Professional detail excectations
 

I recently had my....wait for it... Hot Lava FR-S professionally detailed. I bought the car right after a snow event then immediately scratched the hell out of it the first time I washed it. So, hoping to repair the damage, I had the car detailed at a high end detail shop. Now that the sun is out again I can still see scratches. Some are fine and others a little heavier and obviously the result of my previously mentioned damage. Without sunlight no scratches are evident.

I took the car back to the detailer. They offered to give it a second go. So my question to you all is this. Am I an A-hole for expecting a scratch free finish from a $ 200 detail OR is my concern justified? I hate that customer is always right attitude they displayed because I couldn't get a straight answer from them. Therefore the justification for asking the question on this forum since I'm more than certain I'll get a straight up no B.S. answer from this crowd so fire away.

It all depends on what they do for $200. If that includes scratch removal, to what degree to they guarantee? If it was for a wash, clay bar, and wax then it wouldn't be to the level of scratch removal. Also if the detail shop is a "high end" shop as in they typically do cars that are 45k+, then you paid a premium because they get that from owners of those cars who won't bother to do the work themselves.

I think you are probably expecting too much to be honest.

For that price I personally would expect maybe a 90% job, "good enough for a DD not a show car"

You seem to not know how many hours it takes to get paint 100%, it can take dozens. Now think about labor rate. Then factor in product cost. Now think about what you should expect from $200.

The detailer should have spoke to you about expectations before you guys agreed on the work.

What you are looking for is a paint/color correction. What you paid for, is for someone to temporarily hide the damage using fillers and glazes.

DO NOT ever take the car to a commercial detailer. They will not know (or assume) what a paint correction is, all they tend to do is regular polishing. If they ever give you a price unseen, they are not removing anything (scratches). They are only covering imperfections up.

If the damage is not deep, expect a correction time of about 8-10 hours at an average of $50 an hour. It can always be less or a bit more.

I just paid $300 to have a few light swirls taken out of mine and the paint sealed (plus a full clean, etc. of course). If you had obvious scratches, I would expect a correction to be more like $500ish.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

Consider getting some type of paint protection like Opti-Coat. It will help to prevent you getting more paint swirls in the future.

OP, if you need any recommendations for a good detailer in your area who can properly perform paint correction, just let me know and I'll see if I can find someone for you. IMO, as others have said, you're probably looking at $400 - $500+ to take care of those deeper scratches, depending on the level of perfection you're looking for, what a paint correction specialist in your area charges, etc.

Also, keep in mind there is only so much clear coat to work with, so some deeper scratches may not be able to be safely removed.

Wow, thanks everybody and especially you Richard. Since it is your business I value your educated opinion. With this lesson learned I can see now it was I who should have asked the detail shop beforehand as to what to expect. I think the thing to do now is show back up with hat in hand and cancel my appointment.

$200 sounds way too cheap. Its usually $300 plus for the most basic job

where are you at? I can help you out if you live by me.
like others have said, $200 is too cheap.
even prepping for a paint correction takes a long time

Why not invest the $200 into a porter cable and polishes. Its so EASY to paint correct im just blown away how you guys spend $400-$500

Pros:
You learn how to paint correct (for future use)
You save money
You can teach yourself with a DA machine

Cons:
You risk spending $400+ on some cheap skate to steal your money with fillers!

Certainly a good skill to learn, but probably not a good idea to throw someone out there with a powered buffer and no previous experience.

Doing it by hand offers some forgiveness, but with a buffer it is quite easy to burn through corners if you don't know what you're doing.

Really ??? I didn't know it was so EASY . Been doing correction since 2005 and learn something new all the time about technique or products. Getting the basics down may be easy but to detail at a professional level takes years and tons of actual on the job experience. Knowing the limits of what can and can not be accomplished in terms of paint correction is only the beginning. The difference in skill between the cheap detailer and the experienced pro is what you are paying for. Now just because someone has a shop IMO doesn't make them a pro. There are many home detailers putting out professional grade work. Are there dishonest detailers out there that will use fillers to cover up defects and grab your money ? There sure are so do your research as you would any time you spend your hard earned cash. The detailer that the OP took his car to should have asked him what were his expectations. If show car results were expected then the detailer could have explained the work involved and cost. Also explaining that maintaining a daily driver at that level is time consuming and expensive. Some times you have to be realistic in what you expect.

We're lucky to have someone like this on here, don't know the guy but I'd trust him.

did you miss the part were i said teach your self how to paint correct?????

How are you still learning to detail with almost 10 years experience SMH....

You can not paint correct by hand GTFO!

I taught myself how to paint correct in days with a DA polisher. I now us a rotary on most of my work with out causing a single hologram!

Ok :)

Can we practice on your Z?

You can definitely get good results polishing by hand - it would just take a lot more time and effort to do an entire car. There are often areas on cars that I detail where a machine polisher will not polish effectively (door handles, narrow and sunk-in pillars), or if I do use a machine polisher, it could level paint where I don't want it to (on an edge or corner).

For a $200 exterior detail from a decent detailer, you can get a good cleaning, clay/decontamination, and wax/sealant, but you should not expect any paint correction that will bring your paint condition up to around the 80%+ range.

