Downforce/Drag/Aero
 

Okay, well this guy made a decision that he possibly regrets. I recently purchased a Voltex Wing for a really really good deal. Installed fine and everything went smooth.

However I didn't account for the drag of the wing to be that strong. I daily commute 120km total to work and back. I realized that my gas milage took a small hit and I have to be harder on the accelerator with inclines - even if its slight just to maintain speed.

Since I love the wing a lot, I'm trying to think of ways to combat the drag. I'm new to modifying cars and to be honest - this is my first car under my name.

I was thinking of adding a splitter and rear diffuser, possibly getting the bottom as flat as possible, while still being able to service the car easily. Maybe the car just needs more power so I don't have to be so aggressive on the pedal - as we know the torque on these cars is lacking.

Any suggestions or help is greatly appreciated, thanks!

Try to minimize the angle of attack?

You're problem here is literally the functionality of the wing. Get a smaller wing or replace it with a spoiler

isn't that wing adjustable?

What's your goal for the car?

You can't fight physics. A wing is always going to add drag. You can minimize it to some degree if it is adjustable.

A rear-diffuser will reduce drag somewhat, but I doubt it will fully offset the wing. Same for the splitter, but I believe it has even less effect than the diffuser.

Remember, the real goal of most aero mods, and 100% true of wings, is increased downforce in corners.

The only real answer in your case is to get rid of the wing.

Go FI?

we have a winner :laughabove:

Like @mav1178 suggests, get rid of it, OR ....... just remove it and put it back on for track days ...... or show and tell meets.


humfrz

Never mod your car unless you know exactly what limitation you're solving.
And at what cost they come. Wings add drag. That is their point.

Do you really need downforce at high speeds?
Do you even know at what speed your wing even helps your high speed cornering?

Sell the wing.

If you love the wing:
Reduce its angle of attack.

Getting a splitter and a diffuser won't offset the drag from the wing. They sure won't offset the increased cost from running 120km daily with it either.

I would just get rid of that wing!

I was looking at some pictures of the Voltex Wing - Type 1S for the BRZ, and it looks like you can adjust the angle of attack by changing the front screws. Other model Vortex wings based on what I can see from Google results are also adjustable too, so it looks like if you want to keep your wing you can reduce the angle of attack (i.e. make the wing flatter rather than more angled). You will still have some drag, but at least you can minimize it as best you can.

Underpanels as well

Trim out the wing, as others have said, or remove it for the daily trips, and install on weekends, etc. You might be able to use pip pins, I'm not familiar with the wing mount design.

I never understood why people put wings on these cars while NA.

Or even FI if they never ever see a track. For that matter even if they do see a track but have not yet reached a skill level where they can actually use it. I bet the number of cars/drivers that can actually use the wing to advantage is well under 1% of the ones with one installed.

Because it looks ridiculously good while sitting in a parking lot, talking about the best way to get -20* camber

Further depleting the power is just stupid. There cars are not GT3's.

Here , large wings are illegal on the street , unless they are under an engineers certificate of compliance.
So some people remove them for street use and reinstall them for track days.
It would be good if someone could make a quick release wing that can be quickly removed and reinstalled.

Add weight, drag and power. That probably wont help your mileage much.

With tires that are stretched beyond belief.

Sounds like a market for a trunk lid replacement that has a powered wing.

Check out the SARD LSR style wing. I think it looks pretty nice, is functional, and clamps on to the edge of the trunk so you can put it on and take it off fairly easily and you won't even be able to tell it was ever there.

I put the tiny 2017 OE wing on my car, does that count? Am I stupid?

The OE wings are just fine ........ they serve a purpose ...... they make a good handle by which to lift the trunk lid.

:D


humfrz

I have the BRZ's 2017 variant, the same one the 860 has. It's raised up a bit but it's not extreme like some of the wings out there.

Don't get me started on wing vs spoiler...

Also, nice license plate.

Thanks for the comment about the plate. mrs humfrz got me that so I could remember my plate number when checking into motels ...... without having to come back out and look ......:iono:

My bad on my reference to a "wing", I reckon I should have said "spoiler".

I just learnt this off the interweb ......is it about right .... ??

I quote: "To summarize:

• Both wings and spoilers reduce up-lift at the tail of the vehicle, but use different mechanisms.

• Wings are airfoils designed to directly deflect air upwards and thus push the rear of the vehicle down. They generally add quite a bit of drag.

• Spoilers are barricades to undesirable flows, and thus are able to reshape airflow streams around the vehicle. This can help keep the rear of the vehicle down and decrease drag by changing the effective vehicle shape."

Is that about right ... ??


humfrz

-you can add a lip and sideskirts and lower the car to reduce drag and go full flat underbody and add a diffuser too. This will add weight, but reduce drag in other areas. Not having a wind tunnel at your disposal (going out on a limb and assuming you don't!) you'll have to do trial and error to get them set up right.

-trim out the wing. Reduce the angle of attack, but not too much because if the wing stalls out, you'll have all the drag and none of the DF.

-vortex generators are supposed to channel the air over the rear of the car and make the wing more efficient.

-a gurney flap is supposed to reduce drag some too- IF it is set up right for this. If not, it can add DF and increase drag.

Larger side panels on the wing may reduce drag as well

Get rid of the wing,

spend money on thing that actually make you faster...like track day/autocross and TIRES.

the worst thing is to show up to a track day with a car that has huge aeros, overly modded as a mediocre driver and you're slower than the next guy in a completely stock 86

When you are talking specifically about cars it's pretty close. The important demarcation is the effect of the object rather than the shape.

In general wings create force independent of other bodies they may be attached to.

Spoilers are used to separate (spoil) the flow from a body for any number of reasons. Most of the time the end goal is to reduce lift.

Well looking at the answers here and from other forums, I'm kinda upset this forum gave me the least of usable answers. Thank you to everyone that responded with some sort of help and not went off topic about FI, track days, NA, etc.

The issue was my angle of attack, it was slightly too aggressive and providing too much drag. I've fixed the angle and reduced the amount of drag due to some professional help. Thanks to everyone that gave similar answers or tried to help despite my difficult goals.

Also I will be tracking the car but I wanted it to be a daily as well. I'm challenging myself to create a balance without too much compromise. For long trips I will just take the wing off since it has brackets.

Pictures for interest.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/7yJKwl2.jpg[/IMG]
http://imgur.com/dVqOJVi

They're not? You dont say.

You got a lot of very good answers here tho, including the ones that advise to remove the wing.

Which I thanked correctly, I think you know what posts I'm talking about. Anyways I got what I was looking for and thank you for the advice Slamm.

Need to look at the aero industry for inspiration...


http://theflyingengineer.files.wordp...technology.jpg

We weren't the ones that slapped a BFW on the back of our street car without doing the research first.

I did do my research and it fits my needs for what it will be used in the future. I was looking for alternative ways of reducing the drag coefficient of the wing without having to remove it.

Which the answer was the AoA - which I fixed last night, which reduced the drag and helped my gas milage to where I am happy.

The simple answer is to yes sell it, but I was looking for reasons on how to fix it or why that simple fix wouldn't work. Which some people here provided.

I never said I was an expert - I was just looking for advice. Did I jump the gun a little yes? But i also got the wing for 1/5th the price.

Thanks anyways!