shifting from 1st to 2nd
 

This if my first time really driving a stick, so I'm wondering if this is me or if its the car.

Basically everytime I from 1st gear to 2nd gear, my car jerks pretty harshily, I can prevernt the jerking if I roll off the clutch and add gas very slowly, but then I lose a lot speed.

Is it possible to go from 1st to 2nd smoothly while still quickly accelerating? or is the jerking motion normal? I don't have any issues while changing from other gears. I'm watching all these old sedans dust me at the red lights because I don't feel like going full throttle to accelerate and jerking my car like crazy.

Release the accelerator completely when switching gears.

Release Acc. Hold clutch down completely, shift, Accelerate

That jerking is the result of the engine spinning faster than the transmission. The clutch is the disc that connects the engine to the transmission. When you press in the clutch pedal, you are disengaging the transmission from the engine. This is why you can accelerate with the clutch pressed in, and not go anywhere. Try to visualize it in your head, it makes the whole learning process easier IMO.

When you roll of the clutch, you are smoothing out the engagement of the transmission to the engine.

When you're learning manual, just relax and take it easy. Don't try and shift fast if you're just learning because you'll just hurt the car. Get used to it first and get that muscle memory.

Once you get the muscle memory, you'll be able to shift a lot quicker, and not have any jerk at the same time.

Trust me... I almost killed myself a couple times learning manual in a 426hp camaro.

The other key is to rev match.

Try to get your engine revs to match how fast the transmission is going. Too much and the car wil jump. To little and you'll lug the engine.

It's possible to change without clutch if you rev match properly.

This is a great technique for new drivers to learn their clutch/flywheel better.

Don't force it in gear (!!!!1) but lift off the gas and bump it up from 1st into neutral, and very gently push the stick towards 2nd. Modulate revs gently until you feel it start to slip in and you'll find where you should have had the engine for the change.

I would not advise that for a new driver... I can do it, but I already know how to. If you're putting pressure on the next gear, you're working the synchro pretty hard. Also, if you get it wrong, you will be welcomed with a harsh crunch.

OP, work on releasing the clutch at the right time, when the revs drop to the point where they will be in the next gear. This may be quicker or slower than what you are doing currently.

Please don't try this until you get really comfortable. Too many things can go wrong if you don't know what you're doing :(

I'm going to guess you're going through what I did when I was first learning stick. I learned stick only after driving an automatic for a long time.

You're at a stop light. You're a stick noob. You don't want people to know you're a noob and embarrass yourself, especially in a nice car. You want to get off the line and accelerate just as fast and as smoothly as the other cars, so as not to show off your noobness. So the light turns green, you slowly start rolling in first, and you see the other cars around... they're all flying by because you spent so much time starting from a stop. Now you want to accelerate and move with the flow of traffic, and after you've accelerated some, you want to shift to 2nd. But you still have in your mind that you need to go faster and keep up with the other cars. You make the shift, and it's terrible. But somehow all the other gears afterwards feel easier.

What I commonly did was not release the gas all the way because my natural inclination to go faster is not to release the gas. I got so caught up in trying to keep up with other cars that I would alter my shifting behavior, which was not good. I eventually learned on my own what I was doing, but if I could do it again, I would've spent more time focusing on doing it right than doing it fast. Honestly, the speed will come naturally after learning it the right way. 1-2 shift is not that different from other shifts if done correctly. It's just in your head that it's different.

It's you.

All that you can really do is just keep practicing the 1-2 shift to smooth out your shifting technique to get rid of the problem.

Awesome! thanks for all the responses. I was glad it was me and not the car, at least this way I can fix that and still say I haven't found any issues with the car yet haha.

If you want to be sure, find someone else who is pretty good with stick and see if they can do it. Obviously everyone has to adjust to a different car since not all sticks are exactly the same, but anyone who really knows how to drive stick will adjust to it in no time.

Wow, breaking in a new clutch while learning stick. You guys got balls.

this is my first manual car to learn on, and what he said is exactly what was going through my head. I was afraid that im not accelerate fast enough on a start, and tend to stalled the car because of my mind playing trick on me. Now I just take my time to slowly release the clutch and push in gas.

The 1-2 shift is typically the most difficult shift on almost every car, one thing that may help is finding a safe spot where you can watch your tach as you release the clutch. If the needle drops suddenly, you need to release the throttle more as you shift. If the needle jumps up, you may want to leave your food gently resting on the gas as you shift to slow the drop in revs.