Lets do it lol

I'm in Portland Oregon but thanks for the offer.

This term "paint correction" is new to me. Curious as to what it means. Will it remove the orange peel evident in the stock paint? The guys at the shop said it would cost $ 2000 to fix the orange peel. I'm definitely not going there so I will have to live with it.

The detailing industry has changed at a fast pace especially in the last few years. New products and tools are coming out faster then ever before. If you haven't changed your technique in the last few years you are living in the past. Micro fiber pads , carpro orange peel removal pads ,long stroke da machines , nano coatings and sealants , carbon based trim dressings , clay towels are but a few of the things that have came down the pike in the last few years. These changes allow us to work smarter , not harder.My customers have ranged from mom and pop soccer vans to a third place overall at Pebble Beach. So yes I'm still learning. Paints are changing with the use of water based products , ceramic clears , self healing paint etc.
So can a newb go to Harbor Freight and pick up a da for swirl removal ? yep. Will his investment be limited to $200.00 bucks ? Maybe. Will it look as good as a pro shop puts out ? With enough experience eventually. Does the original poster sound like he wants to invest that much time and money ? Probably not IMO. So keep sweating away with your rotary and have a great day. I'll save my rotary and wool pads for dri-foaming cloth interiors.

you may need something more aggressive like a rotary to fix orange peel. Especially to cut down on time

Have you ever used a CarPro orange peel pad ?

http://www.carpro-us.com/daily-deals...l-removal-pad/

I have wet sanded many cars by hand and machine. Sometimes you have too use the proper tool for the job. it's not a one size fits all.

My techniques have not changed and im still producing superior results.

I just think its so funny some of these detailers charge $400 for 8 hours of work. I dont even let mechanics touch my motor, what makes you think im going to pay someone $400 to screw up my paint.

With a 21mm stroke Rupes bigfoot and trizact papers I have no need to drag out my Makita 9227.

Id never recommend a Novice Detailer to use this product ever!

To start with the OP was talking complete defect removal and I would do a two or three step correction that would be longer then 8 hrs. My rate is closer to $60.00 per hour. If one does their research then a competent detailer could be selected and there would be no screw up. If you cannot trust anyone that your business but the OP was discussing his experience . Your solution to just do it himself and expect pro results right off the bat are unrealistic. As for the results you claim , that your opinion.

I didn't recommend this to him. I asked if you had ever used it. You are the one that brought up using the rotary for orange peel removal.

Dude what im saying is for the amount you detailers charge, the OP can simply pick up a DA polisher and product for way less and do the work himself and guess what he learns a trade.

Ive seen way to many nightmares with detailers to full trust someone with my paint. I detail on the side and have been doing it for years.

Yes new products are coming out and the market is getting flooded, let me guess your the kind of guy that buys "NEW FORMULA" products right away.....

I personally use the ATD rotary to cut down on time. I rarely use my PC anymore.

In my business time is money and I do the best I can to not waste it. Have you ever tried a 21mm stroke da ? I also gave up the flavor of the month club years ago.

No never tried a 21mm stroke. Never really needed to purchase another machine...

How do you make recommendations of one item over another that you have never tried ? That's sort of like saying " No I'm not a detailer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night". When I come on here I limit myself to only the products and procedures that I have actually tried over a period of time. So now I'm headed to bed because I have customers to service first thing in the am. Goodnight

Dude you clearly are still missing my whole point! SMH....

Why would I recommend anything other than a beginner product.

You make absolutely no sense!

I'm making a recommendation to person that has NEVER PAINT CORRECTED BEFORE!

and you come in here talking about 2000 grit buffing pads. dude please stop!

I'm dying to know what you would recommend a Novice detailer.... PLEASE TELL ME!!!!!!

" No I'm not a detailer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night" This makes no sense and is probably the worst analogy ive ever seen!

And why would I buy a 21mm stroke machine when I don't even need one! Dude if you been detailing for 10 years and still trying to master a technique on how to detail then please stop detailing right now!

A fucking 10 year old could use a PC!

One last time. This isn't about what someone would recommend to a beginner. This was claiming all he had to do was purchase a da and save 400 bucks and have a great results. We both know that's not realistic. You have already posted you have a great technique and have nothing left to learn.If that's what you believe then more power to you. I will continue to learn as time goes on. The original poster has read all the replies and I believe he can decide for himself the route he choses to pursue.

As for the products I mentioned in my previous post those were to show you the industry is constantly changing and one that relies on older techniques gets left behind. Not for a novice to run out and purchase right off the bat. I love it when people say you don't need that but have never tried it. Amazing.

How is that not realistic??????

Youtube is full of great videos to teach you how to use the PC. I mean shit even if you managed to screw the paint up when its damn near impossible, you can always fix it!

I clearly said purchase a DA and teach yourself how to use it but shit dude we all know a damn 10 year can use a PC.

Stop trying to make paint correction look like its so difficult when its not!

Everyone details differently and if you havent mastered your specific way dude then your lost!

Some people don't have the time it takes to do it themselves. Hell or even want to take the time it takes. Or have the means (garage) to do it themselves.