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Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/index.php)
-   Issues | Warranty | Recalls / TSB (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=72)
-   -   How best to empty gas tank (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=129658)

pcguru2000 08-17-2018 04:41 PM
How best to empty gas tank
 
I assume when I get my oft, and put e85 in, that at some point I may have an issue with the car that I cannot fix. I would need to reset the ecu back to stock, and empty the e85 from the tank and refill it with 91 gas. Would I be able to suction the e85 out of the gas tank by the same method as we gas up? Or is it going to be blocked in some way?

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-17-2018 04:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122657)
I assume when I get my oft, and put e85 in, that at some point I may have an issue with the car that I cannot fix. I would need to reset the ecu back to stock, and empty the e85 from the tank and refill it with 91 gas. Would I be able to suction the e85 out of the gas tank by the same method as we gas up? Or is it going to be blocked in some way?

You have not done any research into flex-fuel or the OFT tunes have you? Simply continue to fill up on e85 or wait for the e85 to get low and fill up with 93 and switch to the 93 tune.

I can't think of an "issue" where you'd have more than 1/4 of a tank of e85 that would require you messing with the tune to flash back to 91-93, at least I haven't run into it. Do not going draining the tank through the fuel filler neck. You'd simply never run into an issue so suddenly NA that you didn't have the foresight to run the tank down...

pcguru2000 08-17-2018 05:23 PM
I saw a couple youtube videos of people with e85, starting the car, and the car dying 6 seconds later or not even being to start at all. If i'm not able to troubleshoot or fix the issue, I'll have to take the car into toyota for a look.

Yes, I have seen tons of videos of the procedure needed to switch from 91 to 85 and back with the oft. Watching the short term/long term, etc. It's not for that. This is my daily driver, so if it takes me 30 minutes to empty the tank, fill with 91, and tow it to toyota, they should be able to troubleshoot an on e85 related issue.

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-17-2018 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122668)
I saw a couple youtube videos of people with e85, starting the car, and the car dying 6 seconds later or not even being to start at all. If i'm not able to troubleshoot or fix the issue, I'll have to take the car into toyota for a look.

Yes, I have seen tons of videos of the procedure needed to switch from 91 to 85 and back with the oft. Watching the short term/long term, etc. It's not for that. This is my daily driver, so if it takes me 30 minutes to empty the tank, fill with 91, and tow it to toyota, they should be able to troubleshoot an on e85 related issue.
They're not going to troubleshoot a modified car without a huge troubleshooting/diagnostic fees and voiding your warranty. Most of the techs have no clue how the tunes work or how this car takes tunes. I want to see what videos you're talking about because they've done something inherently wrong.


With OFT the tune is pretty conservative you don't have to be FULLY empty on 91 to switch to e85 or vice versa.....

pcguru2000 08-17-2018 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FRSBRZGT86FAN (Post 3122700)
They're not going to troubleshoot a modified car without a huge troubleshooting/diagnostic fees and voiding your warranty. Most of the techs have no clue how the tunes work or how this car takes tunes. I want to see what videos you're talking about because they've done something inherently wrong.


With OFT the tune is pretty conservative you don't have to be FULLY empty on 91 to switch to e85 or vice versa.....
I agree with you, I don't think the e85 will cause a problem. I mean to say if I have to bring my car in for a NON e85 issue. Lets say my starter dies. My car would be stock except for the oft and e85. I would vacuum out the fuel tank, replace with 91, flash the car back to stock, and tow the car in. At that point, there's no visible mods. The only issue might be some ethanol left in the hoses and fuel rail. I would tell them the battery is fully charged, the started died. They would be concentrating on replacing the starter at that point and wouldn't think of anything. They would not know it was modified correct?

Once they started the car with a 91 in the tank but 85 in the lines...would this cause damage to the car? Once they suspected something, wouldn't all the e85 be gone from the lines/fuel rails?

NARFALICIOUS 08-17-2018 07:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122717)
I agree with you, I don't think the e85 will cause a problem. I mean to say if I have to bring my car in for a NON e85 issue. Lets say my starter dies. My car would be stock except for the oft and e85. I would vacuum out the fuel tank, replace with 91, flash the car back to stock, and tow the car in. At that point, there's no visible mods. The only issue might be some ethanol left in the hoses and fuel rail. I would tell them the battery is fully charged, the started died. They would be concentrating on replacing the starter at that point and wouldn't think of anything. They would not know it was modified correct?

