Originally Posted by DarkSunrise (Post 2384188)

Whoa I think you need to step back and relax, you're taking this way too personally. I don't hate you and it doesn't matter whether you're a troll or not. Just debating facts here.

I'm surprised in all of your reading you haven't come across explanations of how body roll adds weight transfer. There are plenty of materials out there that explain it. In fact, your formula citing to CG height states it right there, you just don't realize it yet. If you think through the effect of body roll on CG, you'll see it.

http://www.autozine.org/technical_sc.../body_roll.jpg




As for the camber curve on the Miata being greater than the degree of body roll, of course. You have to take into consideration at what angle the tire is reacting the way the suspension engineer wants (temps, grip, wear), as well as deformation of the tire. None of that changes the accuracy of what I said.

No offense, but I'm not going to touch your statement that "compliance is limited by COG". Your statements about CG height and swaybars are kind of missing what I was saying. It's more than I want to address right now.

At the end of the day, if you want so hotly to believe that body roll is a good thing for handling and somehow adds grip, that's fine by me. It doesn't really matter what you or I believe, so let's just agree here to disagree.

Originally Posted by totopo (Post 2384996)

The post you linked has tons of incorrect assumptions. We can redo it in say a miata. The miatas cog is like 18.something inches. Lets just say 19. Roll centers of cars are usually 2-4" beliw the cog, lets say 3". Lets say a sprung mass of 2000lbs. as the miatas ground clearance is less than 5" lets say it compresses a ton, say 3.5 and extends 3.5 for a total of 7" over a front track of 59". This gives a roll angle of 6.8 degrees. Over a roll moment of 3" that would move about 12 lbs of mass. If you more than halved the roll angle to 3 degrees, you lessen it to 5.3 lbs. So that 7lbs is pretty insignificant ( the lowering of the cg by rolling that small amount Is good for ~2lb less weight shift too haha) and why most people generally ignore it when the units for weight transfer are more in the 500-1000 lb range.