So... about those headrests
 

Let me start off by stating: I'm not pimp. Neither am I dope, nor fly, nor crunk. I may have cruised once upon a time, but I certainly do not roll. Therefore, my driving position has all the cool-factor of black socks with khaki shorts: back nearly vertical (maybe 80 to 85 degrees from the seat bottom); hands at ten and two on the wheel; and distanced from the pedals so that I can mash the clutch all the way down without having to tip-toe it, but not too close either. It may not look cool, but it's how owner's manuals and books on racing have suggested you sit for many, many years now (there's a reason Recaro and Bride buckets are shaped the way they are).

So why is it that when I adjust my seat to that position in my new car, the headrest forces me to stare at my crotch while seated?

It's a rhetorical question. I know why they do it: it supposedly reduces whiplash injuries... injuries that wouldn't be an issue if people were riding with their seat and headrests in the correct position to begin with. Now, thanks to these erroneously mandated abominations, it is impossible for me to find a seating position in my new car that's anything less than "excruciating". I know too that half the population likes the new design, but half the population hates it; if you're in the first group, I don't need to hear from you. Congratulations on not having to modify your car to be able to drive more than 10 minutes at a time in it.

Where was I going with this? Oh yeah... QUESTION!!! Does anybody have experience bending the posts on the headrests, so that the angle is less severe? I'm going to try and find an upholstery shop or body shop that can do it for me, but if I can't I'd like to give it a try myself. Or, does anybody know of any other solutions for fixing this "safety" feature (besides turning the headrest around, which is both tacky and dangerous?)

I never thought I'd be looking at Bride buckets to improve commuting comfort in a car. :mad0260:

Most entertaining post yet. I would recommend aftermarket buckets, such as Bride. I wouldn't risk bending the metal post just for the sake of "what ifs" good luck!

Bride seats are amazing. Do it.

Heh... glad you're amused by my humorous lead-in (if you find things such as "excruciating spinal deformation" funny... which, to be fair, I do, when it's not my spine), but I was hoping to keep the stock seats. Bride's are very, very comfy for race-day seats, but I really want to keep that stock side-impact airbag in this car. I'd just like to have side airbags AND not have to have a chiropractor riding shotgun 24/7. (Spoiled, aren't I?)

http://cdn.mkimg.carview.co.jp/carli...3eba114a8d.jpg

http://autobacs-asm.com/blog/recaro/...20DSC_5377.jpg

I wouldn't mind either of these. The recaros do look more comfortable and look like a factory option

checking the owners manual; it states that the top of your ears should be about in line with the middle of the head rest for proper fit and safety. If that is not possible I would suggest flipping the headrest around.

In my seating position, reclined a few more degrees back than you are, I had to raise the headrest up to its maximum height to be comfortable. I am 6'1'' for reference.

Both are good seats. I used to own some Recaros very similar to those, and loved them. And I sat in those exact same Bride's at a Super Autobacs a couple of weeks ago, and mmm... Dirty, dirty thoughts about a seat.

But again, want to keep that side airbag. Real shame: this is the first time I've seen a factory seat that has been as supportive and grippy as an aftermarket race seat... and it's ruined by those damn government-mandated headrests.

What Recaros are those?

Those Recaros look perfect...even have the red stitching. Yes please.


Justin

If I have a ton of $$$ laying around I would buy this. & yes, those seats are for 86/FR-S
http://www.tune86.com/sites/default/...gt_86_20_0.jpg

Recaro SR-6. GoTuning.com lists the "ASM" version in special trims/colors:

http://autobacs-asm.jp/recaro/newseat_img2/150.jpg http://autobacs-asm.jp/recaro/newseat_img2/162.jpg
http://autobacs-asm.jp/recaro/newseat_img2/151.jpg http://autobacs-asm.jp/recaro/newseat_img2/161.jpg

This post p=224440&postcount=2 indicates the ASM branded stuff is over priced and suggests you get the standard Recaro. Which, in my experience, is never a bad idea. :)

The TRD seats would be a lot better without that big red stripe down the middle.

If any company can manufacture a quality replacement head rest, I'll buy a pair straight away.