Once they started the car with a 91 in the tank but 85 in the lines...would this cause damage to the car? Once they suspected something, wouldn't all the e85 be gone from the lines/fuel rails?
Why do people insist on defrauding the dealer/manufacturer?
You decide to mod the car to get 10 hp out of it.
If the warranty is denied, be prepared to fix it yourself or pay for a repair.
Or wait until after your warranty is expired to mod it.

Is your starter actually dead or is this a hypothetical situation? If your starter is dead and you have a 6MT, push start it and run the fuel out of the lines & switch out the tune. Put as much 91 back in it and keep running out the E85.


If it's at a dealer and you replaced the start but hadn't switched the tune and are running the wrong fuel (either way E85-->91 or 91-->E85) then the car will run rough. If they started looking into that issue, and reading the PIDs then they would see something is wrong. If they don't suspect you are tuned then they'll start troubleshooting other things being wrong and basically you're just creating additional problems.

SuperTom 08-17-2018 09:06 PM
use your mouth and syphon the gas out. And have a 5 gallon jug ready of what you want to put in.

pcguru2000 08-17-2018 09:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NARFALICIOUS (Post 3122731)
Why do people insist on defrauding the dealer/manufacturer?
You decide to mod the car to get 10 hp out of it.
If the warranty is denied, be prepared to fix it yourself or pay for a repair.
Or wait until after your warranty is expired to mod it.
This is in no way trying to defraud a manufacturer or dealer. I just don't want to put up with the hassle of being denied any warranty work unrelated to my mod. I've heard of owners being denied warranty work on their 4th gear synchros because they had an unrelated mod, when it's well know that unmodified stock cars have the same issue.

But I digress, I was just asking if someone was able to get a tube down into their gas tank from the gas door. I wanted to see if anyone has tried this and were successful at removing the fuel.

NARFALICIOUS 08-17-2018 11:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122759)
This is in no way trying to defraud a manufacturer or dealer. I just don't want to put up with the hassle of being denied any warranty work unrelated to my mod. I've heard of owners being denied warranty work on their 4th gear synchros because they had an unrelated mod, when it's well know that unmodified stock cars have the same issue.
In your given example, a starter/starting issue can definitely be related to E85 AND a tune. If you've done your research, you know E85 can have trouble starting in cold weather. Not saying this is your situation, but there is some relevance between the 2.

Quote:
Dealers are inherently lazy. Anything they can do to not have to do warranty work is the goal. The manufacturer pays them very little for warranty work and they would rather have someone like you, tell them you will pay them in cash at full price for all future work. It's a win win.
Except for tires & alignment, I do all my own work. I know the risks of modding a car. E85, pop tunes, boost, slammed cars, spacers, cut fenders, racing, etc, all this stuff. You cannot say this is what the manufacturer intended when they put a warranty on this car.

humfrz 08-17-2018 11:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122759)
But I digress, I was just asking if someone was able to get a tube down into their gas tank from the gas door. I wanted to see if anyone has tried this and were successful at removing the fuel.
Well, back in the day - that's how some folks got some of their gas - :D

However, with the twin, I would suggest removing the back seat, unscrewing the fuel pump mounting plate and siphoning it out. - :)


humfrz

Tcoat 08-18-2018 12:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122759)
This is in no way trying to defraud a manufacturer or dealer. I just don't want to put up with the hassle of being denied any warranty work unrelated to my mod. I've heard of owners being denied warranty work on their 4th gear synchros because they had an unrelated mod, when it's well know that unmodified stock cars have the same issue.

Dealers are inherently lazy. Anything they can do to not have to do warranty work is the goal. The manufacturer pays them very little for warranty work and they would rather have someone like you, tell them you will pay them in cash at full price for all future work. It's a win win.

But I digress, I was just asking if someone was able to get a tube down into their gas tank from the gas door. I wanted to see if anyone has tried this and were successful at removing the fuel.
Most dealers are not lazy nor wish to deny warranty work and do indeed do warranty work everyday without question or hassle. They do however need to protect themselves and their other customers from people that will indeed defraud them. The reason they are suspicious is that people try to pull that crap all the time. If you feel you need to change a car back to get warranty work then you also know that those mods could get you denied. Changing it back and then saying "I don't know it just stopped working" is a decision to defraud. If you mod your car then you accepted the risk that something would break and not be covered by warranty. If you think otherwise your sense of entitlement is outstanding. You want warranty don't change things that could impact it. You want to mod then man up and accept you may be denied.
Warranty costs get built into the price of cars and we all end up paying for them in the end. I don't mind paying for legit claims but I will be damned if I want to pay for some entitled snowflake that blew his engine up with a bad tune and then felt it should be replaced under warranty.

