Car feels better and more natural with hold traction off but why
 

Was at big willow today and I started in sport traction but even in this mode I felt I was fighting the car more and the traction was causing the car to feel more un settled at times. With full traction off minus the pedal dance the car felt more natural and I was able to put down a 3 sec faster lap time. Just looking for insight. Not that I am very fast and I need to work on my line and carry more speed.

Edit* does this mean I was over driving the car in sport traction mode?

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Sport traction mode (at least on 2013-2016 cars) is pretty intrusive, so in a track setting where you are trying to induce rotation to go faster, it thinks it is has to save you. On a track like Big Willow, that will probably be even more exaggerated given the higher speeds. As long as you are in control, full off should usually be faster.

The car pinches brakes on various wheels to pull you straight when it thinks you're getting out of control. This is not great for someone like you who knows how to drive and is expecting the car to react a paticular way at the limit of grip. It slows you down by robbing you of smoothness.

FWIW I leave the car in Sport Mode on scary tracks and have learned to live with/adapt to it (https://youtu.be/lzrb-mhxVA0) and I'm still quick. In fact, I know I hold back on scary tracks if I have all nannies off and that makes me slower.

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For new tracks I am not comfortable at or normally the first session I leave sport mode on till I am warm. I just love how the cars feels with all them off. It's almost a completely different feeling. And my car is 2013

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13-16 traction control is extremely intrusive. I've had it cut in on me on a cloverleaf on-ramp just going around at slightly higher than normal speed (like 40 mph getting up to 60).

I always have mine off, always.

The comments make sense. I do remember them fixing this for 2017. Glad to know it's not all me [emoji1787]

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It's pretty intrusive.

Try the pedal dance; it'll feel even more natural.

I am not sure I am ready for the pedal dance and no abs [emoji23][emoji14]

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Pedal dance leaves ABS active

Good to know. Looks like the pedal dance might be in my future

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Pedal dance removes e-diff and EBD (braking stability control). ABS (braking traction control) remains.

Interesting... I didn't know these cars had an e-diff as well. Is that the only difference between pedal dance and the center console button to disable traction/stability control?

ABS goes to single channel mode so it doesn't brake each wheel based on it's individual slippage any more. For example, you trail brake a little too hard into a corner with 4 channel ABS it will reduce brake pressure on the inside front wheel only to prevent lockup on that wheel and that wheel only allowing you to continue slowing the car into the corner with the other three wheels. In single channel mode it senses that inside front tire is locking up and reduces brake pressure on the entire system at all four wheels meaning you're all of a sudden going quicker then you want to, which has lead to me blowing apexes.

If you do it right you'll be quicker threshold braking to the point where the ABS doesn't even come into the equation and then being judicious with the throttle to not spin the inside wheel on exit instead of the e-lsd intervening. I'm just out there to have fun so the safety net has been more beneficial than harmful and the e-lsd isn't why I'm slow. And in my experience on other chassis the e-lsd function reacts to wheel slippage after the driver error so an aftermarket diff should limit e-lsd intervention. But I'm still on the stock LSD in this car.

Oh, if you're aggressive on the brakes and treat them like an on/off switch you may get ice mode with the pedal dance when you hit the brakes (and I mean HIT them) which the car thinks you're on a low grip surface and will reduce pressure in an attempt to regain control, which means you just sail past your braking point blowing the corner altogether. But you can get around this with a more progressive application of the brakes instead of trying to snap the pedal off on corner entry like I was several years ago.

Yes way too intrusive, even at very moderate speeds. It might not slow you down much on the street, but it steps in really fast. It sounds like on track it can really slow you down. I wouldn’t turn it completely off though unless I really knew the track. [emoji28]


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Sport mode on the '13-'16 is quite intrusive.

Track mode on the '17+ is what sport mode should've been. It allows more slip/yaw before interjecting. There's a nifty OEM chart that shows the level of difference but I can't find it right now.