Not stalling?
 

So, i left the dealer last night and he told me something interesting.

If you come off the clutch slowly in gear, without any gas, you can creep forward without having the foot on the clutch. Found that interesting enough to try. Low and behold, it works.

Has anyone else tried or heard about this? I tried to search but couldn't find anything.

Now the 2nd attempt didnt work (oops) while moving at slow speeds. Looks like it needs to be from a complete stop, with brake engaged for a few seconds. Haven't read the owners manual yet, so not sure if its there.

Am I missing something here? You can pretty much do that with any clutch car. Are you talking about a hill-holder feature possibly where the car doesn't roll backwards when you take your foot off the brake?

Perhaps a new Manny Tranny driver?

Yeah, that's normal. The GTO has enough torque to do it in 3rd...and I think I was able to do it in 4th in my old xA (gear ratio and weight). Also, not advised for long periods of time...slow/partial engagement of the clutch is going to eat up the organic material on the clutch surface faster than if you just engage it and go...but perfectly fine for inching up at a red light or something

Any manual car should do that. Your car's idle RPM is enough to propel it forward if you engage the gear slowly enough. Same reason why Automatics creep forward when you put them on Drive gear. Brake doesn't have to be engaged, you just have to be precise. In the FR-S release the clutch slowly until you feel the transmission engage (car will shake slightly, RPM will drop slightly), when you feel that, release even slower.

Again, though, I caution that the slower you engage the clutch disc, the faster it will wear out. It has springs built in to absorb some of the shock when engaged normally...those springs do little when you're letting the flywheel spin against the clutch with it partially engaged. I'd say it's fine when you're trying to just creep ahead, but I wouldn't make a habit of it other than that.

http://i1.frsimg.com/images/detailed_images/clt.jpg

This...it's actually the technique I use to teach new manual drivers so they can feel the engagement point. The "release the clutch and give it gas!" advice to a new driver always makes me cringe.

Yeah, it's actually more of a fast-slow-fast motion when you get some experience. Fast until you feel engagement, slow down for just a moment until you have some forward movement, and then release quicker from that point. The whole entire motion should be less than 2 sec.

welcome to manual transmission land.

What you're finding, my friend, is the biting point.

Thats when your clutch begins to contact the flywheel. And so, you begin to move because you are now effectively connecting the engine and trans.

But don't stay at the biting point, because the clutch isn't fully engaging the flywheel, and the flywheel is slowly scratching off that precious friction material that you put down so much moneyz for.

That's when you begin to gas and go!

Have fun driving standard!

It's like the first time a magician pulled a rabbit from a hat. How exciting.

Must be fun to have that much torque... I almost bought a used GTO with 600whp, but instead opted for the more economical choice... I'll admit, there is fun that only low-end torque can provide.

All these "I don't know how to drive a manual trans" threads make me lose faith in today's parents. Why aren't parent's teaching their kids about real world skills? Ugh. Next lesson is basic car maintenance (light bulbs, batteries and fluid changes)...

And yes, this is the second step in teaching somebody manual transmission. The first is to drill into the student's head - before you do anything or if anything goes wrong, push in the clutch pedal. (before you start the car - push in the clutch, before you put it in gear - push in the clutch, if the car starts making an odd noise - push in the clutch, if it starts bucking - push in the clutch, want to change gears? push in the clutch... etc.)

-Charlie

Almost any manual car will do that...

So we should not do this and engage gas first then release clutch? I always get different responses to this.

Yep! I do this to inch forward in a parking spot, etc

That's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying to minimize the amount of time the clutch is partially engaged. Obviously you also want to minimize RPMs while the clutch is partially engaged as well (faster spinning engine = faster wearing of clutch). Absolutely no problem doing this for short periods of time to slowly move up (or back), but I wouldn't drive down the road with the clutch half-engaged LOL

Ready to blow OP's mind...: you don't even need the clutch to move forward. If you just gently press the stick towards first gear, you can move the car that way too at stoplights.*

*of course not recommended, but you can do it. Welcome to the world of manual shifting.

