Interesting to see the work being done on a hybrid. With how difficult FA20 cores are to get this is very viable.

Trigger wheel for the crankshaft is not a big deal, machining one to fit is no big deal using a BRZ core.

The 2017/2013-2016 is around the cam tooth pattern. On the older cars they are one way and the 17+ and DIT models it is the opposite (male/female) so the ECU will have an inverse shape and thus not work. But if you're using cam phasers from whichever generation you're working with it should be a non-issue.

The bigger issue to me looks to be the piston design. Those valve cutouts don't look nearly big enough for the FA20 but hard to say 100% from the pictures alone.

As for the FA20 heads, we had them flow tested a good bit ago (http://www.moto-east.com/main/fa20-h...vs-ported-wrx/) and the FA20 flows more than you'll generally need for most setups. I don't see any issue with the bigger displacement motor.

I am watching this thread. Rather go Hybrid FA20/24 block then a K swap when my current FA20 is done :)

Me too...
 

I've got a long block from where I spun a rod bearing several years ago. I'd love for this to work out well and relatively easily as I could just use the heads from that long block on a fa24 short block...and sell my used engine that's currently in the car when I swap it out and probably end up somewhere in the neighborhood of dead even...

Jaden

Who wouldn't like to have a brand new short block with 30% more displacement for practically nothing other than a little elbow grease?

p.s. you're in Mo Valley? I used to be the IT director for Moss bros. It's where I got my FRS...

Coming back to this, do we actually know if the 2022+ transmission has stronger 3rd and 4th gear sets? No real point unless this is the case given the cost difference between $2k for a new transmission and $150-500 for yet another used transmission.

I mulled it over a few weeks ago and ended up buying a Jack's Transmission. The real "solution" would be someone making a bell housing and rear trans mount that doesn't require welding (due to rulebook restrictions) to adapt a T5 or TKX to a FA.

It is going to be nowhere near that easy, even at it's easiest.

Check out the savage geese video they specifically mentioned this as well as other improvements in the gen2 trans when talking to their engineers. but yeah gen1 trans are now so cheap you can get 10 of those for the price of a new gen2

I believe all they did was shot-peening for the gears. I wouldn’t expect significant improvements to strength in those gears, but maybe all the little changes to all elements in the transmission will add up.

IAG getting interesting…

https://i.imgur.com/e35FX8K.png

I was hoping someone would look at making a "kit" to make this relatively simple. Question now will be whether this will be a kit for a complete motor swap (and with or without all the ECU, electronics, etc.), long-block or short-block.

Fingers crossed this isn't just vaporware, because my ideal path is still a 2.4L swap rather than forced induction... ;)

I would love to keep my Edelbrock and just have the 2.0L heads machined and keeping using the SC. If not, I’ll just do a built IAG 2.0L.

Oh yes baby! Come on IAG. I will drop some coin on this if its cheaper than the K24 swap and dose not need significant re-wire etc...

My custom twin supercharger will likely bolt right up to the fa24, so if the swap becomes viable with or without the fa20 heads, it might be a go for me.

Although I would prefer to be able to use the fa20 heads, since I already have a spare set, could sell the working fa20 in the car and would only have to pay for an fa24 short block.

Jaden

4th gear vs 3 gear. Also He has a vortech which nothing is home down low but it does show what the new 2.4 can do. Can't wait to see it with Tune and e85 only.

Additionally the SC car only made 240whp on 91. Add the widebody and big heavy 3 piece IG wheels the result seems legit.

Any word from IAG about progress?

I emailed them maybe a month ago, and they wouldn't officially say they were even working on it. They just said "we're not working on anything for the new BRZ/GR86 yet". ;)

The supercharger should bolt in place on the 2.4 using the 2.4 heads. The exhaust manifolds bolt right up from first gens.



From what earlier reports have shown, the crank trigger wheel isn't compatible with first gen ECU's, and it looked like the design is different enough that you can't just swap on a first gen trigger wheel. It looked like a second gen ECU is needed, but if someone is going to make parts that work with the first gen ECU and physically bolt to the 2.4 then it could get interesting.

Supercharger bolts to the intake ports, not the exhaust. Real test is the first gen intake manifold bolting on.

Exactly. The intake ports are different

Sent from my SM-G781B using Tapatalk

I'm also looking to do a FA24 swap, so far the biggest hurdle seams to be the crank sensor. I know they are different but is the crank plate that much different? Not sure if the ecu will read it or not... But someone did an Assent 2.4 swap and turbo into a crosstrek and used a wrx ecu to tune it up to 500hp so maybe it should be fine....

Quite a lot of people are actually starting this project already. I contact this recycler here in Norcal who's bought up a lot of totaled 2022 GR86/Brz and the engines and trans are almost gone immediately. It seems like these totaled cars aren't even ending up on the auction block at IAAI/Copart because the recyclers make a deal with them. All the ones I've tracked always say "pending auction date" and then disappears after awhile.

This user below bought one, maybe you can contact them on ig and see how they're doing it. They don't seem to be sharing info on forum etc.

Just give it time. This will be far cheaper than a K24 swap. Smart people will figure it out :)

FYI Recycler sold the Fa24+trans dropout + cluster for 7.5K plus tax to give ppl an idea on prices

It'll be interesting to see how they hold up on track longer term

That is inflation plus low supply and demand type of desperation prices. Prices should drop a lot, but it will take time. Those are LS3/LT1+transmission type of prices.

Yeah they are I agree but its also a drivetrain that's got like <1000miles on it

The totaled GR86 I mentioned on this post:
https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...4&postcount=26

Got bought by a guy on the Facebook forum for $6600 who lives in Lithuania!!.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/3908...00001310874847

We speculated at the time that the pole might have missed the engine/cranshaft or not but if you want to pull the engine and tow the car you can save / make a lot of money. GR86 seats are going for $1500

At this point maybe just wait for totaled GR corolla and get that G16E_GTS ( a lot of fabrication work obvi)

Did you see the damage on the GR86 the engine came from? Is there a warranty on the powertrain that it will have no issues, cracks or anything for a certain number of miles/time? You can buy a brand new K20C crate motor and new CD009 for that price. I get the low mileage, but that really doesn’t do anything for me. A proven powertrain with 30k that is cheaper would be better than rolling the dice on something expensive, which is why I like my $450-$1000 K24s.

It will be interesting to see the FA24D swaps once there are more chassis out there and they come down in price. I don't see the engine ever being as "cheap" as a FA20D. Hmm $7500 really isn't a lot for a swap setup that drops right in and passed emissions vs $12k+ for the Kswap just to make the same power.

The point of the k swap isn't power out of the box, it is track reliability, replacement cost, and weight distribution.

That said, the paths to make a fairly reliable 250-300whp NA are pretty well charted for the K.

I see the advantage of both. Perhaps a FA24 swap would be able to be certified for road use, but only if the stock ECU is used and so on. The big thing for me is if the FA24 blows then I would have to be ready to pay another $5k for a motor, where another K24 is under a grand. Having blown a FA20, I am apprehensive about the FA24, but I’m also optimistic with how it holds together with FI. If I was building a NA platform that was light weight then I would do the K24.

I agree with the track related benefits and am very aware of the power they have made. 250-300whp is primarily on fwd platforms though with less drive train loss. And of course fully built motors on E85. Its LS swap territory cost wise to go down that route. FI starts to make all the sense unless one is doing it for class rules. Also make no mistake, one of the main benefit of the kswap initially was power out of the box until the FA24D came out making more that predicted.



Which K24s are you looking at that are under $1k? Unless they have a ton of miles all the K24A2s MY04-08 I have come across are usually $1100 plus. I have seen a large amount of the CRV/Element K24s for cheap as they get slept on. Their heads for great for FI or Vtec Killer setups. :burnrubber: If my FA20 meets the same fate as yours did that is the route I am going.

Not sure if people have been following EMS Tuning:

https://i.imgur.com/yDecbVO.png
https://i.imgur.com/7yy0mT3.png
https://i.imgur.com/QOZH8ld.png

It is likely the FA24 will be similar in NA potential, which is to say it’ll make more than the FA20, but be similarly expensive and without the NA support from the aftermarket community, without much benefits. The K24 is proven, supported and well documented, and it is fairly cheap. $1100 versus sub $1000 is still much cheaper than $4500+ for a FA20/24. I bought mine from a Sacramento importer (see below), but I’ve seen them for cheaper in other states, where prices tend to be cheaper on most things. Check out the build below. If someone wanted to do a light weight NA build then the K24 is reliable and proven.

The K swap is more expensive, but only if we consider the price tag out of context. The Kpower kswap comes with some other components like a header, aluminum driveshaft and such things that are necessary, but increases the cost and makes it not an apples to apples comparison to just doing a K24 swap. Plus, the FA24 swap might require an aftermarket ECU. Side by side, the stock power is similar, but we don’t know how the FA24 will handle boost. The K24 can do 450whp all day long without cracking open the motor, and is a softer limit. Higher power levels are not unheard of, but a basic build with piston n rods and ARP headstuds will do 700whp+. The FA20 was a harder limit of 350whp, but it wasn’t always too reliable, as I know, so most people do an engine build. The K swap allows more power with better reliability without having to do a build engine, so most people considering the K swap aren’t comparing the FA20/24 to the K24; they are comparing a FA20/24 + built engine + motor replacement/consumables, if it blows, versus a stock K24. We will have to see if the FA24 has fixed the oil starvation issues and if it can hold much more horsepower with reliability.

I'm into my kswapped 86 for $7000. Usdm k24a2's can be found on eBay for cheap if you look hard enough. I paid $750 shipped for mine, so location wasn't even a factor. Only issue with the motor was stuck injectors. Im using the full kpower kit without ac, and could have come in at less than $7000 if I had been using a clutch that was compatible with the swap. I sold my fa20, act clutch, hks header, perrin over pipe, hks front pipe, and verus aos for $6500.

I think the fa24 will be great for someone that's either a diehard Subaru fan, or someone with a blown fa20 that just wants a oem upgrade.

The k24 swap is definitely on the pricey side IF you have a stock car with blown engine and don't have any parts to sell.

I'm into mine roughly $2.5k, but I had a supercharged motor setup with all of the goodies to part. Total cost right now is about $14.5k, but that includes a couple grand of parts that weren't required.

No, lie I completely forgot you can sell the current FA20 setup to help cover the cost. :bonk:

The engine is running and has been on the dyno.

https://i.postimg.cc/bSPz90hP/EMS-FA20-FA24.jpg


Facebook video of the engine running


https://i.postimg.cc/23dj8tQS/EMS-FA20-FA24-2.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/2VzkqxGF/EMS-FA20-FA24-3.jpg

Pretty awesome, FA20 Heads and FA24 Shortblock!

most likely FA20 ECU since its cracked already. I have serious doubts that the newer gen2 ECU can be cracked to the same point where anyone can load a tune with ODB anytime soon. The GR Yaris ECU apparently needs to be sent in to a tuner to get a tune flashed on there. sort of like a tethered jailbreak in the iOS world.

Hold on to those gen1 ECUs!

with that gauge cluster, i suspect they're running an aftermarket ecu. no reason to run a different gauge cluster if using the gen1 car that comes with a gen1 ecu and gen1 gauges.