I like this a lot. Personally I think the MR2 should take the 86's position and then up the 86's refinement and possibly power. Then let the Supra be the god-teir car.

MR2 would have to go between the 86 and Supra. The 86 makes more sense being the lower end sports car and the SFR the odd car out. I just can't see the SFR being that cheap without being bad or hurting 86 sales. The MR2 as the middle child allows for better spacing in the lineup.

Jesus even gymratter recognizes this is clickbait.

Depends on if BMW spends money on weight reduction or something else, the last Z4 clocks in under 3,300 lbs in base trim, if Mazda can drop weight off their previous roadster I'm sure the Germans could too, and they're getting a Toyota cash infusion. The 911 is nearly 3,200 lbs according to Porsche's website, only about 100 lbs to cut out of a luxury convertible to make the mark.

It's more possible than anything else discussed in this thread.

not to mention that rendering is old as dirt. its been floating around since 2012 as a place holder for the "new Supra".

http://www.motortrend.ca/en/news/toy...-the-pipeline/

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1240045

Yep and the GRMN concept car was from 2011 was said to be the MR2 that would be available in "early 2017". Slow month so the clickbaits are digging up ancient history and claiming it is new. People will still believe it though.

Agreed. Cayman is claimed to be 2900lbs, but I think Porsche is cheating when they say that because no owner reports a number much under 3000lbs on the scales. Maybe it's 2900lbs if you're low on washer fluid, have PCCBs, the overpriced lithium ion battery, your tires are bald, and you're slightly low on engine oil? lol...

<3000lbs for the Supra is not impossible. If we start with the BRZ as an example, throwing out the rear seats shaves some weight off, lightweight materials in the body can counter the weight gain in the brakes and such, and a V6 engine would barely add any weight over the ridiculously heavy Subaru flat 4. An extra 150lbs in engine/trans gets you to 2900lbs, then some more weight here and there to reinforce stuff gets you to 3000lbs, then subtract some weight from exotic material usage and decreased passenger compartment size.

Leave the latest Toyota sports car rumors to Best Car magazine.

http://bestcarweb.jp/wp-content/uplo...6-768x1084.jpg

I think it's saying 50th anniversary of Toyota 2000GT and Mazda Cosmo this year could these models make a come back?

http://bestcarweb.jp/wp-content/uplo...17/02/1a-2.jpg

That's a nice looking Toyota Camaro

^^^
its probably just the new Supra.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/toyota-...orts-concepts/

lol, like it isn't going to have the B48/B58 in it

LMAO!

That's why I added 100lbs for the turbos and stuff. The shortblock should not be much heavier in I6 or V6 configuration.

i wish. They should just take the Yaris platform and flip it like they did the original MR2. A simple lightweight rear engine rear wheel drive. Don't need to change anything.

Anyone know what happened to this thing?

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/i...P8D8yhmPIwVSFU

Kei car, sold in Japan only.

I head sad trombone inside my head every time I see this car

If there is any truth behind this I'm think it will be expensive and maybe sold under the Lexus brand.

It's all bullshit till I see it on a dealer show room.

It's another Toyota fish face this one's a puffer.

May of been what started the whole look since the render is from 2011!

did some digging, looks like more rehash rumors of a "mid engine BMW & Toyota/Lexus sports car".

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/spy-sho...-new-supra-z7/

also rereading the evo article, Tada san was never quoted saying anything about a new MR2. only that Toyota wants a 3 sports car line up.

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/it-...-as-the-supra/

I dig it.

Eh, $10 says the Supra will basically be a rebadged BMW or Mercedes. Expensive, no longer a "Toyota". Somewhere along the lines of a Corvette + in price. It will be too heavy and hyper loaded with gadgetry.

MR2...I don't see happening, but would be interesting. Either way, it will probably suck and be heavy. Every day, these companies are distancing themselves further and further from the classics they once produced. NSX is a perfect example of taking a very high performance car that was attainable, and turning it into an elite space shuttle like vehicle that costs as much as a Lamborghini.

FR-S is an outlier in recent history and will go down as a classic sports car 30yrs from now, like the S2000.

Day by day, I'm becoming more interested in cars with less gadgetry and more about performance and purity. That's what made me fall in love with the FR-S. Contemplating picking up a low mile supercharged Elise / Exige for 35-55K as a weekend sports car and call it good. Not the fastest, but who cares. Hella fun and it's something none of the car companies are doing.

What do the twins weigh now? 2,800ish on a good day? For a 300HP version you are going to be at 3,300 and 35K.

Sure it is fairly easy to get 300 with bolt-ons, lots of people do it, but Toyota Corporate can't do that. There are a million reasons why they can't. It was engineered for 200HP maybe 250, that is why it is fairly light. Add a bunch more power and things start to get wonky. That's OK for the enthusiast, overcoming challenges is part of the fun, but Toyota Corporate is huge and challenges for them become massive. Anyone want to guess how much R&D and engineering went into making sure our floor mats stay correctly positioned? Multiply that times the variations all over the world of all the Toyotas that are manufactured and sold.

They prefer challenges such as how do we manufacture each Corolla for $100 less per unit while maintaining customer satisfaction. Seriously.

Consider if it were a $35K car what the buyers would expect for their money....some would be happy with performance, but most would want some luxury. Luxury adds weight and is a horsepower drain and necessitates bigger stronger and heavier everything else. It's a slippery slope. A 3,000lbs 300 HP car...with all the right driving dynamics (and meeting corporate needs) is a real challenge.

I'm more interested in that Mazda in the back. Can we get scans of that (maybe in one of the RX-7 return threads)? Thanks.

Done. The bestcarweb.jp website just changed the cover so I took the link from my original post.

You know it does say Mazda Cosmo in Japanese not RX-7. :thumbsup:

Next issue is rumor of Nissan Silvia return (wonder why they don't connect it to the Renault Alpine but not like I can actually read Japanese).

http://bestcarweb.jp/wp-content/uplo...ar20170410.jpg

http://bestcarweb.jp/wp-content/uplo...17/03/1a-2.jpg

The RX9 is a Miata RF....that is it, end of story. The only thing you can hope for is a Mazdaspeed version. No more rotary, it is simply too dirty. the EPA has gutted things like this. With CAFE and VW/Dieselgate I do not see people stretching on dirty stuff.

I'd like to have two stroke street motorcycles again They would sell in such small numbers it would not make any difference, but the green Nazis have killed those too.

LOL, but the first gen 70's era Celica was called the "Japanese Mustang" so who knows maybe Toyota is feeling nostalgic

A Japanese pony car would be cool. Too bad Nissan is dead now.

You really don't know what you're talking about if you don't think Toyota is capable of developing a more powerful FRS, at a reasonable cost, at less than 3000 lb. Must have a very low opinion of their engineering ability.

No, not at all. I'm actually in awe of their ability.

Their financial people also have a high level of competence.

As it was stated before, enjoy the car, it will NOT continue. From a financial standpoint it is NOT a success. Sure there are a few on here that are passionate about the car, but that is few and far between. Even the dealers are not interested.

We are more like likely to see a 200HP Corolla or a 350HP Camry, before we see a 275HP 86

The twins were an exercise, we benefitted, Toyota lost.

Why do you keep talking about a V6? BMW isn't going to put a V6 in it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_B48
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_B58

Jesus, Toyota will be rebadging a BMW Z5, that's been clear as day for years, there's nothing to speculate about on that front.

Mine weighs under 2,750 without my fat ass in it.

:burnrubber:

That's the trick, 'reasonable cost'

For logical people, that reasonable cost would be ~$35k give or take trim options.
For armchair internet quarterbacks it's $29k because 'all you have to do is put a turbo on it!'

The issue isn't doing it. The issue is doing it profitably.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

Sometimes I think the "Z" in the name BRZ meant that's the best they can offer within the most economical means possible.

No question Toyota is a master of lean, I mean their past executives did manage to help turn around the fortunes for Porsche.

No high power 86/BRZ because that would go against one of the original ideals of the Miata in which this project was really based on.

What part about "V6 or I6" wasn't clear? V6 or I6, the weight is pretty similar. Usually the engine is in the high 300lbs range for a 3.5L engine, mid to low 300s for a 3.0L.

H4 vs I4 is a big difference unfortunately. Usually a performance 2L I4 is 300lbs ish maybe less, but the H4 engines are more in the mid 300lb range.

Strap on turbos and intercoolers, the 6 cylinder will probably gain close to 100lbs.

I sure hope the low consumer demand for the 86 and even good journos saying the car needs more go make the designers make changes to the gen2.


If they don't make changes then no more 86.:(

I hope they use an updated wrx engine in the gen2.

BMW doesn't make a V6, why would a V6 be in this chassis at all?

Might as well bring up how much an LS weighs for how relevant it is to the discussion at hand.

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying this car will never have a V6 in it from the factory.

I wouldn't hold your breath on that.

The whole conversation was about weight...-_-

Why discuss the weight of some unrealistic hypothetical?

-_-