Look up fab-worx and you'll find loads.

Essentially he finds a platform that has a good customer base who needs parts. He takes these parts and sells them quick with horrible quality control and no customer service. When someone finds out he's done this on another platform he makes a disappearance. This has happened to atleast 5 different platforms. I can assume he then realized that continuing to use the same company name wasn't worth the risk. He then decided to make a new company name based solely on that platform because noone would have any relative feedback.

Problem with this is you can't fake your name when it comes to business' like this. Anyone with a computer can figure out he's the same guy.

If you put both products on a CMM machine. I am willing to bet the angle of each bracket, and hole locations are dead on.

We have dealers in Florida that confirmed Fab-Worx copied it 100%

I am the absolute last person to say this. And I am all for the ban-wagon however in complete fairness. People fuck up, people make bas choices and they learn from their mistakes. As much as I am not happy with Toni in this situation for all I know he has changed since those days (unless they are still doing business i didn't check honestly). I can understand the moderation standpoint of the fact he currently has no direct scam relation on this platform and to current date. He just has general "Sketchy" behavior such as @Frs300's car.

I only post this because I posted this thread to be fair, and open as I told many individuals from day #1. I told Toni from the start. Toni called me yesterday and even told me he knew it would come up at some point and that he knows I told him I was posting a review regardless of the outcome good or bad. He said I had forgotten some things and asked that I at least be professional and fair on my post. He then re-read and realized what he felt was fair was already in the post (I haven't edited since he called me mods can verify). This is likely why he hasn't posted and I don't feel he needs to post. This entire thread was fair on both sides. I included the part where he may have made a simple mistake. He knows I wasn't posting this to get my way, or to get paid off but because even at the dyno day I said I plan on posting things about other projects in the open. But this one got in the way of finishing everything else.

In regards to if Toni has tried to help me:
Toni wasn't clear at first but I figured he was trying to do this for this reason. As he suspected there was a chance he could be related to it but I honestly feel he didn't know if he had any relation to the motor dying until I had a talk with him recently. He was originally tying to help me out with at cost / near cost parts to rebuild my car. Hell yesterday he even reiterated this. However my price for the pistons and rods were actually cheaper than his. To some that help may have actually worked out if they were wanting a monster build since they might not have access to parts like I do. I don't think he can get the rest of the parts I need at any price point that actually benefits me at this time. And I don't mean I get free or insane, I am still paying enough to buy a low to mid end S2000 for the amount of money I am forking into the engine & my FI build for this setup. Damn I am broke right now! lol

I understand wholeheartedly that Toni is "trying" to help you which is good. I just want to make sure people have all the facts. People deserve to know the truth so they can make an honest decision when their are so many good vendors/tuners/mechanics on these forums.

As Dave said this is a free market and people will make their own decision. I just want to make sure people know their are consequences to going with cheaper.

Yeah I fully agree that if FABWORX is still around and still replicating and there is evidence... banhammer. But I am trying to be as fair as possible.

However the fact Toni doesn't have coverage for this sort of thing is... sketchy.

Fab-worx was dumped right before he swapped to fa20club.

The coverage thing makes NO SENSE TO ME. Why wouldn't you have insurance for this kind of thing? Someone should chime in.

If the list and history of past companies is correct

Chew and screw

Cool story bro, :D. This is where it should have ended though. I don't know how I can stress this anymore, but EVERYONE WITH FORCED INDUCTION NEEDS A BOOST GAUGE AND A WIDEBAND GAUGE. It isn't a suggestion, it isn't a, "Oh I will add it later", it is a MANDATORY upgrade when going forced induction. This is also what killed @Frs300 's car along with other FA20s.

Gotcha. Given the quality of bends and welds on my FA20Club intake I'm surprised he could copy it so accurately....

Meh, the rinse and repeat will just keep happening.

He was on the Honda tech scammer list prior to 2002 for each one of his aliases at the time.
People don't change if it's worked for him for over a decade.

He was behind the wheel of my car when the engine blew. It sucked because I never got to drive it with the mods, but he covered the new (used) motor and all work associated even though the logs from the dyno runs - and I'm trying to say this with a straight face - "looked good".

IMHO, JV is a good guy in person and means well. He just needs a PR team to deal with his online persona. :iono:

Sorry to go off topic.

bad part is i was being lazy because mine was in the seat 3 feet from me. doesnt do any good if its not installed though

Why would they? If they did, then every bone head that blows up their motor would try to claim it on their insurance. As it is, the owner has to spend a bunch of lawyer money to prove that the shop screwed up (which is difficult to do most of the time). That is a natural deterrent. The bottom line is that if your car blows up, it is on YOU!

