Sportsguy's AVO Turbo experience, the Good the Bad and the Ugly
 

For a background and more details/explanation on my Turbo Kit install, please visit my Build Thread.


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-7...0/IMAG0783.jpg

Warnings:

1) This is not a THIS vs. THAT thread. This is MY personal experience, opinions and facts on how my turbo install went from hardware installation, culminating with Dyno Tuning.

2) This is NOT a thread meant to crucify vendors. I had my fair share of great experiences with all vendors involved with my FI car.

3) My issues might very well be an isolated case, who knows... My only intent is to share with everyone all the things that can and will happen when you decide to modify a car.


Part 1: AVO Kit hardware install:

PROS:

Avo kit install was fairly simple when compared to the average Turbo Kit install. It was a big plus not needing to drill the Oil Pan. Instructions are well written except for some minor blemishes in which a picture is not clear enough or you don't know which exact part is needed. (DISCLAIMER: Instructions might have been updated since my install as i was one of the first ones at least in the forums).

This was my first turbo install and it is doable. It requires time, patience and commitment, but it can be done by the mechanically inclined individual. Oil and water cooling lines for the Turbo are very easy to install.

Paul Hansen is an awesome individual. He helped me quickly everytime I had a question and was ready to send me new tunes even when it was trial and error for different injectors I had installed. Customer service is top notch.

I have no complains as far as power delivery.

CONS:

Exhaust manifold flanges were a bit warped on the motor side. To this day I have a very small exhaust leak because of it.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-p...0/IMAG0598.jpg

Lining up the turbo discharge pipe to the overpipe was a B*TCH and then some... The Overpipe was hitting the frame no matter what was tried to make it fit. To this date, it sits SUPER close to the frame and if the RPM's dip enough when the AC is on, it actually rattles on the frame. IMHO and after months of analyzing it, it seems like the Turbo discharge pipe is not lined up properly or is longer than it should be which pushes the angle of the Overpipe farther back and thus hitting the frame.

Here are some pics:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-A...2/IMAG0688.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-y...2/IMAG0687.jpg

The low position of the turbo makes it a PITA to work on the turbo. I had a small leak on the turbo fitting and it was almost impossible to tighten that fitting a mere half turn.

As far as installing AVO stage 1 kit goes, thats it.


Now, I did install various supporting mods. I won't go into many details, but for those interested here is the Issues with Fuel Pump Install Thread

AND

Installing Motor Mounts can be a B*TCH


I also had issues installing Robispec Version 1 Radiator, it just would not fit.

Full Blown Motor sent me a radiator to test fit with AVO and it didn't fit either. I am still looking for a solution that will work with AVO's thick Intercooler. (Robispec thinks his solution work with some custom AC condenser to radiator brackets, it sounds logical and I believe that way FBM should also fit, I just will not be the test mule anymore. Waiting for someone else to try it :D)

Just because when it rains it pours, FBM Oil Cooler would not work out of the box because I have Perrin CAI and it interferes/ runs too close to the area where the oil lines should be routed.


In general all my other mods were fairly easy and straight forward with the usual hiccups that happen when working as a mechanic.

Part 2: Initial drive, initial tunes:

I have ALWAYS considered the Tune the MOST important part of seriously making power and modifying your car. It will play a HUGE part in wether you blow it in pieces, have a nice drive and wether all the money spent will actually produce what it should.


Having said that, I RUSHED Paul @ AVO to get me a kit in order to have Visconti tune it ASAP. Initially Paul was kind enough to try and send me some tunes to get me running even though he did not have the calibration for the SIR 500cc Injectors. As far as JV I had already contacted him and wanted to run his tune on my car. I knew from the start I was going to have to wait a bit but was fine with it.

I have some videos on My YOUTUBE CHANNEL showing initial startup and runs.

The first 3-4 logs where wasted because of ongoing issues with the Fuel Pump. John started e-tuning my car with mixed results. Sometimes I got a file that felt good, but popped an CEL for Rich (some other times for Lean). Not a big deal or deal breaker, but worried me a bit considering how high in my priorities list is having a PROPER TUNE.