humfrz 08-18-2018 01:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 3122801)
Most dealers are not lazy nor wish to deny warranty work and do indeed do warranty work everyday without question or hassle. They do however need to protect themselves and their other customers from people that will indeed defraud them. The reason they are suspicious is that people try to pull that crap all the time. If you feel you need to change a car back to get warranty work then you also know that those mods could get you denied. Changing it back and then saying "I don't know it just stopped working" is a decision to defraud. If you mod your car then you accepted the risk that something would break and not be covered by warranty. If you think otherwise your sense of entitlement is outstanding. You want warranty don't change things that could impact it. You want to mod then man up and accept you may be denied.
Warranty costs get built into the price of cars and we all end up paying for them in the end. I don't mind paying for legit claims but I will be damned if I want to pay for some entitled snowflake that blew his engine up with a bad tune and then felt it should be replaced under warranty.
AMEN to that!


humfrz

Ultramaroon 08-18-2018 02:01 AM
http://i.imgur.com/jnIhXu8.gif

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-18-2018 04:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122717)
I agree with you, I don't think the e85 will cause a problem. I mean to say if I have to bring my car in for a NON e85 issue. Lets say my starter dies. My car would be stock except for the oft and e85. I would vacuum out the fuel tank, replace with 91, flash the car back to stock, and tow the car in. At that point, there's no visible mods. The only issue might be some ethanol left in the hoses and fuel rail. I would tell them the battery is fully charged, the started died. They would be concentrating on replacing the starter at that point and wouldn't think of anything. They would not know it was modified correct?

Once they started the car with a 91 in the tank but 85 in the lines...would this cause damage to the car? Once they suspected something, wouldn't all the e85 be gone from the lines/fuel rails?
Quote:
Originally Posted by NARFALICIOUS (Post 3122779)
In your given example, a starter/starting issue can definitely be related to E85 AND a tune. If you've done your research, you know E85 can have trouble starting in cold weather. Not saying this is your situation, but there is some relevance between the 2.


Except for tires & alignment, I do all my own work. I know the risks of modding a car. E85, pop tunes, boost, slammed cars, spacers, cut fenders, racing, etc, all this stuff. You cannot say this is what the manufacturer intended when they put a warranty on this car.

The example you gave is so outlandish and absurd for a car on powertrain warranty to have a dead starter. Listen to Narfalicious statements. If your running E85 simply drive the cars fuel down before maintenance dealership work. If you have a serious issue that prevents your auto FRS from starting and you use your OFT to CONFIRM it's not tune related or e85 related and it needs to be towed from a dealer:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80652

You should properly drain the tank from inside the car removing the rear seats and pumping the e85 out and replacing it with 93 octane (which is honestly what you should be using if its available not 91 you keep mentioning)

Once they started the car with a 91 in the tank but 85 in the lines...would this cause damage to the car? Once they suspected something, wouldn't all the e85 be gone from the lines/fuel rails?

No because at this point your back on the stock tune, they wouldn't be looking at the fuel in the fuel rails or lines. Also how is there "e85" in the lines, they don't see the mix value and most mechanics won't be deep into technstream enough to see the engines LTFT, IAM, STFT to know your ethanol content is higher.


I HIGHLY suggest you do more research into OFT and tuning your car before you do anything else, your questions and lack of knowledge is startling especially when you have posted threads like this:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127664


As said before, you are not only defrauding a dealership getting warranty work done on a modded car, but hurting the process for everyone. It also highly unlikely on an NA car with just e85 to run into a serious issue that disables the vehicle and you don't know how to fix it...

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-18-2018 04:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 3122801)
Most dealers are not lazy nor wish to deny warranty work and do indeed do warranty work everyday without question or hassle. They do however need to protect themselves and their other customers from people that will indeed defraud them. The reason they are suspicious is that people try to pull that crap all the time. If you feel you need to change a car back to get warranty work then you also know that those mods could get you denied. Changing it back and then saying "I don't know it just stopped working" is a decision to defraud. If you mod your car then you accepted the risk that something would break and not be covered by warranty. If you think otherwise your sense of entitlement is outstanding. You want warranty don't change things that could impact it. You want to mod then man up and accept you may be denied.
Warranty costs get built into the price of cars and we all end up paying for them in the end. I don't mind paying for legit claims but I will be damned if I want to pay for some entitled snowflake that blew his engine up with a bad tune and then felt it should be replaced under warranty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3122759)
This is in no way trying to defraud a manufacturer or dealer. I just don't want to put up with the hassle of being denied any warranty work unrelated to my mod. I've heard of owners being denied warranty work on their 4th gear synchros because they had an unrelated mod, when it's well know that unmodified stock cars have the same issue.

Dealers are inherently lazy. Anything they can do to not have to do warranty work is the goal. The manufacturer pays them very little for warranty work and they would rather have someone like you, tell them you will pay them in cash at full price for all future work. It's a win win.

But I digress, I was just asking if someone was able to get a tube down into their gas tank from the gas door. I wanted to see if anyone has tried this and were successful at removing the fuel.

Take what @Tcoat said to heart


Have you ever even worked in a dealer setting before? How the hell would you know that "dealers are lazy"? That's not even true.


Dealers will do anything they can for warranty work because corporate is reimbursing them the cost, not the dealership. I can say this for a fact as my friend currently works at a subaru dealership and they particularly love CPO certifying cars as it allows them a reimbursement for the process and warranty repairs.

Don't try and pretend you aren't trying to defraud a dealership because you are, your running e85 and an OFT tune and are attempting to hide the fact for a future repair while your still under warranty. Plain and simple.

chaoskaze 08-18-2018 08:43 PM
...get flex fuel will ya? Don't play with nonsense.

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-19-2018 04:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chaoskaze (Post 3123034)
...get flex fuel will ya? Don't play with nonsense.
Still, that's even harder for this guy to remove and try to get a warranty scam claim done :lol:

pcguru2000 08-23-2018 09:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 3122801)
I don't mind paying for legit claims but I will be damned if I want to pay for some entitled snowflake that blew his engine up with a bad tune and then felt it should be replaced under warranty.
42K+ posts and 4 years on this forum, you should know better than to be using language like that. A definition of a "snowflake" is:

"US, informal disapproving an insulting word for a gay person:
Example: Once again, a Facebook troll called me a snowflake."

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...lish/snowflake

Tcoat 08-23-2018 10:26 PM
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3124976)
42K+ posts and 4 years on this forum, you should know better than to be using language like that. A definition of a "snowflake" is:

"US, informal disapproving an insulting word for a gay person:
Example: Once again, a Facebook troll called me a snowflake."

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...lish/snowflake

It's nice to know that the gay community is hated in this forum. This kind of bad behavior has destroyed bloging sites when all advertisers pulled their advertisements because of things like this.
You went with a gay definition? Really? How hard did you have to look to find that definition. In what possible context could my use of the word be implied to mean gay?
I didn't even know it was used in that context so you can reign in the indignation and sense of offense.
I used the term in it's much more common manner and apparently hit the nail right on it's entitled snowflake head.

Impureclient 08-23-2018 10:38 PM
Wait, gay people can drive now? And they don't like snow! So much to learn in this place.

Tcoat 08-23-2018 10:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impureclient (Post 3124999)
Wait, gay people can drive now? And they don't like snow! So much to learn in this place.
Oh dude you never been to the Miata forum?

ermax 08-23-2018 10:53 PM
This car has plenty of common problems (unrelated to E85) that very well could leave the car stranded with E85 in the tank. For example we all know E85 will not cause a rocker to eject but we do know rockers eject in this car. I personally would be pissed if my car had a common failure and was denied a warranty claim for something like an axel back or some other unrelated mod. E85 is significantly more forgiving than petrol. The OTS tune is fairly conservative too. I don’t see anyone blowing an engine due to the OTS E85 tune. I don’t see how the term snowflake applies to the OP. Now let’s say he ran the car with no oil and then filled it up and then took it in, then we would have a clear case of fraud.

pcguru2000 08-23-2018 11:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 3124995)
You went with a gay definition? Really? How hard did you have to look to find that definition. In what possible context could my use of the word be implied to mean gay?
I didn't even know it was used in that context so you can reign in the indignation and sense of offense.
I used the term in it's much more common manner and apparently hit the nail right on it's entitled snowflake head.
I do a lot of business in the gay community and they are the most picked on group on the planet. They are the most loyal clients out of all the clients I have. If my wife and I get invited to a gay bar, we are not called names and harassed because we are a straight couple in a gay bar . On the other hand, I've seen my clients being called snowflakes for no other reason than the person saying it is a piece of crap and it sickens me.

