S2000 vs. FR-S BRZ Track Review Video | Part 2 of 2
S2000 vs 86 Platform Complete | Track Review | VIDEO
We complete the street and track testing comparing the S2000 against a stock BRZ and Supercharged FRS. In part one we talk about the details of both cars, the history, practicality and much more. Part two compares the supercharged FR-S on the track with identical wheel horsepower as the S2000 to help level the playing field. 2005 S2000 Stock: POWER: 208HP 150lbsTq Dynojet (Wheel horsepower) Tires: Hankook RS3 225/255 Brakes: Carbotech XP12 Pads Oil: Redline 10w30 Alignment: -2.2F -1.5R Camber 2013 Scion FRS Supercharged: Power: 212HP 181lbsTq Dynojet (Wheel Horsepower) Tires: 235 Hankook RS3s Brakes: AP Sprint Project Mu 999 Pads Cooling: Liquid to Air Oil Cooler | Perrin Tune Oil: Redline 10w30 Suspenion: Ohlins | -3.0F -2.0R Camber PART 1 [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwPW0iWYTNk"]S2000 vs FRS (GT86 BRZ) Full Review | Part 1 of 2 | S02E07 - YouTube[/ame] S2000 0:00 - 0:52 Introduction Montage 0:52 - 2:32 The History and Chief Engineer Shigeru Uehara 2:32 - 6:07 Under the Skin with Turbowski 6:07 - 9:02 Getting Inside 9:02 - 11:22 Driving Impressions Analog vs Digital 11:23 - 11:43 Learning the Hard Way - RIP 11:45 - 12:17 S2000 Final Thoughts GT86 - FR-S - BRZ and Supercharged FR-S 12:17 - 14:12 The 86 Platform History with Engineers Tada San 14:12 - 16:10 Interior Overview and Engineering 16:11 - 18:01 Driving the Stock BRZ, FR-S and GT86 18:01 - 19:57 Driving the Supercharged FR-S 20:00 - 20:45 Final Thoughts and Track Review Coming Soon 20:45 Outtakes PART 2: [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gluk3_otoUo"]S2000 vs FRS (GT86 BRZ) Track Review | Part 2 of 2 | S02E08 - YouTube[/ame] 0:00-1:22 Introduction 1:22-1:51 Disclaimer and Leveling Playing Field 1:52-2:36 Comparing Drivers 2:37-4:52 The FR-S Supercharged Laptime 4:53-5:28 The Mythical TRD/STI 86 5:28-6:36 The real values stock vs. stock 6:37-7:07 The initial results and switching drivers 7:08-10:17 Flat out the Track Comparison 10:17-11:11 The results and impressions 11:11-12:08 Conclusion Not a race car 11:00-12:24 Thoughts on the 86 12:24-14:09 The Winner 14:09-17:03 Outtakes 17:03-17:54 Credits https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2...28Small%29.jpg https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-0...e.Still002.jpg https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-S...28Small%29.jpg https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-v...Untitled-2.jpg https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-n...28Small%29.jpg https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-L...50-no/golf.jpg |
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Sweet, it's finally out. Been following your videos for a while now. Very informative and interesting to say the least. The bromance is strong in that last picture.
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great video as always. Thanks for taking the time to do it!
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Time to make some popcorn and enjoy this bad boy!
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I don't even need to watch to know which car op prefers...;)
Just get an s2000 already... |
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Video is too long. Will watch when I get home tonight.
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If I were driving, which car would have been faster? :D
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Really well done.. I love how honest you are about these cars (good and bad for both).
Look forward to the next installment. |
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Had an S2000, 350Z, and FR-S now. The S2000 is incredible, but for the price, I'll take the new, more practical car with a warranty. I doubt I'd ever buy a tank (350Z) again. It's hard to find a non-rodded/modded S2000 in good condition. Mine sure wasn't when I bought it. Overall I found the review biased but informative.
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That said, I am with you on finding a clean S2K. I have been looking most of this year and they are few and far between. And many of them are well over $20K. But I agree with Dezoris and Turbowski that the S2K will hold its value much better long term. |
Not trying to be nitpicky, but this comparison doesn't make much sense to me, to be honest. Why match hp figures and ignore all of the other differences? The FRS is lighter right off the bat, so that's going to give it a better power-to-weight ratio, and then you gave it light weight aftermarket wheels, coilovers, and a big brake kit versus a relatively stock S2000 (minus brake pads and tires). That's significant weight savings and a substantial handling improvement given to the FRS, while at the same time allowing it to have approximately 30lbs/ft more torque and a square tire setup, where as the S2000 is using the stock staggered setup, which will not turn in as well due to less front grip. Besides that, there seemed to be quite long stretches of straightaways, which obviously is going to benefit the car with a better power-to-weight and more torque. It seems like the outcome could have been easily predicted... and, realistically, it's not even close to an even comparison in terms of price or level of mods. *shrug*
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Dezoris' result reflects the reason why considering the inflation adjusted MSRPs when comparing the cars is so critical. Comparing a $18k-$25k Toyota w/mods to a purpose built $40k+ (inflation adjusted) Honda should reflect the Honda being built to a higher quality standard w/ greater resale value. Same thing would be reflected comparing an S2k to a Cayman. The Cayman would prove dynamically better, with greater resale value.
The real difference is that the FR-S was built to be daily driver friendly, and cheap enough to serve as an attainable platform to mod on. S2k was more narrowly focused and should be excellent dynamically. Remarkably, with not too much money, an '86 can achieve performance levels above a car that would cost well over $40k in today's dollars. For those that need a DD, you cant beat an '86. Like with most "it" cars that came before it, mechanical weaknesses will become known and addressed by both owners and the aftermarket. Overall, for those that need some utility with their fun, the '86 has proven to be a great value. |
I'd smoke you Dezoris with my stock FRS on Primacy tires. Any track any weather.
