Can any tuners disable TC/VDC?
 

I have a miserable time trying to get through the snow. I tried to disable TC/VDC and it wouldn't stay disabled. :thumbdown:Sometimes a little bit of slip is needed to keep momentum, and the nannies would intervene and make it impossible. I know there's a pedal dance to help put the braking system in diagnostic mode- and thereby disabling the TC/VDC systems- but I don't like the idea of not having ABS in these conditions.

My question for the tuners is - are there any tunes you can set up to allow us the ability to 100% disable the nannies? I'm not sure if TC/VDC are controlled by the ECU or another control module- but if they are, can you create tunes that will allow us to disable the systems completely when we turn off the TC button?

Thanks!

Sinan

none of the currently available software packages offer anything that would allow you to do that.

I have spoken to EcuTeK about this a few times and they have stated they are not interested in figuring it out at the moment. Though if there is enough people interested and post they might be more willing to do something about it.

Cheers,
William Knose

Not sure if this will help you.
Push and hold down the TC button for 3 seconds, this disables the TC, you will note the TC light stays on.

Do you have snow tires? I have General Altimax Arctics in 205/55-16s and I threw 120lbs of cat litter in the back (3x 40lbs unopened bags) and my BRZ rocks in the snow. I never turn off TC or VDC.

I have used hankook snows and they suck but with sport mode I do alright.

really? I never new that.

Holding the TC button for 3-5 seconds is what you want. Also, I don't think the pedal dance disables ABS? I know it disables EBFD, but I'm quite sure it leaves ABS on.

Yea LOL, can't believe people don't know this.

Really really :thumbsup:

We do this while on the dyno. Take note when you activate again the TC light may stay on for a few 100 meters and then go off.

No one knew to hold the TC button for 3 seconds? lol.

sorry pedal dance turns off EBFD. I'm picking snows on Tuesday and holding the TC button down doesn't disable the nannies totally- which is seriously annoying on a car like this. It a damn shame no tuner wants to address this issue :(

can any tuners chime in?

While I haven't driven mine in the winter much, holding the button down for 3 seconds while stationary does the job for autocross for sure. I have a spin out video to prove it! If you don't hold the button for long enough the traction control will re-engage at 30 something MPH, or when the car thinks its doing 30 something. This has harmed a couple of my initial burn out attempts while trying to kill the stock tires. If you read the owners manual it will give you the exact break down on the TCS functions.

[ame]http://youtu.be/dj7WIlliwgQ[/ame]



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

seriously... this is really not a good idea... this car snaps so quickly, and also recover soquickly, that... with the extra weight, you just risk to loose control....

if you want to do such a thing, do it... but don't spread it out like it's a good advice.... this car is easy to handle, and putting more weight at the rear will only let you believe that you control it more...

Your are referring to "Polar Inertia". In a racecar you want to not place any weight forward or rearward unless you have to. It increases the inertia of the car when it "spins"

If you want to help the car in the snow by adding weight,put it in the back seat.

Snaps quickly compared to what?

I use kitty litter in the rear and it helps make a big difference. I'm sure if one is moving near the handling limits of the car it would have adverse effects. But during the winter months, we're not driving that fast.

Even with pressing the TC button down for 3+ seconds, the electronic nannies are still there. I've held the TC button down for 3 second and I still electronic intervention once the revs jumped over 1500rpm and you felt the rear brakes clamp down- causing me to nearly shall and cease momentum. I just hate the fact that I have to fight with this system when I am trying to do other things.

Then you did it wrong. Start with everything on the way it is when you turn on the car then hold the TC button down until two lights light up on the cluster. If you do it right you can slide and spin as much as you want and it won't turn off until you either push the TC button again or turn off the car.

With the TC/VSC disabled properly (no pedal dance) the only electronic nannies left on are EBFD and ABS

snap faster than let's say, a S14 or any rwd with 3000lbs or more!
the more weight you put at the rear the harder it will be to recover. each time you tink (and you have) more traction at the rear because of the extra weight, you will have more difficulty to bring it back once you lose it (just as stugray said, polar inertia)

it is a car easy to correct, and to handle in the snow... i just personally think that it's better to gain experience with the way it handle, than adding weight at the back... (and i'm from Quebec... if anyone was wondering... but i assume my english already told ya all!)

The car is 55 front 45 rear split ...adding 120 lbs to the rear won't even make it neutral much less 70's porche style.

Yes putting weight in the back seat would keep the balance but you're not affecting it that much.

Also unless you have no throttle control or your car is broken you should use "sport mode" on the TC not full off. Don't know anything about the autos and the extra crap they have.

I drive on snow and ice on a regular basis, and I have the following comments:

1. Sandbags in the back only helps if you have problems getting up a steep hill (and only on RWD cars, of course). I avoid messing with the weight distribution if I can, especially on such a beautifully balanced car as this.

2. I only turn off TC/VDC when having fun in safe places, never on public roads. It may help if you're stuck in a ditch or something. I haven't been in a pickle like that with my GT86 yet so I don't know if turning off the TC will make much difference. Hopefully, I'll never find out, because if I'm that stuck I will most likely have damaged my car severely.

