Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB

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-   Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=39)
-   -   Got a track related question? I'll try to answer. (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38926)

CSG Mike 06-26-2013 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1028010)
When can we expect the CSG BRZ to be on the track again?

I wish I knew...

derek1ee 06-27-2013 03:41 AM

1. what's your tire temperature difference (outside/inside of front/rear) on track and on street? is 10F difference outside to inside on street driving to much?

2. what's your tire temperature difference front to rear? I have rear temp higher than front, ~5F, normal? how can i make them even?

thanks!

ja1217 06-27-2013 03:29 PM

How much drop would you recommend on a set of coilovers (Ohlins Road and Track to be specific) that will see around 10 track days a year and will be daily driven the rest of the time? I'm not really concerned with how it looks, lap times and not scraping on every imperfection on the road are more important to me.

CSG Mike 06-27-2013 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ja1217 (Post 1030049)
How much drop would you recommend on a set of coilovers (Ohlins Road and Track to be specific) that will see around 10 track days a year and will be daily driven the rest of the time? I'm not really concerned with how it looks, lap times and not scraping on every imperfection on the road are more important to me.

I haven't specifically set up ride height on that particular coilover. However, as with every other coilover, it's highly dependent on how well you can compensate for having a roll center that's a bit lowered (increased response time to input is a simple way to explain the effect).

Don't focus on the drop as much as getting the dampers dialed to your taste.

To me, a street car is too low if you gotta worry about scraping. Since it's a daily driven car, make the daily driver aspects primary, and tracking secondary.

CSG Mike 06-27-2013 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by derek1ee (Post 1028949)
1. what's your tire temperature difference (outside/inside of front/rear) on track and on street? is 10F difference outside to inside on street driving to much?

2. what's your tire temperature difference front to rear? I have rear temp higher than front, ~5F, normal? how can i make them even?

thanks!

Temps depend on the tire used and the rims (width) used. We're optimized for 225/235 tires on 9" rims at the moment, with a spread of 5-15F depending on run time and ambient temps. With 8" rims, outer edges are generally way hotter than the inside and centers.

Higher rear temps isn't a bad thing... I struggle with higher front temps.

10F difference street driving means you probably don't have enough camber for on-track use. Street driving, our car is "warm" on the inside, and cool center and outside. This is purely due to sidewall flex from camber; we run 0 toe front/rear.

ayau 06-27-2013 04:11 PM

Is 17x9 on 225 too much stretching in your opinion? Not worried about the wheel popping off the bead? 225 tires are rated with max wheel width of 8.5'', but it's almost impossible to find wheels in 8.5'' 5x100. Any suspension parts rubbing on 17x9?

What's the hotness in track tire at the moment? Rivals? RS3?

CSG Mike 06-27-2013 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1030187)
Is 17x9 on 225 too much stretching in your opinion? Not worried about the wheel popping off the bead? 225 tires are rated with max wheel width of 8.5'', but it's almost impossible to find wheels in 8.5'' 5x100. Any suspension parts rubbing on 17x9?

What's the hotness in track tire at the moment? Rivals? RS3?

I may be guilty of running 225 on a 9", but these are with tires that are known to run wide...

My tire of choice is still the RS3.

kster1 06-27-2013 05:41 PM

In the Miata world, running a 15x9 with a 225 tire is a very popular setup with the track guys.

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 01:07 PM

Bump. I know there's gotta be more questions :)

troek 07-03-2013 01:43 PM

ok heres one. im going to tsukuba in a couple weeks. gona be my first time at a track. any tips?

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troek (Post 1042910)
ok heres one. im going to tsukuba in a couple weeks. gona be my first time at a track. any tips?

Take it slow, keep the car under control. Tsukuba has walls...

Make sure you got good brake pads and fluid. Otherwise, have fun!

sw20kosh 07-03-2013 01:52 PM

How softly do you grip your steering wheel?

Do you, at all, "hang on" to the steering wheel during hard cornering?

overlookedx 07-03-2013 02:05 PM

Do I need a full face helmet or will my open face helmet suffice?

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sw20kosh (Post 1042935)
How softly do you grip your steering wheel?

Do you, at all, "hang on" to the steering wheel during hard cornering?

I used to. I had to force myself to relax... constantly remind myself to just hold the steering wheel enough to keep in control. Eventually, it becomes natural.