Btw, 42K of posts and you don't think the forum rules apply to you?
1) Respect. By far the most important rule here. Basic rules of real life apply here - show each other respect and you will get respect as well. Don't bash someone else here because you feel like it. Disrespectful, derogatory or insulting attitudes or remarks will not be tolerated. This applies to all corners of the site - including posts, profile visitor messages, and thread tags.

3) Disagree, don't attack. Disagree on topics, but try to leave it at that. Just because you don't like someones opinion on the car's engine, doesn't mean you should call him and his mother all sorts of names. Debates are always welcome, but don't go out of your way to insult and flame someone. Please consider if you would say to someone's face the same thing you are posting.

4) Help. Be helpful, we are all probably here because of a question and people will go out of their way to help you. Try to do the same if you have the answer to a question posted. True enthusiasts are helpful to others, noob or veteran alike. If you think not telling others about some technical info you have will make you and your car unique and prefer to be unique rather than share this information, then this forum is not for you. Help each other with questions and answers and I guarantee you, one day it will pay you back on here.

pcguru2000 08-23-2018 11:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ermax (Post 3125008)
This car has plenty of common problems (unrelated to E85) that very well could leave the car stranded with E85 in the tank. For example we all know E85 will not cause a rocker to eject but we do know rockers eject in this car. I personally would be pissed if my car had a common failure and was denied a warranty claim for something like an axel back or some other unrelated mod. E85 is significantly more forgiving than petrol. The OTS tune is fairly conservative too. I don’t see anyone blowing an engine due to the OTS E85 tune. I don’t see how the term snowflake applies to the OP. Now let’s say he ran the car with no oil and then filled it up and then took it in, then we would have a clear case of fraud.
I totally agree. I don't believe that oft using e85 could cause any harm, or else I wouldn't be contemplating getting one in about 6 months. I like to prepare for an alternative in case something happens completely unrelated to the use of e85. If I get repairs done by the dealers, something going bad on the next visit can't put the blame on a non Toyota dealer doing bad work. We know the technicians don't want to work on a car that has current modifications because this can complicate troubleshooting. By emptying the tank of e85 and putting in regular gas, removing any mods (SRI, CAI) even innocent things like an aftermarket filter, makes their job easier and focuses the technician on diagnosing the problem without having to adjust for even a small variance that a mod my create (although small enough to not cause any sort of damage). That's why I probably won't be getting any kind of exhaust modification, changing the wheels, or cutting into any wires.

humfrz 08-23-2018 11:43 PM
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3125010)
The only nail you hit on the head is the one that outs you as a biggot. You couldn't even come up with a website quote of a real dictionary site, you had to find an obscure definition from "the urban dictionary"? (an on and on)

humfrz

Ultramaroon 08-23-2018 11:49 PM
Would've been refreshing to hear honest agreement.


Less exhausting to read too.

SuperTom 08-23-2018 11:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3124976)
42K+ posts and 4 years on this forum, you should know better than to be using language like that. A definition of a "snowflake" is:

"US, informal disapproving an insulting word for a gay person:
Example: Once again, a Facebook troll called me a snowflake."

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...lish/snowflake

It's nice to know that the gay community is hated in this forum. This kind of bad behavior has destroyed bloging sites when all advertisers pulled their advertisements because of things like this.
I thought a snowflake is a whiney leftist or someone who whines a lot in general. Never heard it used to describe someone's sexuality

BirdTRD 08-24-2018 12:17 AM
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperTom (Post 3125030)
I thought a snowflake is a whiney leftist or someone who whines a lot in general. Never heard it used to describe someone's sexuality
Same here...

ermax 08-24-2018 01:01 AM
Add me to the list that had no clue it was a derogatory term towards transgenders. I’ve only known it to be used to describe people who get offended by literally everything, want everything for free and thinks the government needs to take care of everyone. Seems to get thrown around improperly in political debates when someone runs out of substance and then resorts to personal insults.

FRSBRZGT86FAN 08-24-2018 01:15 AM
Rocker Failure? On cars that aren't 2013s and 2014s? Does that even still happen anymore?

humfrz 08-24-2018 01:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3124976)
42K+ posts and 4 years on this forum, you should know better than to be using language like that. A definition of a "snowflake" is:

"US, informal disapproving an insulting word for a gay person:
Example: Once again, a Facebook troll called me a snowflake."

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...lish/snowflake

It's nice to know that the gay community is hated in this forum. This kind of bad behavior has destroyed bloging sites when all advertisers pulled their advertisements because of things like this.
Not in my 75 years have I heard THAT definition of a "snowflake" - :iono:


humfrz

Ultramaroon 08-24-2018 01:37 AM
It's the snowflake definition of snowflake.