3. WINTER TIRES. Get good ones. The difference in grip is HUGE.
If you expect to drive on ice a lot, get studded winter tires. Otherwise, studless are better. I got Nokian Hakkapeliitta R2 215/55R16 studless and they are serving me well.
I have no sympathy and no respect for anyone driving on winter roads with inferior tires.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7291/1...5cfa2ed3_h.jpg

That's exactly what I get- the two yellow lights. One stating that the TC is off and the other is a symbol of a car with squiggly lines underneath. I found that the brakes in the rear being activated...

It's well documented that the the electronic nannies DO NOT shut off after hitting the TC button for 3 seconds. Seem like the pedal dance is the only way to remedy this. I was wondering if any tuners can "program" this pedal dance sequence when you hit the TC button to truly turn off the nannies.

So once again - you CAN NOT deactivate the nannies unless you do the pedal dance. Which again goes back to my first question - if it was possible to "tune" the pedal dance at the press of a button.

^^ Wrong, wrong, wrong. The ONLY thing that the pedal dance disables that turning the TC/VSC off doesn't do is the EBFD.

If you properly disabled TC/VSC and you're still getting brakes applied it's because you have zero traction on one wheel and the EBFD is applying a touch of brake stop the diff from unloading power to the wheel with zero traction.

@wparsons please shut up you are not well informed on this your posts even self contradict

Ebfd is a Nannie, it is used to prevent spins, and yes you can do donuts with the 3. Second hold but there is a level at which it still steps in and shuts down the fun check the track experiences all over this forum

*sigh*... link to said threads? How are most posts contradictory?

Are you talking about it going into "ice mode" and locking up the rear brakes? That's the EBFD at work.

EBFD is Electronic Brake Force Distribution. If your foot isn't on the brake, it isn't coming into play at all. If you're coasting or on the gas it has no effect. Now if you're trying to trail brake too much or are running staggered pad compounds you might have issues, but ONLY under braking.

Sounds like you're the one that isn't well informed.

oooooohhhhhhhhhhhh


:popcorn:

Hmmmmmm guess that would explain it. But, TC/VSC re-engages above 31mph -even if you push the TC button for 3 seconds.. right?

Nope. If the TC turns back on at ~30mph then it wasn't fully disabled.

I've hit over 140km/h (smaller track) with it properly disabled by the button (no pedal dance) and slid around without it coming back on.

The only difference between fully disabling it (~5 seconds of holding the button) and the pedal dance is that EBFD is still on if you use the button. ABS is on in both cases, normal TC and VSC are off.

The pedal dance also turns off the virtual lsd (where a spinning wheel is braked to keep traction) whereas the 3 sec hold doesn't disable that. Not sure if that's good or bad in the snow.

just tried it out today and it works!! woohooo.. now all i need are my summer tires back on my car so I can slide this mo fo around in circles

No, that's exactly what happens when you hold the button for a short time, less than three seconds. This clearly stated in the manual that less than three seconds only turns off trac below 30MPH and will reengage @ 31 MPH (pg 203 of the Scion Manual).

So, as has been mentioned before you are holding it wrong. Hold it down longer. You should see both lights go active when you have completely turned it off - the TRAC off light, and the Car slip light below it will both be active. If you only briefly press the Trac off button only the TRAC off light will be on and the system will start up again @31 MPH.

That's what I have been doing but I guess it was the EBFD that was kicking in. Strange, there were time line it seemed like it was still on...

If you hold the button long enough, the lights come on while the button is still pressed. If you have to let go of the button for the light to come on you didn't hold long enough.

Not sure if it varies from car to car, but mine is definitely longer than 3 seconds.

You are stating that all Nannies are disabled, yet explaining that they in-fact aren't all disengaged, there is alot going on behind the scenes with a traction control as advanced as this. so based on steering angle and throttle position different amounts of the system will step in to save your ass.

I have been tracking the car for over a year and have ample time driving it in all of it's various modes as do many members on this forum, if you ask @csg_mike I'm sure he can enlighten you even further

Ask and you shall receive.
http://www.autofactory.jp/product/to...&cate=4&seq=11

Holy crap! How did you find this thing!?!? I'll have to see how we can get this stateside.

I still believe there's something lurking when the system is"off". A lot of track guys have talked about this. I will find the links

You should go re-read the thread... every post of mine has stated the same thing about the TC/VSC/EBFD.

Holding the TC button turns off everything except EBFD and ABS, doing the pedal dance turns off everything except ABS.

As for what you've said, how does EBFD stop you from spinning???

If you do not have EBFD enabled, then you are depending on the mechanical brake bias distribution.
Did the engineer design the car to have less rear braking than the front in this situation (as they should have)? I dont know.

Older cars have a proportioning valve that cuts off the rear brakes at a certain pressure and allows the front pressure to continue to climb.
This reduces the chance of the rears locking before the fronts (which causes a spin)

Without EBFD enabled, who knows wht the rear brake bias is.