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by overlookedx (Post 1042976)
Do I need a full face helmet or will my open face helmet suffice?

That depends on the organization and track; you'll want to check with the organizer of your particular event.

sw20kosh 07-03-2013 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 1042989)
I used to. I had to force myself to relax... constantly remind myself to just hold the steering wheel enough to keep in control. Eventually, it becomes natural.

I think this is why I am so bad at correcting for a spin... I grip the steering wheel and hold on for dear life when the tail end is comin round. :bonk:

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sw20kosh (Post 1043462)
I think this is why I am so bad at correcting for a spin... I grip the steering wheel and hold on for dear life when the tail end is comin round. :bonk:

I got into a (bad) habit of just letting go of the steering wheel, and catching it when the car's balance "feels right".

I really have no idea where I picked it up, but from what I'm told, it's a drifter thing?

In the s2k, If I do this, it's almost 100% guaranteed that it'll result in an overcorrection and a spin in the other direction, but with the FRS/BRZ, I can unwind and recenter at will.

ayau 07-03-2013 06:03 PM

What senses do you rely on when you track? Can you rate them from most important to least important?

eg., visual, feedback from steering wheel, etc.

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1043612)
What senses do you rely on when you track? Can you rate them from most important to least important?

eg., visual, feedback from steering wheel, etc.

Feedback from the chassis (seat aka butt dyno)
Feedback from the steering wheel (what I see vs what I feel vs where the wheels are pointed)
Visual (gotta see where I'm going, and be aware of what's AROUND me [not just in front])
Auditory (does anything sound off? Tires making noise? Do I hear other cars? Is anything dragging?)
Smell (do I smell anything overheating? burning?)

Don't use taste though.

robispec 07-03-2013 07:01 PM

chicken! we need to get you out east of the shop and get you and your car DIRTY at the lucern drylake bed!

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robispec (Post 1043790)
chicken! we need to get you out east of the shop and get you and your car DIRTY at the lucern drylake bed!

Sounds like an invitation :happy0180:

iLuveKetchup 07-03-2013 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 1043599)
I got into a (bad) habit of just letting go of the steering wheel, and catching it when the car's balance "feels right".

I really have no idea where I picked it up, but from what I'm told, it's a drifter thing?

Yikes! Never let go.

KKaWing 07-03-2013 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup (Post 1043918)
Yikes! Never let go.

This has got to be a meme somewhere :lol:

GTM_Challenge 07-03-2013 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup (Post 1043918)
Yikes! Never let go.

Sometimes it's al you can do :(

GTM_Challenge 07-03-2013 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KKaWing (Post 1044064)
This has got to be a meme somewhere :lol:

A la titanic

CSG Mike 07-03-2013 09:36 PM

http://blog.georgetownvoice.com/wp-c...Picture-14.png

ayau 07-05-2013 11:10 AM

Which SA rated helmet would you recommend in terms of weight and price?

raul 07-05-2013 12:18 PM

@CSG Mike

Still sort of new to the brake pad world. Canyou shed some light for me on how to determine remaining pad life? I have a set of HP+ pads with 2 track days on them that I used on OEM tires. Frankly, they look great to me, but I want to make sure I'm not missing something a more experienced eye would catch. I can take pictures if you'd like as well.

CSG Mike 07-05-2013 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1046605)
Which SA rated helmet would you recommend in terms of weight and price?

What's your budget? This is one area where I'd spend as much as possible; you only get one chance in protecting your noggin. A lighter helmet will result in less fatigue on your neck.

Also, try on as many as you can, so that you can find one that fits your head best. It's kind of like how everyone's head is either an Arai or Shoei shape.

Quote:

Originally Posted by raul (Post 1046695)
@CSG Mike

Still sort of new to the brake pad world. Can you shed some light for me on how to determine remaining pad life? I have a set of HP+ pads with 2 track days on them that I used on OEM tires. Frankly, they look great to me, but I want to make sure I'm not missing something a more experienced eye would catch. I can take pictures if you'd like as well.

I go by visual inspection. Pad life remaining can be determined by pad thickness. You *CAN* run the pads to the backing on most makes, but you don't want to score the rotors by having the backing actually touch the rotor (this is indicated by a grinding sound and shuddering feel in the pedal). Street pads typically have indicators built in that will cause noise when you get low (around 2mm pad material typically). New pads are usually 10-11mm (pad material) thick, unless you run a BBK like the AP Racing BBK we run, which uses 16mm pads (for virtually the same price!).