Welcome to the world of endless fun (or pain) with manual trans. As many people mentioned, it's all about rev matching. ( I personally think a perfect shift happens when you are not only matching the rpm (first derivative of engine rev ), but also matches the rpm change rate ( second derivative of engine rev ). Hah...

After you are good with 1-2, 2-3 upshift, you can try 4-3, and 3-2 down shift with blipping the gas paddle. Then try to brake when you do all of these. Have fun!

You need to work on on letting the clutch out at the right rate. Focus on that. Learn the engagement point and right speed at which to release the clutch to avoid that lash. Some RPM points are natural shift points and easier to make smooth as well. The smoothest engagement speed will vary depending on shift point. Don't bother trying to rev match for an upshift.

1 to 2 is the biggest issue because 2nd is a pretty tall gear and makes the engine speed drop difficult to compensate for.

Driving manual for years, my 1-2 regardless of pace is perfectly smooth but how I work the clutch and gas changes depending on how quickly I want to accelerate. That means it's you, not the car, and something you can learn. Drive often without the radio on. Listen to the car. Don't eye the tach, know the feel of the engine. It won't take long. You'll get it.


I just noticed you live in Queens, same here. Where'd you score your FR-S?

don't ride the clutch too much now.. you and everyone else will certainly smell it.

Wow! im impressed you purchased the car in MT i agree with all posts, except learning to shift w/out clutch. learn the basics before attempting that... i have done it a few times, but it scares the shit out of me... im expecting that teeth gripping crunch as i lower into second :|

I found when learning manual, everyones physical advice was useless. understanding what is happening to the clutch plates when you release the clutch helped alot. but the most important thing i felt when learning manual was that, on a flat road, you dont even need to push the accelerator to go forward, just slowly release the clutch till you start to move. and when you are moving, you cant stall. Once i felt that point in which the clutch was half engaged, half not. everything started to make sense.

Then like most things, practice makes perfect :)

You will get it. Practice makes perfect, and there are some great recommendations in this thread.

He might also have the same issue I think mine has. In noticing a sometimes notchy shift into second. I've been driving MT for 14 years, so it's not a learning issue. Sometimes it shifts normally. Others I hear a nice loud notchy shift.

I've also noticed a lot of noise if you depress the clutch and leave it in gear and coast the car. The synchros or gears are still spinning pretty loudly, which hasn't been the case on any other car I've driven.

It's not nearly as bad as it used to be. Worst case scenario, you'll be able to smell before any serious damage is done.

Try shifting into 2nd right away. Use the shift indicator arrow and your shift should be smooth. Don't worry about those around you and go slow.

So ignore my post, I drove it this morning and it was a-okay. No clue! Maybe just breaking in?

FWIW I still hear the gear slop when the car is in gear in 1st/2nd and the clutch is depressed and you're coasting though. I don't like that noise...

I am in the process of learning stick. And I have exactly the same problem.
My own BRZ has about 20k when I got it, and I jerk the first 2 gears if I release the clutch at the wrong time. Its been annoying for my passengers.

However, the other day I was helping out a friend to get his used BRZ. The car has about 40k on it. Interestingly, shifting from N to 1st to 2nd was very smooth with no jerk at all. This had me worried for a while because I thought my transmission is the problem for the jerkiness. Or could it be the clutch on that car is wore out so it has less friction to bite therefore more smooth?

It's definitely and operator problem!

Unless it's grinding, your transmission is fine. These things shift pretty stiff right off the lot and loosen up over time. Your friend's machine is probably just worn in more than yours, maybe to the point of being a little sloppy and therefore more forgiving. That stiffness actually helps train you to be a better driver.

A couple of thoughts:

With 20K miles, I would have expected the clutch to have worn in pretty good by now. Was the clutch replaced before you got it? Maybe it's biting harder than your friend's clutch because it's new.

Also, there is/was a fad on here of people fucking with the clutch pedal height adjustment, imagining all sorts of benefits that may or may not actually exist. For a while people were selling it as the magic cure-all for everything "wrong" with the way this car shifted. Is it possible that either your clutch pedal or your friend's pedal has been messed with? Maybe yours is biting in the wrong place for your driving style, making it harder for you to shift smoothly. You might sit in each and compare where the clutch starts to engage to see if there's any difference.

