[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by atomicalex

They are „Corvetteing“ it.

Read up on John DeLorean and the Pontiac GTO.

With the Supra coming out, the 86 is trapped, and that hamstrings the BRZ with it.

If the Supra is the amazing performer that Toyota seems to claim it will be, and if it's exclusive and expensive ($50k+), then that statement is absolutely false. There is PLENTY of room for a BRZ with a 11 or 10:1 power to weight ratio for less than $35-40k. And it would also have the distinction of being the only sub 3000 lb sports car with a P/W ratio that low that didn't wear a Porsche crest for less than $100,000.

Originally Posted by dowroa

I know this has been addressed before, but the power thing just bothers me.

If you talked to anyone about the 2000 Type-R, they will rave about the car (about identical).

The E90 M3 is a revered car and said it is amazing (less power).

I just don't get it. I have driven a D-Street car, and it was nice. I would like to get in a 17+ soon, and I am sure it is still nice.

As someone who has owned STis, WRXes, Foresters, and Legacys, this is the only Subaru that I still personally believe in.

I guess there just aren't as many of me as I would have liked to see?

- brian

I'm assuming you meant to say E30 M3 (not E90 which has a 414 hp 4.0 V8).

I know I don't speak for everyone. However myself, and a lot of other enthusiasts I know (a lot being Honda fans) prefer something like a Type R because of the engine's character and personality. It's the same thing for the GS-R and to a lesser extent, cars with the K20. I've talked to several people who say they'd be perfectly fine with the BRZ's engine output if the engine was more like a K20. The FA20 revs up to 7400 rpm, but it sure doesn't seem to really enjoy it. I owned my BRZ side by side with my GS-R and the GS-R's engine is just plain more fun to play with. Nobody will deny that the FA20's significant torque advantage doesn't make it an easier DD but when you're out on the track (or in the mountins) with the engine on full boil nobody cares about that.

A new Civic Si can probably match a 2001 Type R on track today, though it won't be as fun or visceral and it'll probably destroy it's front tires in the process (massively oversized compared to ITR too). And 20 years from now nobody will care about the Si.