If you take the pads off, you can see if there are signs of glazing/fading. If you post pictures, I'll be more than happy to give you my feedback.

ayau 07-05-2013 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 1046703)
What's your budget? This is one area where I'd spend as much as possible; you only get one chance in protecting your noggin. A lighter helmet will result in less fatigue on your neck.

Also, try on as many as you can, so that you can find one that fits your head best. It's kind of like how everyone's head is either an Arai or Shoei shape.

I'd say $500 or so. I know that's not Arai SA helmet budget. Maybe a Bell or HJC? I've read that the HJC Si-12 is one of the lighest out there.

raul 07-05-2013 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1046709)
I'd say $500 or so. I know that's not Arai SA helmet budget. Maybe a Bell or HJC? I've read that the HJC Si-12 is one of the lighest out there.

I have an HJC AR-10-II and I love it! No weight issues, neck is completely fine after a full track weekend.

CSG Mike 07-05-2013 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ayau (Post 1046709)
I'd say $500 or so. I know that's not Arai SA helmet budget. Maybe a Bell or HJC? I've read that the HJC Si-12 is one of the lighest out there.

Hmmm that's the range I spent on my helmet. I have a Simpson (although I fear I may have bought into the name.... due to the prowess of their marketing dept. giving the Stig a Simpson).

I did purchase before my first track day ever...

The HJC is pretty solid, and is something we can get for you.

donutfilling 07-05-2013 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 1043708)
Feedback from the chassis (seat aka butt dyno)
Feedback from the steering wheel (what I see vs what I feel vs where the wheels are pointed)
Visual (gotta see where I'm going, and be aware of what's AROUND me [not just in front])
Auditory (does anything sound off? Tires making noise? Do I hear other cars? Is anything dragging?)
Smell (do I smell anything overheating? burning?)

Don't use taste though.

What about the taste of victory?

CSG Mike 07-05-2013 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutfilling (Post 1047158)
What about the taste of victory?

There are too many fast drivers (and cars) out there for me to have sampled the sweet taste of victory, yet. I need to get faster.

iLuveKetchup 07-05-2013 06:35 PM

Does waching Initial D help improve your driving?

CSG Mike 07-05-2013 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup (Post 1047413)
Does waching Initial D help improve your driving?

Yes. Gutter technique works.

RehabJeff86 07-06-2013 02:14 PM

Do Aluminum Lug Nuts have problems on the track i.e. loosen up and fell off?

Doborder 07-06-2013 03:11 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup
Does waching Initial D help improve your driving?
Yes. Gutter technique works.

Ha ha! Lol
I need to go back and watch it some more....

mit_peid 07-06-2013 10:08 PM

My FRS is lowered on Eibach ProKits with Koni Yellows. I have some 18x7.5+48 Volk SE37 w/ some cheap Falken 225/40 rubber on them and also running 20-30mm spacers for cosmetic reasons.

Going to bring the car out for the first track event at Willow Springs this coming Saturday for the Dynamic Driving Academy 2.

1) Should I run it on the stock wheels/tires instead of my what I have now? (I don't mind burning through my current tires)

2) Should I remove the spacers for the track event/training?

CSG Mike 07-07-2013 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RehabJeff86 (Post 1048912)
Do Aluminum Lug Nuts have problems on the track i.e. loosen up and fell off?

Torque is torque, the holding power of Aluminum and Steel/Chromoly/whatever is all the same as long as you torque to the same amount.

The differences are in weight, and resistance to damage. Aluminum lugs are more easily damaged by overtorquing, and Titanium lugs are brittle; neither should be impacted.

That being said, we use our own CSG Aluminum lugnuts on all of our cars. They're shockingly light.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mit_peid (Post 1049534)
My FRS is lowered on Eibach ProKits with Koni Yellows. I have some 18x7.5+48 Volk SE37 w/ some cheap Falken 225/40 rubber on them and also running 20-30mm spacers for cosmetic reasons.

Going to bring the car out for the first track event at Willow Springs this coming Saturday for the Dynamic Driving Academy 2.

1) Should I run it on the stock wheels/tires instead of my what I have now? (I don't mind burning through my current tires)

2) Should I remove the spacers for the track event/training?

Either run your stock tires, or take your spacers off (for clearance reasons). The choice is yours :)


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