If your car is broken in ... don't baby the shift. The drive ratio is so short between 1-2. I like to rev it pass 4500 and then quickly shift to 2nd and rev it again. The car likes high revs. Can't baby it. Of course ... this in the scenario if I want to get moving quickly.

Normal speeds .... smooth gas and clutch. It will come easier with time and practice.

Those gears are to get you moving, so they are pretty stout. You just need practice. If you noticed, its easier to start in second off the light, but I wouldn't recommend it. Some do it but I don't myself. I will use second the most I can in traffic unless I come to complete stop.

Kudos for you on the stick, you'll enjoy the hell out of it in that little car

The gearbox in our car is just really notchy in general.

Practice for about 5hrs of driving or like 300 miles. You'll get it.

If still an issue, check for throw out bearing rattling. If not issue in sound, ask dealer for courtesy clutch, flywheel, tob ...etc check.

practice practice
practice practice
practice practice
practice practice
practice practice
practice practice

Yes.

2 methods.

1. Shift over 3K. The 1-2 shift is easier at higher RPMs. So you will be focusing less on trying to get it into gear and better modulating your revs as you wait for them to fall and match 2nd gear.

2. Slip the clutch. The instant you hear it thunk into gear lift your foot to the engagement point, you will probably feel a little tug because the engine speed is higher and that force is then being put to the wheels. At the same time you need to roll onto the throttle so that you match or increase the rate of the forward motion caused by slipping the clutch. You can then dump the clutch while you are depressing the throttle and carry on about your business. This makes for smooth and fast shifts into 2nd. Not good for your clutch, but honesty, it is a wear item ;P

Im having the same problem as OP. It's not my first manual and my daily is a manual.

Contrary to what many have said, I find it shifts smoother (without the jerk) at lower RPMS such as 1,500 to 2000. Odd, I know!

If i want to be smooth at RPMS higher than 2000, I have to let clutch out very slowly and roll on the gas sooner to compensate for drops in RPM.

In my Miata: Clutch in, shift into gear, clutch out COMPLETeLY, THEN get on gas.

In my 86: Clutch in, shift into gear, start letting clutch out slowly WHILE getting on gas.

Yep I prefer the miata tranny ANY day.

Wow just noticed this thread on the front page and still going after 3 years since I've first posted it haha. Thanks for all the help and I can safely say I can get it to from 1st to 2nd without a hitch now. It's weird tho. I can heel-toe flying into a corner or rev-match and downshift while doing 60 on a highway, but I still mess up going from 1st to 2nd every once in a while.

I realize OP is resolved - congratulations :)
Thought I'd add my comments for others who might come along with same question and see this thread.

I drove a stick growing up in the flat farmlands of mid Ohio. Ten years later, me and manual shift Betsy (pos Ford Escort) moved to the lovely hills of San Francisco. Felt like a noob all over again.

Here's my tip for new manual transmission drivers. Learn how to ride the clutch. When you can sit rock still in 1st on a 45 degree uphill using nothing but clutch and gas you'll feel like a fearless master.

New clutches will grip and "bite hard" when they engage. This fades with the miles as clutch wears. But it is intimidating on top of everything else for new pilots.

After have a little practice in a flat parking lot...

Find an empty parking garage.
.. Preferably with no cars or pillars to hit or absent walls where you might plummet straight to heaven.
.. Also, you can turn into a parking space if become overwhelmed.

Start at bottom of a ramp.
Put it in first.
Give a small but steady amount of gas.
.. On Fr-s like 1-2k revs... Steady. Clutch still in.

Let the clutch out until you feel it about to grip.
As the car rolls forward (and upward) ease off and ease on the clutch learning right where it begins to engage and where it is fully engaged.

As it engages, revs will drop as engine takes the load. At first, keep gas steady but push in the clutch to tease the engagement point.

Once you get the hang of it, ease off (clutch out) a bit more as you give it a bit more gas to counter the load and you're fully in first gear.

When you're feeling confident, aim to sit still, on the incline (as if at a stop light), with shifter in first gear, using only clutch and accelerator.

Just feather the clutch around the engagement point. Steady low revs. Ease on. Ease off. Until you are just sitting still balancing the clutch with the drive train.

It's a "feel" thing.
You will suddenly just know, in the seat of your pants, just how your mistress likes to be touched and handled.

You were doing OK, till your last sentence, which you got all twisted up.

The idea is for your mistress to know how YOU like to be touched and handled ...... :popcorn:


humfrz

:grin: