[retrosmiths]

Off-topic, scammy dealer tactics I experienced:

You tell them which car you're interested in. They ask you if you'll buy the car that day if both parties agree on a price and then they'll make you sign a piece of paper (the 4-square) to make it feel "official", so you are somehow obliged to buy the car (but you are not, because that's not the legal paperwork).

They come up with absurdly high numbers, you feel insulted, they ask the price range you're expecting, and now they have the exact price you're willing to pay (the upper part of your range). Prices keep going back and forth between you and the finance manager, with the dealer acting as the middleman and as "your friend trying to help you".

They keep you waiting for long periods of time to drain you of energy and just make you submit to whatever they're asking for.

Near the end of the negotiation, they'll try a few more scams: they'll tell you they have to bump the APR by a few percent due to unforeseen reasons, or/and they ask you if you can thrown in a few more bucks to the monthly payment (usually $10-20) which they try to convince you "wouldn't hurt" but in long term it will really add up.

My advice? Walk out. Wait for a few days and they'll call you back.