Originally Posted by mav1178 (Post 2928575)

Honestly?

Any of the oils you are looking to run will be perfectly fine for your needs.

You need to look into a basic oil cooler and/or one with a thermostat/thermostatic control if you want to track the car on a consistent basis.

The last thing you need is to nitpick the oil properties based on what you've read. All of them will be fine for what you want to do, but all of them will suck if you consistently overheat the oil at the track.

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2928581)

Yea there's probably some misinformation going around because I read a few posts that said even with an oil cooler, 8100 eco lite 0w20 is bad for the track.

I bought tons of 8100 eco lite 0w20, so if that will be a good oil I'm in luck.

Originally Posted by Mr.ac (Post 2964802)

Seriously? It's a BRZ not a Ferrari. Any good synthetic oil will do fine if not better. Hell even oem brand would do just as fine.

California weather has jack shit to do with anything.

Just to add my oil two cents think if this: do you want to be low on oil and wait for an online delivery or drive to just one specific store that carries your brand of oil?
Or would you like to buy your brand of oil at any store at any place?

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2927109)

Hello all,

I've been researching oils .........................Feel free to make other recommendations as well and why you would recommend that specific oil.

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2928581)

Yea there's probably some misinformation going around because I read a few posts that said even with an oil cooler, 8100 eco lite 0w20 is bad for the track.

I bought tons of 8100 eco lite 0w20, so if that will be a good oil I'm in luck.

Originally Posted by chaoskaze (Post 2964888)

if you use 0W-20 make sure you get good cooling.

Japanese manual recommend you use 30weight oil for all application and 5w-40 for heavy track use & 0w-20 is for fuel economy.


https://www.subaru.jp/afterservice/tnst/pdf_brz/1/6.pdf

Originally Posted by humfrz (Post 2964892)

The poster ain't driving his car in Japan ........ so whats the Japanese manual have to do with the situation ..... ??

Besides, the poster is from California ...... enough said about that ...!!

The Japanese cars are right hand drive and his is a left hand drive car .... :iono:

@chaoskaze ...... you usually have your head screwed on straight but, ...... I'll have to agree with @Tcoat and @Ultramaroon on this one ....... that you slipped a cog on this post ....... :rolleyes:

:(


humfrz

Originally Posted by humfrz (Post 2964892)

The poster ain't driving his car in Japan ........ so whats the Japanese manual have to do with the situation ..... ??

Besides, the poster is from California ...... enough said about that ...!!

The Japanese cars are right hand drive and his is a left hand drive car .... :iono:

@chaoskaze ...... you usually have your head screwed on straight but, ...... I'll have to agree with @Tcoat and @Ultramaroon on this one ....... that you slipped a cog on this post ....... :rolleyes:

:(


humfrz

Originally Posted by chaoskaze (Post 2964895)

Most of the Japan is cooler then the states south of oregon thou, if they think it's hot enough to use 5w-30 everyday, i think it's good enough for me to follow. :party0030: :burnrubber:


Plus american auto industry policy/regulation is all about lawsuit/profit. I'm sure subaru of america doesn't feel like the need to test of other kind oil like how they do it in japan.


*1 + You, tcoat & ultra all live in the snow belt. :X... I would stay with 0w-20 there.
*2 I used 0w-20 for 50000 mile. But i know there are times my engine are obviously making slightly different noise with that 0w-20 after staying high rpm for like 20+ minutes in cali.
*3 I love you guys no homo.

Originally Posted by Tcoat (Post 2964967)

How did I get dragged into this? Don't have access to the manual right now but the Canadian version does say to use heavier oil for harder use.

Not sure about the whole argument that they use the lighter oil because they get paid for reduced fuel consumption. The reduced fuel consumption requirements are pretty much world wide not just the US. They are not optional if you want to sell your cars and nobody is getting paid for them.

Originally Posted by Zentec (Post 2964959)

Right hand drive has nothing to do with anything....... .

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2965009)

I think this got a little of topic with a little bit of trolling. Either way I had already determined a while ago that I'd just use up the cases of Motul I have and get an oil cooler. I don't think there's a need for further "suggestions."

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon (Post 2965013)

Disagree. Here's another. Be happy your thread was interesting enough for someone to resurrect it. :D

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon (Post 2965002)

My take on the manufacturer's recommendation going from 0w20<->5w40 is that there's nothing exotic about the engine. Ok, it's a little exotic but not like an F1 machine or anything.

This is contradictory as they designed the engine for this range of oil. This also segways in to the that it is a high rev high compression. No it's not a f1 as 18k rev and engine design is totally different. They also change there oil after every race. I know track people that change oil after each session.

I think engine longevity has as much to do with manufacturing tolerances as it does with care and maintenance. I agree 100% for above reason.

We have some local guys who regularly beat the living shit out of their cars with no oil cooler and they're fine. But for how long??? Climate and driving style plays 100% of this part.

Keeps me grounded while I tinker away with my comically-oversized adjustable setup.

I'm with @chaoskaze when it comes to hearing/feeling the difference as temp changes, oil ages, or the level changes. Doesn't matter what engine. Drive a machine long enough and we just get to know it. :thumbsup:

I daily mine but, when I go carving, my tach stays above 5K. It's not a question of NA-vs-FI that drives the requirement for an oil cooler, it's how the engine is operated. High RPM cooks oil. correct. The oil cooler demand is that fact that high rpm and high Engine oil temp create load and once at operating tempature the 20 weight oil will thin out even more creating less protection and pressure and can increase engine damage. The increase in weight of an oil creates better protection under load. The point of an oil cooler is to cool it enough for the oil to maintain the protection and pressure. Depending on the oil cooler it will cool it around 9-10 degrees F.



OP, just use decent oil and change it more often if you beat on it. If you have 30 weight +/- the oil cooler even if you "beat" on it you will be fine to change your oil at the recommended in the OM as long as your not losing oil somewhere.

If you really want to get to know how your driving affects it, install a pressure gauge. You'll see pressure drop dramatically when it gets hot. You'll also notice how tight this engine is. Even with 0w20, my oil pressure is about 120psi on cold start.
It will be higher if you are below 0F temps.

That's an awful lot of pressure on the front galleys which are literally made of 2 plates sandwiched together with a row of M6 screws.

I've been wandering all over the place so I'll stop here. My main point is that brand doesn't mean shit.

It dose mean something see my comment on additives ect. The winter and weight make the most diffterance as long as you have the approved API grade full synthetic your fine.

Just change it often enough and don't let it run dry. ;)

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2965009)

I think this got a little of topic with a little bit of trolling. Either way I had already determined a while ago that I'd just use up the cases of Motul I have and get an oil cooler. I don't think there's a need for further "suggestions."

Originally Posted by Zentec (Post 2965025)

This also segways in to the that it is a high rev high compression. No it's not a f1 as 18k rev and engine design is totally different. They also change there oil after every race. I know track people that change oil after each session.

Originally Posted by Lust (Post 2965019)

Your post was helpful actually though. Thank you.

Originally Posted by Zentec (Post 2964959)

Right hand drive has nothing to do with anything. The Japanese OM has everything to do with it because these cars are Japanese engeneered cars. If you bothered to read the post link I quoted all the way. You would understand that the only reason they use 0w20 in the North,South American and CA is that the dealer/manufacture gets a price cut/car and incentive back for each car that is "fuel efficient". That was from the Subaru OM. If you actually know anything about oil even if you live in a snow belt ect a 0w30 or even a 5w30 is better for protection and cold weather start. Other than that the different brands of oil have different additives ect like different brands of gas. What is important is the winter and the weight like 91 octane is the minamum and recommend is 93. The brand is up to you after octane gas is all the same but with different additives ect for different brands.

Originally Posted by mav1178 (Post 2965098)

So a Japanese engineered car means you have to read the Japanese Owner's Manual and take the others with a grain of salt?
Lol no you don't have to do anything. The point I made is Subaru engineered the tolerances up to 40 weight depending on your driving style and conditions. In the OM it says"0w20 is ideal for the best fuel economy!! " "an oil with a higher weight may be better suited if the car is operated at higher speeds or under extream load condition" this does not mean towing with the car it means tracking the car. The reason I went so far as to look up the information in the Japanese OM was knowing these cars have high tolerances I wanted to know what the Subaru engineers recommend because they did not mention them in our OM.


You know what BMW recommends in their cars? Yes I do it's Castro the weight can very between M models and regular. They also have oil changes ever 10k miles or once a year what ever comes first. I know I use to have one. Whatever the dealer sells, or a specific type of Castro. it's Castro

You know what happens when you run an oil outside of those guidelines? Nothing. Wrong! This is where you do not understand and you are making assumptions. The weight in the 0w20 is the 20 and that 20 weight is only measured when the oil is at operating tempature. Once oil is at temp with the 20 weight you can daily drive just fine in normal climate temps. If you take the car and track it with the 20 weight you can ruin the engine as in the OM says under high speed and load a heavier weight. As the 20 weight is for fuel effency.

But your warranty coverage may be impacted in case the oil causes engine failure. if you operate the car at high speeds on a track on the 20 weight yes you can because they can say it says here in the OM a heavier weight should be used. This is why I looked up the manufactures recommendation. Now if you put a 50 weight in yes you could because the tolerances are not set to Handel that high of weight.

But no one cares if you run a non-BMW approved oil. what do you mean by non BMW approved? If your talking about brand it doesn't really matter. But If you do not use the BMW approved grade usally grade 5 API ILSAC oil this is the oil stamp on the back of the oil container.

From the thread you referenced and what you wrote:


So why are these oils better than every other 0W-20 on the market? Or are we just basing decisions on assumptions and not fact?

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon (Post 2965061)

Among other things, 12.5:1 is why I gave it points for being slightly exotic. 7400 RPM is a snoozefest.:thumbdown: No not a snooze fest yes I would be so much happier @8or 9k personally I think it could handle it but don't know how reliable it will be that probably why they didn't take it there. On the other hand we're pretty close to the bore and stroke of the s2k.


I'm lost here. How does high rpm and high temp create load? What kind of load? high engine speed aka rpm and keeping it there on a track this is a mechanical load.

Your point about increasing the weight of the oil for towing a trailer is wrong. I never said towing in the quote above.

No offense intended. The engine is capable producing a fixed maximum force against the rod journals and distribute it along the mains. Hooking up a trailer or whatever doesn't change that. I would never hook up a trailer to an 86 as it says in the OM do not tow with this car Page 205.

Increasing the operating temperature of the engine or the oil, for whatever reason, is the only valid reason for fiddling with viscosity... ok, that and compensating for slutty journals, but that's it.
No!! 20 weight fuel effency for daily driving. Going to a 30 weight you lose about 1-3% mpg but gain protection. For me protection is better than a couple mpg.


Unless you're talking about an engine designed specifically to shed heat through the oil, (think Suzuki GSX series engines) an oil cooler is there to preserve the engine by preserving the oil. Not so for cars. The point as I stated of an oil cooler is to keep the oil from getting to hot by keeping the oil at desired temps. You can install the thermal plate that will start cooling the oil at a certain point. As I said the point of this is so your oil dose not get to hot that it starts to thin out and you lose protection. The plus is when you maintain your oil temp your oil pressure stabilizes as well which keeps you protected. You should have your oil temp and engine coolent temp fairly close. The main point is not to prolong oil life but it can do so as it dose not over heat the oil.

Just like cooking oil, engine oil literally goes rancid with exposure to oxygen. The higher the temp, the quicker the oxidation. wrong and partially true. Regular oil is like this although the tempature is a bigger factor. But fully synthetic oils that we use in our cars. Synthetic motor oils have a higher tolerance to heat and aging. The performance characteristics of these synthetic lubricants can be custom-designed to exceed the performance limits of petroleum-based motor oils _ and their use can possibly increase the life of your engine. If you over heat your cooking oil it loses its lubercation and thins out same as a car. Now if you go further and heat it to its flash point boom flames now stuff gets black. If you exceed the temp for the weight of the oil in a car you loose oil pressure and protection if you exceed the temp for syn oil your going to have a ton of problems lol.

Keep it cool and it lasts longer.

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon (Post 2965117)

I base my decisions on the fact that my assumptions are always right.

Originally Posted by mav1178 (Post 2965097)

I've found that owners tend to be in two groups:

A large group that completely ignores the Owner's Manual.
Ok I can understand this. You must be in this group.

And a smaller group that basically nitpicks every type of technical spec or documentation out there.

Originally Posted by humfrz (Post 2965170)

:popcorn:

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon (Post 2965190)

I'm done. The bullshit has gotten way too deep. I don't do well with it.


That seat taken? :popcorn: