How long to wait before changing MT fluid?
 

I just picked up my '17 BRZ the other day, and am already feeling the famous 1st/2nd gear clunk/notchiness.

I know I'll replace the MT fluid eventually, but should I wait till the car/transmission is broken in before replacing the fluid?

The notchiness will be there for several thousand km. It'll gradually get slightly better and you'll learn to push the clutch in - wait a second - and then engage first. First to second is notchy til the fluid warms up.

I just swapped mine at 20K km and my mechanic said it was black. I switched it out to Motul 300 and that just made it even more notchy. So either use OEM or something else other than Motul. Honestly wouldn't recommend it for colder climates.

I hear it will get better over time. So I'm willing to wait for a bit.

The weather in the PNW isn't so cold in the winter. Shouldn't be a problem.

Congratulations on your purchase and welcome to our forum ....... :clap:

I suggest you refer to your car's maintenance manual for frequency of fluid changes for average driving. The manual for my 2013 says to inspect at 22,500 miles ....... it never does say to change it ...... ;) :iono:

The 1>2 gear change on a cold transmission seems to just be the nature of the beast. I suggest you let the transmission warm up a bit and then just pull the shifter slowly and firmly into 2nd gear.

Be more concerned about running up onto parking stops ...... OUCH!


humfrz

I was actually talking about an unschedule transmission oil change. Basically I want the better shifter feel as soon as possible--not necessarily when the manual says so.

Well OK then.

You can change the transmission oil to whatever oil you want as often as you wish. There are about a half dozen brands of oil recommended here on the forum, with the first change being from 1,000 miles to never.

So, when is the transmission "broken in" ..?? Some say it's broken in from the factory, some say after 20-30,000 miles, some say ..... never.

The MT on my 2013 FR-S has always shifted just fine, warm or cold, so, I haven't changed the transmission oil in the past 5 years or 25,000 miles.

I believe ol @Tcoat has over 100,000 miles on his FR-S with the factory fill.

Then some other folks change transmission oil faster that Johnny Cash can kiss a duck.

Your call ...... ;)


humfrz

Change it right now!

In my experience so far the transmission feels better as the miles pile up. Haven't changed the lube yet, will probably do that at 30k. In the meantime, you might try a weighted shift knob. That, in addition to breaking the box in, changed the feel of mine substantially for the better.

Intervals can vary anywhere from 15k-30k depending on how you drive the car.

It was recommended to me to change the trans fluid after you break in the car. Many have complained the fluid was milky and had shavings from the factory. Mine was this way too when i changed it at 3k.

Many people recommend Motul gear 300 for trans and diff, and i do too. I'm coming up on 25k which is the recommended mileage, so ill be doing mine shortly. Since i can't find shops that sell it locally, i ordered from Counterspace Garage who also send crush washers. Waiting on that package to arrive.

lol

Followed break-in period. Changed at 2000 miles.

Shifting actually feels better or placebo? Either way, shifting feels better...LOL

Thanks for the replies!

I drove for a bit longer and definitely noticed a huge difference once the car was properly warmed up. I'm sure a combination of the the transmission breaking in, swapping fluids, and installing a new shifter/bushing setup will be more than enough to do the job :)

Maybe I'm the oddball, but I bought a '17 86 last November, have 22000 miles on it and around 150 autocross runs. Haven't felt any notchy shifts or ground a single gear so far. Just changed over to MT-90, still feels the same.

It doesn't get freaky cold here, but I do spend a fair bit of time in Wenatchee and even in 15-20 degree weather it feels just fine cold.

I have a 2017, and it need to be really cold. At 15F I only begin to feel a bit of notchyness on 2nd and 3rd gear. And colder it get much worse, below 0F it's almost imposible to shift in second unless i double clutch. But it's only for a short time, after driving for 1 minutes it's a lot better.
Next winter I'll consider changing to a different MT oil to see if that help.

I've changed mine every 25-30k miles. After about 30k miles the fluid / shifts aren't as good as on fresh fluid. Same for the diff, its quieter and operates better on fresh fluid.

The gearbox will always feel a bit hard to use on the first few shifts after cold start. I almost always double clutch into 2nd and 3rd gear on my warmup lap around the block to avoid snicking gears or grinds. After a couple double-clutch rev-matched upshifts and a bit of slow cruising, the gearbox is usually warmed up well enough for normal shifts.

I'm surprised to hear that. I'm in the same area, and have some fairly rough shifts right out of the garage.

Well, my 2013 FR-S MT with 25,000 miles and the OEM oil, is in the same general area as where you live and I never have experienced a rough shift, even when it's cold.

I do notice the 1-2 shift is a bit stiff, for the first few blocks.......:iono:


humfrz

My sense is that there a good bit of variation between these gearboxes. Not necessarily a dig on their quality control--rather that every car is just different.

After another week of driving, I think mine is loosening up a bit.

Well now, that could be.

However, I figure that the main variation is with the people doing the shifting ........:D


humfrz

No doubt. I won't claim to be the best :D

Ahhh.....well, you will get more used to it, as the miles and shifts go by.