Not saying I'm going to go this route, but let's assume for one moment I did decide to put in a Bride Stradia seat, in black w/ red stitching, on the driver's side, thus giving up my side-airbag protection and putting myself at risk of legal and insurance difficulties for purposefully removing a safety device in an automobile. Let's assume I'm okay with all of that.

Has anybody yet figured out the proper resistor to use to trick the car into thinking that airbag is still there? I don't want to put up with error lights on my dash, nor the possibility that none of my other airbags would work (something which was is apparently a real concern on some other cars, as when the system detects a problem with one airbag it shuts them all down).

Better yet, pretty seats and spam-bots aside... has anybody had any experience getting the headrests on an 09 and newer car bent into a proper position?

Sort of. I had an upholsterer modify the head rests on my current daily (also a Subaru) due to a similar stupid design.

I think I'd rather get some made from scratch this time. First set would be expensive, but that's the benefit of a network of owners.

I'll second the "amusing post" opinion above and add -- would better-shaped headrests from another Subaru or Toyota model fit, and if so, are they reasonably priced?

I'm worried that it will be even worse when I try to wear a helmet.

a company needs to come up with an after market head rest and only a head rest that doesnt go so far forward.

i know newer STI's have the same issue and i would assume WRX's do too

Wow....those are expensive.

Well, the problem is that all new cars built after 09 have this exact same problem. Believe it or not, experts who spent too much time in the lab and not enough time in the field believe this is a "safety feature." Don't know how it's supposed to be safer when I'm spending more time trying to massage my shoulder, crack my neck, and basically self-chiropracting... all while watching traffic and driving stick. :mad0260:

This car isn't the worst offender: Ford's seem to be purpose built to destroy your spine. But on the FR-S, the combination of extreme headrest angle plus the overall tightness of a racing-style seat... it's impossible for me to find a comfortable driving position. (And before people start suggesting this, no, leaning the seat further back doesn't help, not when you've got minor neck and shoulder problems to start with.) My only real solutions are A) modify or replace the bloody headrests, or B) get all new seats. I really don't want to go with option B, but I honestly can't drive this car for more than 10 minutes at a time, without wanting to get out of it.

Hey Grimmspeed, any chance you guys would want to fabricate new mounting posts? :help:

I agree with your concern very much. During a test drive my wife commented that the headrests are very awkwardly positioned forward. I decided to stop worrying for now, until I get a car. I am afraid I'll have the same issue as you do, I like to sit up straight. I'll give a try to evaluate the problem when I get the car myself, but I think the chances of me liking them are not too high.

Option C- just remove the headrest and call it done!

Were you able to try the headrest flip that was suggested earlier? I don't have an FRS yet but that trick works like a charm in my Mazdaspeed 3, though I suppose you'll be sacrificing a bit of safety by doing that.

That is what we call, a bad idea. Somebody bumps you from behind at anything over 10 mph, and the best you could hope for is paralysis.

Yup, problem solved... till he gets rear ended...

Maybe it has something to do with height? I'm only 5' 7 and with the seats a little bit leaned back (100° from floor, max) the headrest perfectly touches the back of my head. First car I've ever owned where the headrest actually rested my head.

OK option C is a bad idea.

Like those recaros.

Does anyone know what the stock chair weighs?

I honestly think it's a body shape thing, rather than a height issue. I know some people think the new style seats are just fine, if not better; but do a Google search for "headrest" sometime. There's a LOT of people out there who can't find a comfortable seating position with these mandated headrests, and their height range from 5' to 7'. For me, it's just painfully uncomfortable to either not rest my back and shoulders against the seat (putting all my weight on my head, and thus neck), or to ride with my head tilted forward all the time. I don't even recline the seats on airplanes, because I can't stand that sort of position.

Mazdaspeed: yeah, I gave it a try (it's free, easy, and reversible... so why not?) While marginally safer than removing them altogether, it would still leave a lot of room for collisions to do bad things to your neck. Though I have to admit, with these seat's shape, they didn't look quite as goofy as I was expecting. So... maybe an acceptable risk trade-off for others, but I think I'm going to keep looking for a better solution. Personally, I'd rather have the tradeoff of losing my side airbags by installing Recaros, than risk neck injury due to rear-ending. For where I live now, the latter is far, FAR more likely. :(

My 16 year old son got his license this year through AAA and they teach the hands to be at 9 and 3 now.