...and since it is on YOU, then YOU need to take precautions. Just having a wide band O2 is not enough. You have to OBEY it. When AFR gets out of range. Park. Your. Car....and don't start it again until it is fixed. When your gut tells you something isn't right, but the tuner says it is fine....get another tuner. NO ONE is going to be an advocate for your car except YOU.

Personally, I would add to the list of things you need before going FI.
- Enough $$$ on hand in case you forget something for the build (Oh, I need an oil cooler now)
- Enough $$$$ on hand to replace the motor if it blows.
- Alt transportation in case the build takes longer than expected. (unexpected problems can take time to diagnose, order parts and fix)

On the "Front Page" of forums, it appears FA20Club is no longer there?

Maybe I am reading it wrong? Or did Toni delete his account?

Related news...what will be his new platform?

Miata's already have a robust tuning group (so not a lot of room there)

He's already burned bridges with Honda's (Civics, S2000's)

Has already killed some Hyundai Genesis

Porsche as well...

I would love to see him tune the New Wankel if Mazda puts out a new RX7

Sadly, I am thinking he will be killing off the new Nissan (whichever they put out...that 510 thing or a new Z)

This is like a Celebrity Death Pool...for cars...
@nelsmar...really sorry to hear about your car...I plan on going FI once my 4Runner is paid off...been reading threads by you...sorry your car died being a test mule for the rest of us...Good Luck with the Monster BUILD!

Every time foot went down my eyes were on my gauge. It's sad that I had believed Toni that the factory wideband could be used don't get me wrong for general use it can be if calibrated correctly in certain conditions. It's close within a margin.... Ther were a number of times I let off and immediatly logged the car and inspected it. I wish I just would have gone with my gut and wired an lc2 in.

Oh yeah...Toni has 1336 posts...

Ya know what that means right?

His 1337th Post will most likely be in this THREAD about how he shit the bed

L33T

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/member.php?u=16043

His Stats...

I've been there man. Live and learn. Never again.

Only need one more FA20Club fan to come post in this thread to complete the circle. Where is @lexusb3 ?

I think it may even be hard for him to openly support a scammer.
Then again, the dude does seem to be a rather special person.

Finally... Hopefully the SHITTY KNOCK OFFS of the P&L turbokit will stop.

I have been on here for a little bit, just lurking and have retuned A LOT of Fa20 tunes as well as seen the junk they make. Sad part is by the time you option out the kit it cost as much as a good kit like the P&L or FBM. Good to see people starting to realize the smoke and mirrors products/software/tunes a few of the vendors on here produce.

We need to get this on Jalopnik with all his aliases and alert all automobile forums to look out for him. If he's been doing it for awhile and gets away with it, it's only a matter of time until he does it again on a different platform. I always thought something was fishy with this company. No one was ever able to answer my question of "who was FA20Club before they were FA20Club?"

@nelsmar --I read through the whole first post! Do I get a cookie? :bellyroll:

Kidding aside, that is an outstanding post. After your experience with Toni, this is a fitting eulogy to his association with this platform. I second the suggestion that we elevate this to Jalopnik's attention to attempt to prevent him from knowingly or unknowlingly scamming other people with this lazy attempt at work.

All this said--I'm pretty sure I am never getting my car tuned EVER. :lol:

Alright who put this tag in:

:lol:

I did! Glad someone "got" it!

Great post @nelsmar.

A lot of people can not only learn from this experience, but also learn how to HANDLE themselves if such a case is to arise.

I can understand frustrations with companies, but most of the time when I see a bashing thread it really irks me. How you display yourself on these forums is only a mirror image of your true self. Professionalism can go a long way, not only to make ends meet but it also leaves a good impression of yourself on others.

I have had issues with FA20club, amongst a few others, but my first response isn't to click the "new thread" button on the forum and go on a rant about it. It also goes to show you to always research prior to purchase.

I haven't had any catastrophic engine failures over here, but most of the common complaints within this story and others I have also experienced.

Hope to see your car up and running soon nelsmar.