Then, just as you think you have it mastered, you will get the "lazy leg" and occasionally not push the clutch all the way down and grind a gear. Or, "kill it" starting off on a slight hill ...... usually in heave traffic, with lots of people watching you......:sigh:

I kinda get the "feeling" from reading this forum, that most people that have more "trouble" shifting this transmission, are the people that are relatively new to manual transmissions.

Us old farts that were shifting transmissions, before automatics were available in most cars, seem to have the least trouble.

:burnrubber:


humfrz

I learned on a Case 380. Getting in a car with only one shifter, and a clutch pedal that didn't require 10 year old me to stand on it made it easy! Double clutching a straight cut 1-4 that leaked gear oil about as fast as you could pour it in was a rough way to learn, but it's made big boy clutches a cake walk. Screaming 'if you can find it, you can grind it!' while slapping the throttle lever up was standard fair in that brute.

So yeah, the transmission in the Twins is fine...

I swapped the factory fill for Motul Gear 300 around 15k. The trans wasn't too bad, but the diff was awful, as many people discovered.

we have -15f cold snaps now and again, and the car does fine. 2nd gear is a bit tough to get into smoothly at first, so I usually skip to third for the first shift, and I'm just very firm/intentional with the second shift into second.

There ya go folks, an old clutcher speaks ..... ;)


humfrz

So true,

Drove my dad's MK1 Karmann edition golf the other day... Not the same at all.. Only ever driven "Newer" MTs before that...Wasn't aware you used to have to actually find the gears and the clutch feels hard but not precise. however... Once you get used to it those are a joy and a half to drive.. I thought the FRS had a personality.. Good joke compared to these old beauties. I understood the appeal of the twins to "more seasoned drivers" right away.

"Old."

The reality is I grew up on a farm with old equipment. I'm 27. :lol:

:D .......OK.

I'll rephrase that ....... a clutcher of old things ........ :thumbsup:


humfrz

LOL - I'll lay claim to a bit of both both. I grew up not on, but around a farm. Spent lots of time on a Ford 9n and later an 8n. Not fancy or big, the sports cars of 1940s tractors. Nothing like shifting without any synchronizers at all. :thumbup:

Yep, speed shift your customized N9 into "road gear" and look out .......:eyebulge:

Speaking of 1-2 gear shifts, try it with a transmission with no synchronizers, pulling a ground working implement and without being able to blip the throttle.

:D


humfrz

I'm thinkin' that if ol' humfrz tries to blip that ^^ throttle it might not go too well.

Well, back-in-the-day ....... I sure would have tried to get her to roll in the hay with me ...... to see if I could find HER throttle ...... :drool:


humfrz

The Steelers shirt and flag just ruins it for me :barf:

Does the service schedule specify when trans and diff oil should be changed? I am at 35,000 miles in a 2013 and I haven't changed neither.

Service shop manual says:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8374

Manual transmission oil - inspect every 24 months or 30,000 miles.

ATF - Inspect after 30 months or 30,000 miles. Replace after 60 months or 60,000 miles

Diff Gear Oil - Inspect every 12 months or 24,000 miles. Replace every 48 months or 60,000 miles.


Few people on here rave about Redline oils in their trans and diffs:
diff: https://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=40
trans: https://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=46

Yes!!!! Wait till your OM says. Break in your engine and trans properly. Always let it warm up before driving don’t speed shift your gears. Instead practice driving and shifting smoothly. Learn how to rev match and heel and toe (rather toe and side of foot lol). Once the 17s get broken in properly and after about 9-10k miles they really start shifting smoother.

Your bigger concern is braking in your car properly and do an oil and filter change after 1000 miles pay for that so you can get them free under your dealer. Then get your first oil change at 7500miles or 7.5month as it says in your OM. After 9-10k I would then start tracking it if you want. Also if you live in a hot climate or will be tracking or autoX I recommend going to a 0w30 or 5w30 engine oil for protection brand is up to you as long as it meets or exceeds the OM specs. Down the road I would recommend an oil cooler and oil temp gauge Learn proper techniques and drive happy. :cheers:

Only bad thing about that one is it’s all in Steelers logo that’s a sin. She must be an devil. I expected less clothes more sexiness. :thumbup:

Well, ........ the top would come off easily ...... thus no more Steelers and more sexy ....... :drool:


humfrz

Is there any sort of consensus on a specific MT fluid that consistently makes the car shifts feel a little better? (especially in cold?) - from what I have seen thus far from searching, it appears that there is no consensus. I ask because on a previous car I had a mix of Redline MT90 and MTL became the de facto standard, and made that 6 speed ridiculously improved, and I am hoping there is some sort of mix specific to our transmissions that might do the same?

I went through some tranny fluid thread and the only one to get consistent positive feedback was Pentosin

I put motul gear 300 in mine and my diff and it was great. Planning on driving my new one off the lot and then changing it as soon as I get home, same with the engine oil. But that's just me.