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-   Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=39)
-   -   Basically zero toe... (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77687)

iaclimber4 11-15-2014 11:49 AM

Basically zero toe...
 
So i got an alignment, since i haven't had one done since i bought the car 2 years ago. The front toe .01 and .02 L/R.

The rear is .07 and .1, so toed out. I've read that most autocrossers prefer a toe-in in the rear. My question is is the rear to essentially zero rear toe? or would it be better to zero and possibly get it toed in a bit.

Use: street with ~monthly autocrossing.

Thanks

EDIT: NM figured it out, toed in just a touch, feels better....

renfield90 11-16-2014 03:56 PM

Find a different alignment shop next time. .01/.02 in the front is a little sloppy, they should be able to hit 0. If you know any local autocrossers they can probably point you in the right direction.

plucas 11-16-2014 04:11 PM

Toe-in on the rear is good. It gives the car stability under braking.

CSG Mike 11-16-2014 07:24 PM

Nothing wrong with 0 toe if you can handle it.

DarkSunrise 11-16-2014 09:22 PM

I tried 0 toe on basically stock suspension for my last track weekend. I'm also running slightly more front camber than rear:

Front: -1.4L, -1.5R
Rear: -1.0L, -1.4R

The balance felt good. I still got some understeer, but at least it's pretty stable on turn-in and trail-braking, and you can provoke the rear under power.

CSG Mike 11-16-2014 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise (Post 2024606)
I tried 0 toe on basically stock suspension for my last track weekend. I'm also running slightly more front camber than rear:

Front: -1.4L, -1.5R
Rear: -1.0L, -1.4R

The balance felt good. I still got some understeer, but at least it's pretty stable on turn-in and trail-braking, and you can provoke the rear under power.

Exactly how it should be.

Get some more front camber!

DarkSunrise 11-17-2014 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 2024674)
Exactly how it should be.

Get some more front camber!

Haha I know. Working on it. There's not much clearance at the strut, so I may need camber plates or coilovers. :(

mla163 11-17-2014 09:53 AM

It's a little hard to get super precise on an alignment rack. It may read at 0.0000" toe, but there is enough play in suspension bushings, etc that you might be good for 0.0x" toe. Same with camber.

Measure with a ruler, mark with chalk, cut with an axe.

renfield90 11-17-2014 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mla163 (Post 2024926)
It's a little hard to get super precise on an alignment rack. It may read at 0.0000" toe, but there is enough play in suspension bushings, etc that you might be good for 0.0x" toe. Same with camber.

Measure with a ruler, mark with chalk, cut with an axe.

If that's the case then it's time to refresh the suspension bushings! I had toe set to 0 on my old car back when it was around 160k miles on the clock. It still measured exactly that til the day it died. If it had drifted though, the last thing you want is for it to have a head start on the way to a bad place.

I also feel a shop that will take the time to get exactly 0 is a shop that takes pride in doing it right, and they're a lot less likely to fail in tightening something properly leading to the alignment staying true for longer. Since we're sharing proverbs...an ounce of prevention beats a pound of cure. :)

CSG Mike 11-17-2014 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mla163 (Post 2024926)
It's a little hard to get super precise on an alignment rack. It may read at 0.0000" toe, but there is enough play in suspension bushings, etc that you might be good for 0.0x" toe. Same with camber.

Measure with a ruler, mark with chalk, cut with an axe.

A skilled tech can get it dead on, every time. This is what sets aside someone with a "good enough" mentality and a "perfect" mentality. The amount of time it takes to get "perfect" is the same as "good enough", if the tech is talented and cares enough.

Hoosier Daddy 11-18-2014 01:40 AM

Or you could set the toe like F1 and NASCAR teams do, with string.

http://i.imgur.com/3WXBmc5.jpg

Let's be honest, a second or third significant digit past the decimal isn't so significant...

iaclimber4 11-26-2014 10:05 PM

oh hell, i thought this was a dead thread, didn't realize people posted. thanks!

So i ran it the other sunday at an autocross event that was on a track. Even with minimal toe-in on the rear, the car felt better than it ever has. Really planted and much less oversteer. Still a little bit of oversteer on the sweepers, but under slight power. Actually thinking about increasing the stiffness of the front sway (20mm whiteline). I've only been autocrossing about a year, so wanted to play around with the settings now that i have a little bit of seat time...


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