Noob E85 question
 

Ok so there’s a couple of “flexfuel” stations on my way to work (I want to to run E85 when it gets warmer out without the FFK, maybe permanently). The one Sheetz that has it says “51-83% ethanol”. This is fine, I’ve done my research and know each station/fill up will vary with the ethanol %. I’ve seen that the OFT E85 tune can be as low E50, which I’ll be cautious of.

I’m confused though because the Sheetz I went to with the flexfuel says the flexfuel has 51-83% ethanol, but the button to fill it up is 94 octane I believe... is it not the same thing, and should I not use this?

I’m sorry guys I really tried to search this :bonk:

You need a flex fuel kit to safely use pump ethanol.

Yeah I understand that, and it’s definitely on the top of my mods list. I more or less just want to run a couple of tanks to make sure it’s worth investing in.

Like I said before though, the pump I’m looking at says 94 on the button, yet it says “flexfuel” on it with 51-83% ethanol. So that’s why I’m confused. I know me doing the E85 OTS isn’t ideal, but it seems like I’ll be fine for a tank or 2 ASSUMING this is actually E85 (or E60 or whatever). I was under the impression the 94 octane would be like E20 or something since E85 is over 100 octane roughly


I know I’m getting these numbers a bit scattered, but I hope my point is somewhat understandable.

You have to find the pump with e85 in it. Most stations only have one e85 pump(2 if you count the other side). Whatever the button says, the pump will dispense it.

You won't be "fine" with e85 without a e85 tune. It only takes once bad batch of fuel to damage an engine. Flex fuel kit is the safest way. OFT E85 tune works fine, but isn't as safe.

Got ya. Yeah I was going to use the E85 OFT tune for it. But ok got ya, yeah I just stopped after I saw the flexfuel pump that said the 51-83% ethanol so maybe I just skipped over it.

Thanks for the responses guys

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...19ffcc1848.jpg

Ok it looks exactly like this. You can see it says flexfuel on it to the left, but the 94 octane is there...


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There's a reason why it is called MINIMUM OCTANE RATING.

Based on the ethanol mix provided, it is FlexFuel rated at a minimum of 94 octane. Run it and blow your engine up.

Not very hard to decipher.

-alex

Lol ok big man that’s why I was asking, I’m asking so I can learn. My profession is in health, not anything in mechanics.

Yes, but you already provided the answer in your first reply... you already knew the answer but didn't realize it.

"I was under the impression the 94 octane would be like E20 or something since E85 is over 100 octane roughly"

And every pump out there says "minimum octane rating". So... based on what you already know, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that 94 octane minimum = 53-83% ethanol?

Ah, ok. I guess I just need to research the ethanol and octanes more, I assumed that having a minimum of 50% ethanol would mean E50, which would be more than 94 octane. Didn’t realize how that worked.

I think it’s kind of hard to have that kind of mindset though when a lot of the threads on here end up being pretty conflicting with “oh yeah the OFT E85 tune can accommodate for nothing lower than E50, the ECU will accommodate and you’ll be fine”, and then have the other end of the spectrum saying “flexfuel or don’t do it.”

I guess I’m just eager to run the ethanol and would defend the people saying it’ll be fine lol. Sounds like I should just be responsible and save for that FF kit

There's a lot of nomenclatures that people completely overlook when it comes to vehicle ownership. Octane rating is one of the major ones... no station out there will ever give you an exact rating, they will just give you the minimum so they are legally covered, since they usually only have 2 tanks from which to provide fuel to mix to give you the octane rating you are buying at the pump.

Another newbie question, can you still use petro even if your car has a flex fuel tune? Don’t ask why I’m just curious.

Yes, that's the nice thing about flex fuel. It will adapt for the ethanol content in the fuel you have from normal pump gas to e85.

Yeah I think this forum proves my ignorance to a lot of things on my car unfortunately. It’s good to start making myself aware though

most gases already contain 10% ethanol in them... regardless if that's 87, 89, 91, 93 etc... the range you are seeing in ethanol depends on the state in which you live in. IL states that "E85" can be as low as 50ish % ethanol and is considered to be legal "E85" (85% ethanol). But to answer the question that seems like it has been answered already, You will definitely need a flex fuel kit and a flex fuel tune. You will run the risk of harming your engine and that definitely isn't worth it. It's also been proven that flex fuel is definitely worth the investment whether it's NA or FI. It really wakes the car up. happy modding!

50%, that sucks. California minimum is 70%. Mine always runs between 78 and 81.

Flex fuel kit is nice. Just put in whichever, car figures it out.

do i need to drain the fuel tank completely before putting new tank of different fuel?

get a kit, test the fuel and see what the ethanol content is. OFT will run 60-90% and be OK, you need to monitor your AFR and fuel trims however. before you do anything, id suggest doing some more reading so you can understand what it is you are doing before you do it. Toyota isn't going to help you if you damage the car putting the wrong fuel in it on a tune you got from the internet....tread carefully, and arm yourself with knowledge.

One of the things you'll eventually learn is: the 86 has an awesome ECU and is almost idiot-proof when it comes to E85 & 93.

I've forgotten to select my E85 tune several times, and have driven around on my 93 tune for several miles before realizing it. And vice versa (drove on my E85 tune after filling up with 93).

I wouldn't recommend it, but unless you're racing your car, you won't blow your engine driving around 'normally' on either E85 or 93.

If you have a flex fuel kit & tune, no you don't. The kit/tune will adapt to any mixture of 93/E85 you put in your tank.
If you don't have a flex fuel kit (and only have the tune), yes it's ideal to run your fuel down as low as you can before filling up with another type of fuel.

Yup this is my daily driver so I’m definitely gonna read and watch a lot. I don’t think I’ve had a day yet that I haven’t monitored my fuel trims and IAM on my tablet, still the best investment for my car thus far. Hopefully engineering explained will answer my questions and I’ll be able to stop making noob threads :)

I got lucky and found a station or two here in Chicago that is straight e85 lol :burnrubber:. But the Shell gas stations that offer their flex fuel... that shit is like e50.....

That's a weird set up. At the E85 stations here it just says E85 on the handle and gives the minimum ethanol content on the pump. On a few pumps there's a minimum ethanol content, on others there's a range from min to max. On one pump there's a sticker that says min 51%, but another sticker on the same pump that says 60-90%....

On the pump you posted above, the sticker says 51-83, so if there's no other filling station for E85 in town, I'd try that one but monitor fuel trims closely. Get your tank ALL the way down to under 1 gallon or so then fill half the tank with the E85 and tune on E85 normally. That way if you do find it's only E40 or something like that (I don't know why it would) you can fill the tank the rest of the way with 93 and run lean on a 93 tune until you run that tank out. If your fuel trims are OK, you know the fuel is safe to use on the E85 tune.

I'd recommend getting an OBD2 port reader and Torque Pro and just keep an eye on your fuel trims after each fill up. Don't put the hammer down immediately after filling up, know what you got for fuel before stomping on it, so give it a few miles. Around here I have found that the stations run high ethanol %, my fuel trims are always closer to +10 (on 93 up until February I always ran a little rich, it's not an intake or exhaust leak) sometimes I add some 93 to bring LTFT down a bit.

Most importantly- READ UP on E85. Know what you're getting in to. Shiv runs Open Performance and has a lot of info on E85 on this forum.