Tcoat 08-24-2018 07:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcguru2000 (Post 3125010)
The only nail you hit on the head is the one that outs you as a biggot. You couldn't even come up with a website quote of a real dictionary site, you had to find an obscure definition from "the urban dictionary"?

Nice try to pass this off as a "I didn't know that it meant that". That's like saying the N word really means your Nigerian. Your so full of it. "Reign in the indignation and sense of offense" to try to turn this into something else? Only a bigot would say that.

Lets see...the urban dictionary says that the N word definition is
"A fully grown nigglet
Look at how fast that nigglet grew up. He's a N..ger now"

By your logic, I guess you can use the N word in the forum too and use urban dictionary to feign ignorance. It doesn't mean that in Canada!! Don't be offended.

Even if your local area in Canada uses the word this way, you can't be dumb enough to not know it's used in a derogatory way against transgender and gay people in the U.S. and other countries. Just be a man and apologize to the gay/lesbian/transgenders that are too scared to say something and move on.

I do a lot of business in the gay community and they are the most picked on group on the planet. They are the most loyal clients out of all the clients I have. If my wife and I get invited to a gay bar, we are not called names and harassed because we are a straight couple in a gay bar . On the other hand, I've seen my clients being called snowflakes for no other reason than the person saying it is a piece of crap and it sickens me.

Btw, 42K of posts and you don't think the forum rules apply to you?
1) Respect. By far the most important rule here. Basic rules of real life apply here - show each other respect and you will get respect as well. Don't bash someone else here because you feel like it. Disrespectful, derogatory or insulting attitudes or remarks will not be tolerated. This applies to all corners of the site - including posts, profile visitor messages, and thread tags.

3) Disagree, don't attack. Disagree on topics, but try to leave it at that. Just because you don't like someones opinion on the car's engine, doesn't mean you should call him and his mother all sorts of names. Debates are always welcome, but don't go out of your way to insult and flame someone. Please consider if you would say to someone's face the same thing you are posting.

4) Help. Be helpful, we are all probably here because of a question and people will go out of their way to help you. Try to do the same if you have the answer to a question posted. True enthusiasts are helpful to others, noob or veteran alike. If you think not telling others about some technical info you have will make you and your car unique and prefer to be unique rather than share this information, then this forum is not for you. Help each other with questions and answers and I guarantee you, one day it will pay you back on here.
You totally ignore the first definition to say I used it as the second. Your reference is the ONLY place I can find that uses it that way. I did not know but will continue to use it in the context that it is commonly recognized.
I am not apologizing to any community because I have not insulted any community. You have tried to twist the use of one word into something totally different . That is on you not me.
You cite the rules and then proceed to break just about all of them in the same post. Yet another sign you are a true snowflake.


https://thefederalistpapers.org/wp-c...2514111611.jpg

humfrz 08-24-2018 01:29 PM
I found this interesting:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/word...e-of-snowflake



humfrz

Tcoat 08-24-2018 01:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by humfrz (Post 3125199)
Hmmmm not a single reference as a derogatory term for any sexual orientation.
Pretty accurate description of how I used it though.


"but the meaning at first was a bit softer, referring mostly to millennials who were allegedly too convinced of their own status as special and unique people to be able (or bothered) to handle the normal trials and travails of regular adult life".

The only difference I would give it is that I would not say specifically millennials but it applies to any and all people that think they are somehow special and have such delicate constitutions that they cry as soon as anybody disagrees with them.

SuperTom 08-24-2018 02:26 PM
https://i.imgur.com/Mhqcfhf.jpg

HKz 08-24-2018 02:53 PM
man why can't we have an Annual Clown Contest each year where we vote for our favorite posters through a single elimination draw....guess I miss menstennisforums :(


OP probably has the best collection of posted threads out of any '18 member.

Tcoat 08-24-2018 03:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HKz (Post 3125242)
man why can't we have an Annual Clown Contest each year where we vote for our favorite posters through a single elimination draw....guess I miss menstennisforums :(


OP probably has the best collection of posted threads out of any '18 member.
We did that once. Can't find the thread though since I don't recall the title.


Found it!


https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98571

HKz 08-24-2018 03:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 3125254)
We did that once. Can't find the thread though since I don't recall the title.


Found it!


https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98571
:clap: we need another one!

Tcoat 08-24-2018 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HKz (Post 3125260)
:clap: we need another one!
Different forum with different regulars these days. Not sure it would go over as well now.


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