It was very common to see people go and get keys cut from the Home Depot or Lowes after finding out how much a key from the dealership costs. So while the key fits in the door lock cylinder and can lock and unlock the car when put in the ignition cylinder it will turn and do nothing. Option B is the use of a newer bypass module which "learns" the code from the key and allows it to start. So after going through a programming procedure with one of the keys the module learns the code and then supplies the vehicle with the code when trying to remote start. Don't have to give up a expensive key but needless to say the module isn't cheap either. Now regarding Option B the module I speak of has some tricks up its sleeve. Essentially in certain cars it can learn and replicate through data a lot of the features of the car examples are Unlock, Lock, Alarm Arm, Alarm Disarm, Fuel Door, Trunk Open etc etc etc. If it is a function that is done electronically there is a good chance the module can duplicate it through data. So the thing that sucks about the FR-S/BRZ is the module can only do one or the other so it can either be a bypass for the key or it can learn all the functions of the car and replicate them for you through data. so you may now be asking "Whats the benefit of the module replicating how to unlock my car or open the fuel door?" WELL instead of having to run a wire to that trigger its being done through data! 10x easier and a lot quicker. So essentially for remote start purposes you need two of the data based modules to make things easy at least. So for this advanced key system to make things easier as 086A has suggested using a module to learn the key so it doesn't have to be present and another to take car of the lock and unlock and factory alarm arm and disarm. Here is what I like about this system. It has a push button start.... and that is about it. DEI(Directed Electronics) the makers of Viper, Python, Avital, Clifford and countless other brands have their own PKE system. I have yet to see it in person BUT the major thing I like about it is that is can be used in conjunction with one of their remote start/alarms or even with their crappy smart start system(The smart phone POS). Also you can have up to 3 antennas placed in the vehicle to make the detection field of the PKE. What I don't like about either system in regards to what I want to do is that you essentially need to have a car key, the proximity piece and a FOB. I get that with the advanced key system having just the slim fob will do your starting and locking and unlocking BUT if for any given reason something goes wrong or lets the the battery dies and the system loses programming if you don't have a key you are screwed. The same goes for the DEI system. You would need the proximity piece and if you had an alarm/remote start the key for that. If the OEM system was in place you would only need the key and a fob. I think the predicament I am in is that I want the added safety of the alarm system and the convenience of a remote start plus the PKE and not a key and two FOBs. If the remote start was the sole thing in there without the advanced key system for the push buttong start you could wire something up similar to what the S2000's had for a push button start. So key in the ignition and start the car by holding down the button. I will be following this tread carefully and seeing what options arise.