Please send him to Street Survival. www.streetsurvival.org

UPDATE: $%*$%#ing @#$*& of &@!# government!!! AAAAGH!!! :mad0260::paddle:

So after calling around to a few places in Vegas, including one very good body shop I've used in the past... NOBODY will touch modifying the headrest on a new car. Because it's labeled as a "safety system" (and yes, I will continue to use sarcastic quotes around that phrase), they won't modify them for fear of violating the law, or exposure to lawsuits.

So, let's recap. Car purpose built for driving fun, as the successor to the venerable AE86, that I've waited five years for... undone by one STUPID piece of foam and fabric. <beating... head... on... desk...>

Well, if I gotta violate the law to be able to drive my car comfortably, might as well go big or go home. Who's got the proper airbag-system-tricking resistor identified for those aftermarket seats? I think I need me some Brides.

Interesting. Wonder what the rationale is for the change after all these years? Wonder if it has to do with traditional manuals going away and flappy-paddles replacing them?

Bio-mechanics. Hands at 9 & 3 lets you rotate the steering wheel slightly more without having to move your hands from the wheel.

Airbags. 10+2 brings the forearms closer to the path of the airbag. 9+3 keep the hands and arm from any possible interference with the airbag's deployment.

The same is true of this whole thread, until those Brides or Recaros come with side airbags that work with BRZ/FR-S. Otherwise a regular t-bone on the street will have you hoping for paralysis.

P.S. I have zero issues with current headrest, unless I'm wearing a helmet.

True for racing, and driving safety. Bumps in the road also affect your driving direction less with hands on opposite sides of the wheel. One of my pet peeves is people that drive without their hands on on opposite sides of the wheel for on-ramps, curves, etc. (of course, while cruising straight I usually just have one hand on the bottom of the wheel... ;))

Bingo. This is the 'official' reason, though the above quote is more important for active safety purposes. One hand at the top of the wheel is the most dangerous for airbag purposes.

As for the headrest... I miss the day of easily adjustable ratcheting-type headrests on cars.

-Charlie

Not gonna happen.

Did you just not drive before side airbags? Subarus are insanely safe, even without the side airbags.

I've had many friends remove bumper beams (front AND rear), factory seats with airbags, front airbags, etc. and never have a problem with insurance for their cars (after totaling cars, etc.)... but of course, that's not an endorsement of that activity. (full disclosure: I removed the side airbags from my WRX when I went to JDM seats)

-Charlie

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks for chiming in with that!

So, what... your helpful solution is that we should all just be you, dsgerbc? Stated right there in the opening post: if you're comfortable with the new style seats, I'm happy, but this thread isn't for you.

As for Brides or Recaros not being as safe as stock seats, you're absolutely correct about that. If you'd read the entire post, you'd see that's why I've been trying my hardest to find a solution to fixing the stock seats, rather than going aftermarket. But something has to change, because that theoretical safety is doing me no good when I can't drive the car for more than 10 minutes without getting distracted by neck pain (and driver distraction is far and away the number one biggest cause of accidents).

Personally, I feel the risk of side-impact is lower where I live than rear-ending, so if I have to give up some safety design safety to be able to drive this car, I'd rather it be side airbags than a proper head restraint for my seating position. Next time, read before responding.

Or, they made a calculated risk. Just because you don't agree with their level of acceptable risk doesn't make them or you stupid.

OP, with my impreza, which has headrests that conform to today's standards, I found raising the headrest all the way helped a little.

This vid said lil less than 20kg... 19.4kg to be technical
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGWXSqiLHXU"]ホット�ージョン Vol.116 (Hot-Version Vol.116) - YouTube[/ame]

Thanks for posting that, ichitaka! I've got to be one of the only people... ever... to consider putting Recaros or Brides in a car not for the bling factor or perceived performance gains, but to actually improve comfort, LOL... :D

Do wonder how much longer, though, before the Japanese government starts regulating aftermarket seats for cars, the way they do wheels? I won't lie: I would pay buckets of money to get a Recaro SR 7 with side-impact airbags installed. (But only if they don't have the same damn head-rest problems.)