I cannot say I had much problems getting in contact with John. He usually answered the phone extremely quick and was willing to help with whatever I requested quickly.

As time passed and I continued doing logs for John to tweak my file in anticipation for a final Dyno Day, I grew impatient. I kept receiving logs with little to no improvement. Sometimes the logs came out worse than before and worse the before last. The car hesitated to go, logs showed a good amount of knock values, AFR was pig rich. Again, all of this was done with the hope of a Dyno Day to finalize a safe, PROPER Tune.

In total, I flashed 16 E-tune files before getting on a Dyno.

Here are the last four E-tunes Logs Knock Correction values:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-f...2520%25231.PNG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-f...2520%25231.PNG

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-1...2520%25232.PNG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-H...2520%25234.PNG

I contacted John letting him know that I needed this car dyno tuned already, that it had been 2 and a half months of playing Russian Roulette with the most important part of the modification process. The response I got was a vague approximate date that was never met, even though I waited almost double the timeframe given before moving on.

The Last Straw:

The last straw happened when I was cruising one day, heard something strange, turned off radio and A/C just to notice that my car was LOUDLY knocking at cruising speeds. I literally feared damaging my engine with these tunes, I stopped using the car. If it weren't for the fact that I DONT Daily Drive my car, I would have lost it... That day I had it. I realized how stupid it was for me to keep waiting.

Part 3: FINALLY DYNO TUNED!

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-4...0/IMAG1007.jpg

(What else did you expect?? Florida Rainy day FTW!!!:mad0260::mad0260:)

I started doing my research again from ZERO between all available tuners. I noticed how after the initial wave of the mythical ECUTek groupbuy, things have changed.

I kept reading and reading so much happy Tony customers. I kept looking at the Dyno charts for his kit, N/A tunes, E85 tunes and other kits tunes. I met him personally at a meet and came away so impressed by the type of individual he is. Humble guy. Down to earth. No BS or Unicorn seller. Just get the job done type of guy.

So I made plans with @King Tut to have our Dyno day together, as ever since the FL Mega Meet we have been closely working together helping each other out (well mostly him mentoring me but you all get the idea :D) and it was only fitting to have our cars finalized same date same time while also helping us understand the difference between two nice FI kits.

Date was set for July 12th. When you first install a FI kit, you believe your car is a rocket, such an improvement over stock. After a few days reality started setting in for me and I started noticing something was not right. When Dyno day arrived I had butterflies in my stomach because ALL along I always feared my engine had something wrong because from the way it felt and how the car ran I KNEW I was not making near the power the AVO kit is capable of.

Lo and behold, It was NOT. Please check the below Dyno Charts:

First, how I got there and how I left:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-y...0run%25202.jpg


Secondly, all runs together minus final one.


Run 2: John's E-tune #16, 10.5 PSI
Run 8 FA20CLUB Dyno tune after trying my specific configuration for the first time ever, 10.5 PSI
Run 9 just a bit more tweaking from Toni, same 10.5 PSI
Run 10, second to last run, Boost upped to 12 psi

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-2...%2520Graph.jpg

So after this my hand went a bit overboard and I adjusted the MBC a bit too much. Hit 16 psi :confused0068:, Tony's boost cut saved the day :D

Two final runs, Red @ 12 psi, Blue @ 14 psi.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-J...wer%25202.jpgg

I turned the boost down to 13 psi for street use.

Some notes about this numbers before girls get their panties in a bunch:

I AM HAPPY WITH them and don't care if you are not :D
As you can see in the Final Graph, day was HAWT.
At the end of the day, I love how my car drives, sounds and performs.
Not only is the power increase amazing over my previous E-tune, but the driveability aspects of it are like having a completely different car.
Knock is GONE
The motor runs SMOOTH as butter, before it was very rough
I can actually cruise, before there was no middle ground. Either it builded boost even if you did not intend it to, or you were going painfully slow.

The ONLY issue left to correct is the SIR 500cc injector scaling. Hopefully it gets working properly soon. Not a huge deal, as the car starts everytime, just rough when its already hot.

