Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB
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Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/index.php)
-   Forced Induction (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=78)
-   -   Cosworth Stage 2 Install w/Dyno, Pics, Videos, Impressions (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85485)

Swede 08-24-2015 12:53 PM
When its time my wife will get our Audi A6 Allroad and ill get a GT86 /BRZ and probably get the Cosworth stage 3 to it.

Maybe a stupid question but….do i need the stage 1 and 2 before getting the stage 3 or can i just get the stage 3 and fit it in?

weederr33 08-24-2015 12:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajc209 (Post 2367646)
The clutch will need an upgrade for anything more than 280HP i'd say.

What do you mean sit around 320hp but top out at 380hp? do you mean different 3.x stages?
http://www.topgear.com/car-news/modi...hp-toyota-gt86

That article mentions it. Though, I haven't heard anything else since. But since the other kits have a 1.x or 2.x I'd assume the 3.x would be a possibility.

weederr33 08-24-2015 12:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swede (Post 2367685)
When its time my wife will get our Audi A6 Allroad and ill get a GT86 /BRZ and probably get the Cosworth stage 3 to it.

Maybe a stupid question but….do i need the stage 1 and 2 before getting the stage 3 or can i just get the stage 3 and fit it in?
We don't quite know what Stage 3 is but if it's more power, I'd assume you'd need Stage 2.

350matt 08-24-2015 02:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajc209 (Post 2367540)
Perhaps Cosworth should explain why and how they have concluded the rods cant handle more than 280hp. It would show the quality of their R&D abilites and inspire confidence.

Cosworth could do a 310hp (+30hp) pulley kit but not recommended for heavy track use....

I wouldnt be surprised if the stage 2, 280hp was limited a bit to allow for a bit more step up in power for the stage 3.....

I think its time we saw the full 350+ HP stage 3 kit. :drool:
as I understand it they did an full FEA stress analysis on the rod and tested the rod material to provide a strength figure

the analysis tool then runs through a stress test and shows whats hot and whats not and you can predict ( reasonably accurately) when and where the part will fail

perhaps as you say a smaller pulley and shorter belt kit for trackdays only? I'd say any warranty would then go out the window though

weederr33 08-24-2015 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 350matt (Post 2367804)
as I understand it they did an full FEA stress analysis on the rod and tested the rod material to provide a strength figure

the analysis tool then runs through a stress test and shows whats hot and whats not and you can predict ( reasonably accurately) when and where the part will fail

perhaps as you say a smaller pulley and shorter belt kit for trackdays only? I'd say any warranty would then go out the window though
So you think it would be Rods and Pistons? Or just Rods and something else?

Swede 08-24-2015 05:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weederr33 (Post 2367690)
We don't quite know what Stage 3 is but if it's more power, I'd assume you'd need Stage 2.
I was thinking maybe stage 3 is all pre stages included, cause stage 2 is 1+ more if I'm right…

350matt 08-24-2015 06:34 PM
depends on the ratio I suppose
typically with boost you need to drop the compression ratio down a bit as 12.5: 1 is a bit steep for a boosted engine
but I suppose you could just fit decent rods and keep the stock pistons as I'd say they're not too bad

ajc209 08-24-2015 06:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 350matt (Post 2367804)
as I understand it they did an full FEA stress analysis on the rod and tested the rod material to provide a strength figure

the analysis tool then runs through a stress test and shows whats hot and whats not and you can predict ( reasonably accurately) when and where the part will fail

perhaps as you say a smaller pulley and shorter belt kit for trackdays only? I'd say any warranty would then go out the window though
Yes that the sort of thing I think cosworth should be talking about.

Regarding the smaller pulley on the stock block, I'd have thought not recomending it for track days would be best to avoid failures?

What guarantee are we talking about? I'm not aware of any in the uk at least or am I missing something?

Wise 08-24-2015 09:36 PM
What sort of difference in power would be seen between a UEL and EL header used for this setup?

I have a TOmei UEL, but I've heard that for Forced induction an EL Header is preferable. Although don't the EJ WRX's run UELs stock?

If someone could clarify this for me it would be great.

Also too lazy to search for an answer, but what's the max rear wheel HP that someone has achieved with this kit + full exhaust.

weederr33 08-24-2015 09:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wise (Post 2368443)
What sort of difference in power would be seen between a UEL and EL header used for this setup?

I have a TOmei UEL, but I've heard that for Forced induction an EL Header is preferable. Although don't the EJ WRX's run UELs stock?

If someone could clarify this for me it would be great.

Also too lazy to search for an answer, but what's the max rear wheel HP that someone has achieved with this kit + full exhaust.
SEARCH NOOB!


Just kidding. UEL is mostly for the torque, but you already get plenty with a PD supercharger. EL will help with mid or top end power. I feel that's more relevant for this application. Of course, if you think about it, Cosworth chose EL for a particular reason. If you already have Tomei headers, then you'll just get more gurgle and lower torque I suppose.

350matt 08-25-2015 03:49 AM
I don't think I've seen any different installations between UEL and EL on this charger - I only imagine its not much, 5 or 6 bhp at the top end - the shape of the torque curve will differ by more than this though

as for the max RWHP I think its 256 on 93 octane and the full exhaust

philooo 08-26-2015 09:43 AM
how come the cosworth supercharger is not offering more power ? I mean jackson racing is making 370hp with fuel pump and injectors ...

it is time for cosworth to wake up and offer a more aggressive setup.

ajc209 08-26-2015 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by philooo (Post 2370172)
how come the cosworth supercharger is not offering more power ? I mean jackson racing is making 370hp with fuel pump and injectors ...

it is time for cosworth to wake up and offer a more aggressive setup.
Thats true, but if they dont think the stock internals can reliably handle that power long term, they risk tarnishing their reputation if failures happen.

I suppose they could offer the stage 3 kit and a bottom end separately (recomending the bottom end for more power that stage 2) and let people decide if they want to risk more power on stock internals?

350matt 08-26-2015 01:34 PM
agreed
get the pulley kit out there with a 'best of luck' and let people tune away, stock rods or not
I'd predict a bent stock rod or 2 are part of the learning process


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