Hoosier A7 lap times vs first 3 heat cycles?
 

I ran A7s for one session at Palmer today, set decent time. Tomorrow there will be 2 practice sessions followed by time trials. Wonder what to expect in terms of potential lap time degradation. Would like to at least run a partial practice session on the a7s before TT, but wonder if the additional heat cycle might cost me a few tenths to half a second...

Other tires are Conti ECS, 4.5-5 seconds slower and different diameter, so not best practice tires for TTing on the A7s!

Basically I'm wondering if I might lose more time by putting another heat cycle on them than I'd gain from having the additional practice on them...

Degradation from heat cycles is minimal for A7s. My advice is to ignore heat cycles and drive them until they cord. If you'd like to do your own analysis you can search for my transponder number in Race Hero, 1562231. I've used the same set of A7s in 2020 for every session except one where I went out on the Federal FZ201s I use to transport my car. After 12 heat cycles I can still set the fastest race time in T4 and the other people racing T4 around here are not slouches.

Ran 2nd session this AM, which others say was slow due to heat. Did 1:48.6 vs 1:48.7 yesterday. Top competition did 1:48.5 1st session but was a second slower 2nd session, he's in a nodded E36 M3 on A052s.
Also in class another BRZ on Pirelli slicks, 981 Cayman S on RE71Rs, they're low 1:50s (though I did a 48.2 in the Cayman yesterday!)
Interesting group!

Won TT with a 1:48.1 vs. M3 at 1:48.5 :)

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/62462864.jpg

Don't forget to collect any contingencies you may be eligible for!

Oh yeah, will do!

It was a great fun event with stiff competition from the M3. My bud's gambit with used Pirelli slicks on his BRZ emphatically did not pay off. He has gone faster on A052s! Pirellis musta been fossilized, durometer was 60 vs. 45 for the A7s...

Oh yeah, funny story about the 981 Cayman S driven by friend and co-worker. I kinda talked him into that car after driving a student's at the Glen last year. Anyway he was not finding the fast way around on Saturday and asked me to take it out while taking data and video (couldn't take him out with me due to club Covid restriction). After running a 1:48.2 I got into ice mode (apparently) going into T4. Foot hard on the brakes but it only gave me like 75% max braking and pedal was hard as a rock :O Went off and found the tire barrier with the front left corner, tires went flyin everywhere! I thought the front would be destroyed, but lo they use circle-track slicks for tire barrier for the motorcycles, they weigh like 8-10 lb. and are flimsy as hell! We 90% "fixed" it with that spray that cleans track rubber off, and looks like it'll be 98% fixed by peeling off and replacing the clear protective film he had put on the car. Whew!

Wow. That's gonna be one epic video!

I'd love to see a video with a data overlay showing brake driver input vs system pressure vs wheel speeds.

Glad both you and the car escaped relatively unscathed.

I will add a data point for ice mode. Mine was a Cayman S 978. Happened at turn 1 going CCW. Solved the issue with stiffer spring rates all around.

S and I was talking about the take offs last week, too bad the turn out was not as good. I was driving the new v730 at the glen over the weekend and was pretty confident it can go as fast as the fz201s but driver side wheel bearing when and had to end the event early.

And speaking of wheel bearings...its the 3rd one I had to change out. Thinking about just changing them all out on a yearly basis as a safety maintenance.

Speaking of the V730, can you PM me that link you mentioned? We met at the Palmer Open Lapping a few weeks ago and I can't find that site.




Nice work Dan!

Its https://www.onlinetires.com/

Checked earlier, looks like its currently sold out.

987?
Weird, I ran a 2011 non-S Cayman last year, on PASM springs (~30% stiffer vs. non-PASM), I never had this problem with braking.

The 981 Cayman S I drove at Watkins Glen and at NHMS was on Ohlins coilovers, and it would "hunt around" under hard braking and actually it gave me the "ICE mode" thing going into 3 at NHMS, I had to take the exscape road. For some reason I forgot about that when I was driving 981 at Palmer the other day!

Serves him right (j/k of course!), I was gonna just run Conti ECS street tires this year but when he got the slicks and bumped up to T60 it was just too tempting! So $$$$ on tires and also on lightweight battery and Girodisc front brake rotors. And instead of minimal-prep "arrive-and-drive" I had to load/unload wheels/tires from car and swap them 4x at the track.
It was worth it tho ;)

My front bearings were done after 2018 season, seven 2-day events. Replaced for free under warranty! My new setup should be less hard on the front bearings though I think. With 1.25" lowering and ~0.75" more bump travel lost to radial bearing in Raceseng camber plates, I was riding the outside front bump stop every turn. New setup with Bilsteins = way more front bump travel feels a LOT better and should be easier on front bearings, I hope?

Could a tuned NA twin stay with a base Boxter or Cayman on track? Lets say 200tw tires on both.

:iono:

I have been through 5 front hubs in 4 years. I think they don't handle high lateral loads well. 4 of my fronts have been right sides, most of the tracks I run are CCW.

Hunt around as the car is moving laterally while under heavy braking? And you can feel it in the steering wheel? Mine would do that at Thompson into 1.


Saturday was my 14th track day :eyebulge: But only at 7,000 miles. :D

Depends on the track, but generally a 987 base is going to be faster I think.
I ran BRZ day 1 and '11 base Cayman day 2 at Thomspon and Palmer last year, was only 0.4 sec quicker with the Cayman at Thompson on a very hot day, but 3 seconds quicker at Palmer. At WGI I did a 2:14 something in the Cayman last year vs. 2:18 with the BRZ in 2018.

I'm not tuned, but I doubt that a 93-pump tuned BRZ would be able to run with a 987 base at most tracks...

I would say depends on the track...and the driver.

Having owned a Cayman S as well as my 86, my 86 has beaten nearly all my Cayman's previous bests.

However, I attribute this more to me feeling more comfortable pushing the 86 towards the limits than I did in the Cayman, plus more experience gained since the Cayman.


Although somebody like Dan, at Palmer I would bet they would be pretty close. However, at WGI, I would say the Cayman would win hands down.

It depends on what you mean by tuned NA. Tires, exhaust and tune, suspension? Dont think so. Removing some weight and adding some aero on top of that? Sure it can, it can be faster even.

Yea, 195whp, Tarmac 2 coilovers and 245, 200tw tires. I guess the basic comparisons would be skidpad and braking numbers.

Yeah no, that wouldnt be enough. Assuming the porsche is in the same tire, the 100kg difference in weight between the two is not enough to offset the massive advantage the porsche will have with almost double the power. You could make the brz corner just as well or even better, but overall laptimes the porsche should always take it with only those mods on a brz/86.

I wonder if Best Motoring did this comparison already.

At an HPDE where there's a HUGE range in driver skill, sure. Hell I've gotten passes on R35 GTR's, and a few GT2's during HPDE's. On an actual competition day, where every driver is either a licensed comp driver or at the least a experienced driver, no. The Cayman/Boxster will be quicker given an equal skill driver.