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a friend of mine is looking to get rid of his, 95K stock minus an intake and wheels, clean clean car, i know he doesn't want 20 for it the gray one is the one up for sale(red is his fathers 25K showroom condition ugggghhhh) https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/...17&oe=54CF6DB7 |
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About the FRS upgrades: "not too much money" is debatable. Adding a supercharger, coilovers, light wheels, a big brake kit, etc. is not cheap no matter how you look at it. That's easily $10k - $15k. That warranty goes out the window, and if you spent that same amount of money on mods for the S2000 you'd have a significantly more powerful car with a higher level of performance. I'm not hating on the FRS. I still would like to get one eventually after they've depreciated more. I'm just being realistic about the comparison. Realistically, you could look at even older cars like the 240sx and RX7 and get even more value for your money in terms of performance potential vs cost. It's hard to argue with factory turbo light FR coupes. The reliability might not be there, but the performance and excitement will be. |
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As far as mod costs go. I could build a supercharged/turbocharged FR-S with tires, brakes (not a BBK unnecessary), shocks/springs, and an oil cooler that comes well under $10k that would probably be equally as fast. $7.5k would probably be enough. Maybe $5.5-$6k if you're ok with used parts to match the used S2K. The point isn't a "same money" dollar per/mod on both cars point. The FR-S is a DD that you can buy new and mod that performs, is practical, gets solid MPG, and looks good. Special note, none of the most common N/A power mods that actually make power would void a warranty in themselves if going in that direction first. The point is the S2K was originally built as a much more expensive purpose built product. So it's no surprise that it was constructed with better quality parts and is holding it's value well. Now let's do the same comparison S2k vs Cayman. |
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I think we had another second to find in the S2000 namely on the main straight. And the FRS could have easily pulled another 1-2 seconds, as I only ran it one session. The S2000 I ran 4 sessions in trying to even get close to that FRS time and it never happened. FRS had much higher entry and exit speeds, much more balanced as you know, easy to push harder with less drama. Quote:
Is it fair, no but thats what makes some of this more fun. Quote:
8 years ago I was in a Comptech SC S2000 on the track and that car has potential too. But where we were going here was the S2000 does not need much of anything to be a great car. The 86 needs a whole host of things to get there. |
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I wanted to answer this one as I got several private hate messages about bias and trashing the FRS. Regardless if people think this was biased or not. I did buy both cars and am still investing in the 86, not just in time but also financially. It's a great platform for all of this. |
Don't worry about haters, there will always be hating no matter what you do brother. Keep up the mods and the vids.
Thanks for sharing your experiences. |
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And I think it is really important to highlight the fact that you really do track these cars and push them. Other people who add FI are not. |
And I have to say.. In the outtakes where Turbowski thought he broke the car and realized what it really was... Hilarious.. He has this look on his face when he first thinks he broke the car like "oh shit!"
I am sure he had a mild panic attack... |
Another great vid!
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I agree. Loved the video. Nice to see some honest assessments about the 86 with a touch of humor. Keep up the good work.
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I'm amazed we're two pages in and no one has pointed out this "WTF" moment:
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He does like the car despite his hatred for working on them. |
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Turn in on the stock S2000 setup is pretty phenomenal... I can't say I ever experienced any understeer in that car, but in the FR-S I feel it understeers a bit initially and then takes a bite. |
Very nice video review. You and Turbowski have good "chemistry" :D
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SAVAGEGEESE! :bow: :thumbsup:
Review was very well done with good production value. I can totally see how someone would choose an s2000. Honestly the reason I still choose the ft86 platform is because: 1. I can buy it new and with a warranty without worrying if anyone beat the car. 2. Better safety. 3. A somewhat usable back-seat and trunk. 4. Better MPG (Yeah I know but it does play a factor) 5. Coupe not a convertible (Should have cheaper insurance rates) I think people get the vibe that you hate the ft86 platform because of you're prior videos. I guess people tune in, hear the cons, and immediately start spitting profanity without actually watching the whole review to see what else you have to say about the car. I actually like that you don't ****ride the car and can give honest pros and cons. Any plans on a different set-up? Maybe JRSC in the future? |
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It would be fun to see the angry PM's :D
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Awesome. Been looking forward to this.
Love the deadpan humour. |
Just wanted to add a big thank you to you both. I've watched pretty much all your recent work and have to say its wildly entertaining. For me at least, your work is up there with other great shows like Everyday Driver for grin inducing value :)
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The "problem" I had with my S2000 is that it was too well tuned from the factory. Yeah, not really a con, but unless you're buying a very nice and adjustable coilover setup for $1500+, the factory suspension couldn't be much improved. Bolt-ons added nothing and were expensive. Only when you go forced induction would you see noticeable benefits. And FI, along with nearly every other mod, was crazy expensive on my AP2.
With the 86, it's a great car for tinkering. It's good from the factory, but you can affordably increase that performance. Out of the box the handling is superb, but there's so much more you can do on a budget to reach and exceed S2000 performance. And that's while retaining the warranty. The added benefits of a coupe (usuable space, insurance, four seats, etc) are just gravy. I'm sure the S2000 folks say the same thing if they were to (in my opinion) step up to the Cayman. As much as I loved my S2000, I enjoy my FRS more. Being 6'3", I was too tall for my S2000 anyway. |
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