Quote:
Originally Posted by mrg666
Will you listen if somebody explains? Cars are so much faster now that average arm/leg movement speed is not acceptable. Check Nurburgring top cars. |
Are Nurburgring lap times the only thing that matters to you? Ironic you say that because our cars are designed around the philosophy of making driving fun, not necessarily fast. There are a whole slew of hot hatches and luxury sedans with faster lap times than our cars and I'd much rather drive my FR-S.
The auto industry has gotten so obsessed with meaningless lap times that it drives me crazy. And that's coming from a self-professed trackaholic. Who cares if a DSG is 0.5 second quicker per lap if you're having less fun?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo
I disagree. BMW manuals suck. The shifter has long throws, it's rubbery and numb with almost no feedback. The clutch pedal is way too long (German tradition) and the grab point is way too high. The pedal arm is made of plastic, which makes it too flexible and inaccurate feeling. And then there's the damn clutch delay valve that screws up your timing, kills the little feedback there used to be, and teaches you terrible clutching habits.
I've had 4 manual BMWs before the BRZ, and a manual Audi before that. I still have one BMW and an older Benz. I love my German cars and as far as I can tell they'll be my overall go to in the future too, but a great clutch/shifter setup is something I've yet to see in a German car. Even Porsches don't do it right. The BRZ is the best manual setup out of all my cars I've ever had, even better (stock!) than my E92 335i, which had the CDV removed, a custom all metal shift rod/linkage, and an adjustable steel clutch pedal.
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Just curious - have you driven any manual M3? Wondering because I haven't had any issues on street or track with my friend's F80 M3 or my other track buddy's E46 M3. Like I said they lack some feel compared with the truly great manuals, but nothing horrible. Yeah the clutch engagement point is a little high, but same is true for a stock FR-S/BRZ.
Put it this way - if the Miata/S2000 is an A and the FR-S is a B+, the F80 M3 would be a B at worst. Not great, but still pretty good.
(Some other comparison points - I'd give my old 350z a C and my old 987.2 Boxster S an A-. E46 M3 and 330ci would get B+).