Toyo R888Rs are super cheap... are they good for noobs?
 

Hi all!

Autocrossed an NC Miata and later BRZ for a couple of seasons. Diving into the wonderful (and soul crushingly expensive) world of tracking now.

I found that 215 45R 17 Toyo R888Rs are less than 100 dollars a pop on a few sites. Would they be good to learn on?

Ran one day with PS4Ses, the grip was good but I had to over-inflate them to avoid the shoulders from getting absolutely destroyed (I would rather save the PS4Ses for daily driving, I have a second set of wheels not being used right now anyway; can mount R888Rs on them).

Def thinking about camber bolts. I have lifetime alignment with FireStone and this particular shop is chill with doing aftermarket part adjustments as long as I bring the car to them with the parts attached.

That is a good price for a good track tire.
They may be a bit much for you, though, if you are just getting into driving on a track. You would likely improve your skills more quickly on a lower-performance tire.

Lol on the PS4s.
Your going to hit a learning curve regardless. Not much but it's still something.
I would say go for it. Those where a good tire for me back in the day not sure if they got better or not.

I wouldn't worry about it from the "noob" perspective,. If it's a deal, I say get them. But then I started tracking on bias-ply Hoosiers on my 240Z way back when :P Might as well learn on track-appropriate tires, I say...

Uhhh link please to these tire websites.

That's a great price! On which websites are you seeing it?

It will be harder to get on the limit and feel confident wth grippier tires. They are typically also a bit less progressive when losing grip.
You will be moving around more in the car due to the higher lateral forces and go faster in corner which means bigger consequences if you go off.

However if you've done AutoX and a track day I say go for it. Low grip tires will get you bored after couple times at the track and you don't find affordable tires every day.

Downside is they might be old stock which explains the heavy discount, but hey you gamble you live you learn, you'll still have the Michelins for backups stay safe out there and don't over drive your limits at first.

They're also terrible in anything other than the pinnacle of conditions. Get skills on cheaper tires first, you may not even like this size tire.

Buy them for me at those prices and I'll test them out for you.

Ha, as soon as I posted this they are out of stock.

Which one of you did this?

I bought old stock 2015 model kumho V720's, nothing wrong with em if you use em for driving, if you are trying to compete the newer models will do well

The whole grippy tire and "NOOB:" thing is gonna get you feedback as stated,
lower grip tires will teach you how to handle the car with mechanical grip, driving with the chassis, too grippy of a tire will teach you bad habits. but you have been autox-ing for a few seasons so i wouldnt say you are a noob

When you're new to tracking you don't want a super grippy tire. It may make your lap times faster, but it will mask mistakes and hinder your progress as a driver in the long run. Try something like the GT Radial SX2 that many in the 86 Cup series run. It's still fairly affordable and is an excellent tire to learn on.

Toyos R888R are actually a great tire to learn on. They dont have much grip for a R-compound tire, but they are very very progressive when the let go and they allow a lot of slip angle without losing much (if any) grip. My fastest times on them were always with big slip angles and slides in most corners. Easiest tire to drive on from the R-compounds (and some 200tw) I have tried, which are Nittos NT01, Maxxis RC1, RE71R, Yokos A052 and Conti DW sport (these are king in the water).

Too bad they went out of stock, that was a very sweet deal indeed, even if old (they cant be older than 2 years, since they havent been out more than that).

OP, they are still in stock. I just scored a set a few minutes ago. Came out to $392, used the $50 off $400 to get a free tire...picked one that I plan on completing the set in the future.

Scored a set of stock rims at about the same time to put these on. Gonna be my fun set. Already day dreaming sliding around temptation at Calabogie and most of the turns at Thompson.

In stock for cheap $$$ where? Tire Rack seems to have more normal prices for them...

While i'm here I'll just restate that as an instructor at the track, I don't think these tires or similar (NT01 etc.) are any problem at all for just about any noobs at the track. I'd rather have my students learn on track-appropriate tires than on OEM tires. That said, Hoosiers I would consider a waste of $$$ but most Extreme Performance and the more "streetable" R Comps I think are a good idea and better to learn on than OEM tires.

Thanks! But better than PS4S from a learning perspective?

I don't have direct experience with the PS4S, but given the tread pattern I suspect it would generate more heat and not stay at peak performance for as many laps, and also wouldn't provide the same kind of direct feedback from the contact patches as a good Extreme Performance or streetable R-comp tire. That said it's surely "close enough" that anyone casually/occasionally tracking an FT86 that came with PS4S could just use them and not bother with EP or Rcomp tires.

I'm not a track guy, but I've autocrossed quite a bit.

I get not starting on bias ply slicks or something, but I'm not sure I totally buy into the learn on crappy tires theory.

1) It is supposed to be fun.
2) You'll never stop learning. When is it appropriate to run the fun stuff?
3) If you don't pick a decent tire, you'll probably get frustrated pretty quickly. You may even pick up bad habits from trying to throw around a car on really bad tires.

less grippy tires ARE more fun... lap times aren't the fun part, unless the fun part to you is buying the way to faster lap times. The fun part is being at the limits as much as absolutely possible.

The fallacy in tracking is the thought that if you have a faster time, you did something right. This is only the case if all other conditions are the same. Fun stuff for me is still the cheaper / less grippy, but predictable tires... this is after running through the old PSS, ZII Star Spec, RS3, Z214, V12 Evo, SX2, RE71r, Toyo RR, V710s and RC1s (i think that runs the gamut of what I've run?).

At this point, I get whatever is most cost effective without being a safety concern (not doing 600tw all seasons that are going to chunk all over the place). I'd rather drive than spend more money on tires. Besides, it's more fun passing people, having them come up to you... and then all you have is a stock car with street tires on when they have _______ with _____ WHP and r-comps.

But... if you just need the faster lap time for bragging rights and have the money to burn, go for it!

I like the sound of that. So once I wear out the PS4Ses, should I hop on Indy 500s then?

I do want to get RE71Rs finally for autocrossing though :eyebulge::eyebulge:

One of the funnest track days I ever had was recently in the rain. Especially the early part of the day were it was not raining hard and the track was just kinda wet, no standing water. Tons of fun :burnrubber:

RE71R's are fun, they're just more expensive per smile.