Driving it wasn't the cause of the failure, cars are meant to be driven. It was the improper tune that was supplied by Toni that caused the failure. Correct me if I'm wrong but he voiced his concerns regarding said AFR issues and he was told BY HIS TUNER that it was safe. Logic would dictate that you would trust the guy that wrote the tune would know what he's doing, which obviously wasn't the case here. It's unfortunate that it happened and I feel for @nelsmar I'm not sure what can be done at this point though. He hasn't even come on here to even make an attempt to defend himself or his actions.

The Frozen North

Thanks for the kind words guys.

As far as I know Toni understands everything I said in this and doesn't disagree with it. The fact that he actually called me and asked me to log into his own computer and review some ROM's in question shows that he realizes he made a genuine mistake. I have heard a few individuals that I knew had problems say they got a ROM with a request to log from Toni so it looks like he is actually taking what I have told him seriously and is attempting to resolve the issues with others in private. Which is fine to me, but either way this still needed to be put out in public. I had been hiding it for too long now and at this point the number of cars that I was assuming may have similar problems was starting to concern me and it is a lot of work for me to personally contact all of the ones I know about and verify their logs, it is however much easier for Toni to simply open every rom in his computer and verify the calibration and resend all incorrect ones to locals.

I also don't know what people expect him to come in and say. He knows fully that he screwed up, I am assuming he is trying to not start a bigger fight by feeding the fire. He did call me and try to be genuine and say that he felt I should include some information that he felt was important to the story, which was, as I said already there and he simply misread it. So I don't think he has anything to say at this point and now realizes he just really, really screwed up.

Its sad but... It happens. Hopefully he turns around and makes something good of this massive situation (I am not just talking about me but others) and manages to find a balance. If he is genially trying to do better this time around vs fabworx etc... Then I wish him the best luck on his venture. Although the fact that I have always looked at his parts and though that they were simply copied, and the fact that he has mentioned copying things in the past it makes me think that there is little hope. I didn't post as much on that topic as I wanted to keep this more direct to my experience and less about "Why [ ] vendor sucks".

This thread should be jalopniked*

Agreed. See post 101.

Ironically I remember when Toni was making fun of Visconti for blowing up a car...

Oh the irony...

OP, it sounds like you learned some valuable lessons for next time. If something ain't right, it ain't right.... Don't walk away, run away fast.

Finally had time to sit down and read the whole thing. Dude, its been a goddamn wild ride with your car.

Hope you get the new engine sorted, and I kinda wish I was back there to help you.

For what its worth, I had a few words with Toni during that dyno day-- he didnt seem at all like a scam artist. Just a guy that made a massive mistake. I hope he tries to make it right with his other customers.

This is in no way disagreeing with anything said here. I'm just sharing MY experience just like the original poster did.

I've had a great experience with FA20club. We did a mobile tune on my supercharged setup and it's been amazing. I have given the car HELL. I mean it. I've done six 2-day track days, drifted it...A LOT, and even drove it across the country with zero issues or even the slightest hiccup. That's all.

Cool. Do you mind posting some logs for others to review?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

You are far from the only one. I was relatively happy with my FA20Club tune. It wasn't perfect, but it was good enough to drive all day every day. I sent my tunes and logs to @nelsmar when he was investigating his motor popping.

Just wondering, why would you be happy with a tune that wasn't great after you paid a price thinking you would be getting the best product possible. It shouldn't be just "good enough."

How to destroy an engine in 7 days: My review of FA20club.com’s services & ex...
 

Imho nobody is ever going to tune your car perfectly :), if you want a perfect tune you are better of learning how to tune and doing it taking your sweet time; also slowly learning the car and doing very very minor adjustment

Well that what I've been taught by my uncle whom built cars and tuned motec for him self only for years


Sent from my IBrick

I understand that. But it shouldn't be "good enough." It should be as good as possible.

I was around for some of nelsmar's car foibles, and I somehow managed to get a great tune (after a few tries obviously) from FA20Club. My car is running like a champ, and the more I drive it, the less I worry about the tune (I beat my car hard, like a misbehaving redheaded step child). I have not hooked up a wideband o2 sensor so I guess I could be sitting on a timebomb like nelsmar was, but I have had none of the issues he was posting about. Sure, I've had slow service from Toni a couple of times, but I've never had any major complaints.

I know nothing about tuning so all that gibberish was kinda interesting.. as if I was reading an organic chemistry textbook or something lol

But I'm glad you don't sound too doomed.. and thanks for the helpful information with the engine. I'm sure lot of tuners out there will appreciate your.. sacrifice :(

Most of us do.