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Originally Posted by Sapphireho
Yea, two of our neighbors are retired nurses, and husband of one is a medical lab certifier.
them plus two micro-biologists I worked with for 27 years all say the distancing and masks are silly and do nothing to prevent the spread of this virus.
Also interesting, the 2 micro biologist swear this virus has every sign of being man made. These are some of the smartest people I have ever met.
Interesting.
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Your microbiologists are unequivocally wrong about distancing and masks. It most definitely prevents the rate of spread of this virus and other viruses, and it can prevent the absolute spread of this virus.
They say the virus has every sign of being man made, but that is interesting because everyone who has actually studied the proteins and genetic sequence of this virus say the evidence suggests this evolved naturally. Why? Because it shows mutation patterns consistent with evolutionary trends, and because its proteins and genome haven't been optimized. For instance, if it was engineered perhaps there is a sport where a charged end would have been stronger or more effective, but instead of using those amino acid base pairs, the virus is composed of one negative amino acid and only one polar amino acid instead of a positive amino acid. In another case, maybe the genetic sequence has insertions of novel inactive sections, where that just wouldn't be done in a manmade environment.
Have your microbiologist friends studied this virus' genetic sequence or protein structure? What makes them think it is manmade? I don't really find these third hand appeals to authority very valuable: 'my friend of a friend of a friend with a lot of experience says it is man made'. Ok, so?
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Originally Posted by Sapphireho
I don't ask or argue. I'm just a retired accountant, I have no idea who is right and who is wrong. I don't think anyone really does. I've been following CDC guidelines because it is all we got. Maybe time will tell what is right and wrong.
I think the most accurate conversation I have had with anyone about covid was when I was talking to my GP. I asked him the same questions that some here think they know the answer, one way or the other. All he kept saying is "we really don't know".
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When it comes to masks, we know. It is false to say that because there are people who have opposing views on a subject that it inherently implies that we don't know or that one side isn't correct or more correct. This tends to be a tactic of a side that can't demonstrate their point well, so they shift their argument from one of trying to show their side is correct to saying that because there exists a debate, we must not know, so their conclusion becomes, since we don't know then do whatever you want. Wrong. This is a classic logic fallacy and propaganda strategy, so don't get sucked into it. For instance, young, earth creationists have been using this tactic for years to try to get creationism taught in schools alongside classic biology.
Ultrmaroon said this:
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[Surgical and homemade] masks are not really good at preventing inhalation/ingestion of aerosolized "stuff." We can catch it through our eyes.
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https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...&postcount=818
These statements are true, but it doesn't really apply to this virus because this virus is not effectively transmitted via aerosolized particles; this virus is mainly spread via respiratory droplets. An aerosolized virus like the measles is much more virulent. Have someone with the measles cough then leave the room, wait thirty minutes then have a group of 100 people who have never been vaccinated, and 98% of the people will get the measles within two to four hours of the coughing event. That is something that is aerosolized and virulent.
COVID is primarily passed via the much larger respiratory droplets like the flu. It is much more virulent than the seasonal flu, which is why it is spreading, while the basic level of mask use and isolation protection is almost eliminating the seasonal flu. We have only had a few cases of the flu so far in our ER. We are testing every single admit for COVID, RSV, Flu A and Flu B and a few non-admits. In years prior, we normally only test septic patients and respiratory patients/admits for the flu, so we are doing way more screening for the flu compared to any year in the past. We are either experiencing a very mild flu season in terms of the virulent nature of the flu viruses that are circulating, or the masks and other social protections are having a significant effect on the flu.
Can someone get COVID via aerosolized mechanisms? Yes. Can someone get it via respiratory droplets to their eyes? Yes. My coworker got blood in his eyes from a HIV positive patient. He could have gotten HIV, but he didn't. If two people have a bleeding paper cut on their finger and touch fingers and one has hepatitis or HIV then could they transfer those viruses? Yes. Is it likely? No. Could someone sneeze on a surface and someone touch that surface, pick their nose and then get the virus? Yes. Is it likely? More likely than through the mucous membrane of the eye, but not even close to as likely as breathing in the droplets from the air. Do you get where I am going with this? To say we know nothing is false. We know this is a droplet virus. We know the primary routes for transmission. We know the special cases like during a nebulized/aerosolized treatment where the risks of aerosolized transfer goes up.
As far as whether it was engineered or not, it seems highly unlikely. We we know is that it has all the hallmarks of coming from nature. As mentioned, as a biological weapon or political weapon, it isn't really that great because the highest mortality is 65+, and because it is fairly easily managed with proper risk avoidance and screening protocols, which many countries have demonstrated.