I think what OP was trying to say was the car will stop you from stalling when slowing pulling out the clutch by automagically increasing engine rpm a bit higher when it drops down below 400 RPM.

I wish I had this on the Evo...(what a pain in the was clutch!)

The reason this works is because the flywheel is spinning with the engine seperate from the clutch and pressure plate. A flywheel is simply a mechanical means of storing energy. When you push in the clutch the pressure plate pushes the clutch and flywheel together. As long as the flywheel has enough energy stored in it to over come the initial friction of the drivetrain and tires the car will move forward and the engine will not stall. It really has nothing to do with the power of the engine; rather the energy stored in the flywheel and energy needed to overcome the initial friction. The crank shaft and other rotating parts in the engine also add energy but the fly wheel is the most important factor.

For example, the LS2 on the GTO has a flywheel, clutch, and pressure plate weighing about 48 pounds. It's very easy to drive compared with the roughly 22 lb flywheel, clutch and pressure plate assembly found in the lotus elise.

This becomes important if you are going to mod your car with a lightweight flywheel. You give up driveability in exchange for less rotational mass which means the engine revs up slightly faster in low gears. When I had my XRS I went from the stock 16 lb flywheel to a 7.5 lb flywheel. With the stock flywheel I could let the clutch out without any gas and roll forward on a flat road. With the lightweight flywheel I would stall unless I revved the engine a little while letting the clutch out.

On my FR-S, from a stop, if you shift to first and accelerate, then let off the throttle (keeping the clutch engaged), the engine will SLOWLY drop revs from 1500 rpm to idle.

It's annoying sometimes because if I'm actively braking, I'm basically fighting the engine to slow the car down in 1st unless I de-clutch. It's like the engine is tuned not to slam the throttle plate all the way closed in 1st. Possible reasons I've thought of are to avoid engine-braking below 1500 rpm in 1st (maybe to smooth out throttle on/off in 1st gear) or to allow for better stop-go driveability. But as I said, it can be annoying.

Anyone else's FR-S like this? I didn't notice it before my ECU was re-flashed.

So when I take my foot off the clutch completly, in first gear, without gas, at a complete stop, ALL manual cars will roll forward? I know it will slightly from the friction/biting/engaging point. But past that, without giving gas, it usually stalls?

hmm. this is my 3rd standard car. the other 2 stall when i come off the clutch and do not apply gas. Which is why I thought this was cool. But apperently this is common.



:iono: You almost blew me ... but I don't understand. Guess i'll try it next time and figure this out.

If the car idles at a ridiculously low RPM, or the clutch (or the car entirely) is too heavy for the idle RPM to propel the car forward, I guess I could see that happening. I've never owned heavier cars nor trucks. All of my cars have been compacts.

Yes, for most of the manual cars in stock form, as long as you release the clutch carefully before and at the engagement point, you can roll the car forward without gas.

If you simply release the clutch too quickly around the engagement point, the car/flywheel/engine/transmission cannot react to the sudden engagement and thus it will stall. This depends on how you release the clutch, and what the clutch is made off.

As @raul said, the releasing of clutch should be a fast/slow/fast motion: you can release fast from the bottom to the point prior to the engagement point, release slowly/gently at the engagement point, and fast once the transmissions grabs the flywheel from the engine.

Every car has different engagement point. Some are high, and some are low. Furthermore, people have different preferences to have this point high or low. You should try to learn finding the engagement point with this *no-gas* technique first, with either 1st or R gear, to feel the car. Once you know this point from your left foot, it will be very easy to control when you should (dis)engage your clutch given your situation.

Almost all manual cars do that. And here 1 more thing. If you are in second gear and just let go of the accelerator pedal and don't touch the brake or clutch pedal, the car (and all manuals) will slow down and keep going forward at slow speed without stalling.

Not really sure how you get your driving license in USA but here in Sweden this part is one of the thing that you learn in the driving school. :p

Here in the US, they just hand us a drivers license as a bonus once we get our gun license.

I kid, I kid.

US drivers education programs don't include manual transmission training these days. Haven't done so in at least a few decades now.

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