Part 4: DYNO Video and Final Thoughts


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUgO6haRVdE"]BRZ AVO Turbo Kit Stage 2+ Dyno run - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hhF75cDgC4"]BRZ AVO Turbo 300 WHP 240 WTQ Dyno run #2 - YouTube[/ame]

Conclusion:

It is VERY important for all forum members to understand that installing a FI kit is not lilies and roses. It can be painful, hard, nerve wrecking and requires a good amount of $$ to get it right. There is a big bunch of mods that go around a FI kit that while not all of them are absolutely necessary, all work together to REALLY finalize a proper car build.

DONT be afraid to ask questions and make sure you understand everything, because there are some mistakes that just can't be undone.

If I had to do it again and in hindsight with what is available now, it wold be a painfully HARD decision but I THINK I would have chosen AVO again. The reason is when I initially chose AVO, I had certain goals for the car, and even though they changed as I modified it, AVO is still within them. I still love my AVO. Its an awesome kit, well made, easy to install and with great power delivery characteristics. I don't regret my decision one bit as I am VERY HAPPY with how my build came out.

Happy modding FT86 club. I hope my trial and errors help some members to avoid them.


Edit: Photo Shoot teaser??? Photo Shoot teaser! :D

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-4...4/IMAG1010.jpg

Thread is live!

http://troll.me/images/frankenstein-.../its-alive.jpg

glad everything worked out for you. most important your happy with the car its not all about power but when you get both its even sweeter.

i didnt know what to expect when i first met you but you were easy going and seemed like you genuinely liked building up the community organizing meets etc. i never tried to sell you on my services and i never do to anyone i just stay busy working and it all seems to come together for everyone. i dont care if its my kit avo fbm vortech innovate im here to get the job done.

and as always you guys know ill be here for any help you need its not just locals who benefit.

Good to hear it's finally running the way it should! Thanks for sharing your experiences.

:popcorn::thanks:

Same issue here. I literally am in my garage right now with my overpipe off. I am going nuts as it just vibrates and clangs on the frame too much. I am not happy. I am going to try to air hammer in around the area that is hitting, if that doesnt work, then i will be taking the overpipe to a shop to have them cut a notch and weld it up.

In my opinion, AVO needs to correct the connection angle. Sounds like its hapenning to others as well. The bigger problem with this is not even the noise, but the failure aspect. Whats happening is that the contact/force on the overpipe is actually causing the turbo to be pried up and i can see it failing soon under hard driving.

This is the reason i am actually not risking it and going to cut a notch/dent in my overpipe. Rather damage the pipe, than the turbo.

I think there has not been as many issues yet, because the few that do have the avo kit are probably with stock overpipe. Which of course is smaller, so a bit more room for this alignment error.

The other problem i have had is that many parts are pre-assembled on the headers/turbo. After running it a bit, i have found a few places that bolts were just not too tight, and are leaking oil.

I have more thoughts, ideas and solutions and will be elaborating more on my build thread.

I cant wait to see it in person.

Was awesome to see this in person!! Great build bro!!

Here is a video I shot of one of your runs...this one you hit 300 HP but boost was cut after turning it up a hair too much ;)

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bktI8RxKduU"]300 HP AVO Turbo BRZ - YouTube[/ame]

awesome @Sportsguy83. the car has come along so far since i 1st saw it at rev works. what supporting mods to u have for the turbo BTW? jus wanna make sure i got it all b4 i try and turbo. i know exhaust, motor mounts, clutch, (maybe) transmission mount

It's incredible how similar our issues were/are!!

Yes sir!!

Thanks!! That run was funny/scary/hilarious. I almost shit my pants....

Thanks David for posting that up. I am not one to normally post in these forums, and have been a member for over 6 months now. After reading your post I had to share my experience so far with @FA20Club.com.

I have basically been emailing Tony back and forth for the last few months (sorry for the million questions Tony) on his turbo kit and after looking at all the other options and doing my research both locally and online, eventually Tony convinced me to put a deposit down on one of his T3/T4 kits only just yesterday.

Your comments with regard to his professionalism and quick replies are spot on.

Now I just have to play the waiting game for my kit to arrive and hope that it all goes relatively smoothly with the install then logging and etuning :)

Cheers

Nathan