Innovative MotorWorks - 603whp/47wtq on a Stock Engine
 

Pulled from their Facebook Page:

http://i.imgur.com/HTD6eWA.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/NrQ05Y2.png

http://i.imgur.com/FTSObtp.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/szrAzlK.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/GYhk2SS.jpg

Very interesting, though I wonder how long this motor will last before it goes ka-boom.

If I recall correctly it already has went kaboom.

If it's a 2013 motor, there's no way it'll last with stock internals...those 2013 motors are ticking time-bombs with boost

Shocked :)

Yay the fifth thread on the same topic! As for the 2013 engine. They all are ticking bombs at this power level...

What's different about the 2013 engine? Are they more prone to failure, or just more people have them, and have modified them, thus more of them failed?

I just meant regardless of the model year all of the engines are ticking time bombs at those levels. Nothing is inherently different from 2013 to 2014 except some of the early 2013's didn't have the tune to "fix" the direct injector failure issue. 2015's do have some moderate changes but nothing that would keep it from lasting any longer than any other model year.

:(

I had hopes :(

I don't see where you are getting this info from.

Umm.. Where did you get that info from? lol
I'm almost at 100k miles with boost on my '13

20k on boost. Vortech with smaller pulley

Oh, I don't know, just about 40-50 threads from people with 2013 cars with the motor going bye-bye despite the best efforts of the owners and shops that worked on the cars, lol :thumbsup:

Kaboom doing what? Driving around? Hitting the track? Pushing the motor to get a higher hp on the dyno till it hit its limit, on purpose?

LMAO 40-50 threads!!!!

I don't think its that funny

The question that begs to be asked is why go to all the time and expense to set up a configuration that is bound to destroy the engine vs prepping the engine for these conditions??
Why would anyone deliberately destroy an engine?
Makes no sense!
This is analogous to constructing a multi storey building on patio stones.
I would think anyone with the budget to do a failure test could just as easily utilize the expertise of someone who could predict the weak points empirically. I'm going to go with rod>piston>valve>gasket failure. And I have no expertise other than reading of previous instances.

It did not. Stupid rumors are stupid.


Bought car Jun 11th 2012.

Boosted to 552 whp 471 wtq for two years. Still running strong.

It's all in the way you drive, tune, supporting mods and maintain your car.

Of course, this is not a bulletproof engine and the factory does produce some bad engines, but most times than not, the motor can hold boost, again with the proper setup.

Also tune is VERY VERY important! I say 90% of it has to do with the tune!

It's absolutely badass that a stock 2.0L motor can hit nearly 700WHP, but at the same time this car is a death trap! This guy has no idea what he's in for if he gets into a front-end collision now after removing his bumper impact beam and absorber... I've seen the impact these things can take and I feel bad for whatever driver eventually wrecks this car on some amazing run at 700hp.

Performance without safety (in my opinion) is the definition of stupid.

Go count them over the years...you've been here a bit, you'll find multitudes

You mean people who paid a shop to do all of their install and then bought a cookie-cutter out of the box tune for their turbo or SC setup instead of taking it into a dyno for tuning? Ya - that'll make your motor blow up a lot sooner than if you did it right the first time. Out of the threads I've read where people blew their motor below 300hp, they all had a cookie-cutter tune rather than doing it the right way. It has little to do with how much boost you run or what HP you are making and a lot more to do with "quick, easy and cheap".

You know that the point of failures were all over the board right? If you were talking about a particular issue that the 2013s had then you might have a case. The engines are nearly the same, and since there were so many different types of failures, you can't seriously hope to sound reasonable by making the point that "2013s can't take boost". That's sort of like saying 2013s have weak head gaskets, cranks, rods, blocks, DI seals, DI pumps etc etc.

Get real man, you sound downright foolish.

The 2013 motors did have different valves and tunes early on, not too mention a lazy way of sealing up the cam plates, and other common sources of leaks...and who knows what Subaru did quietly to address many of the cooling, oiling, AVCS, and assortment of other failures specific to boost problems...I don't have the patience to fully explain and qualify my original statement about the 2013 cars, so all the people up in arms will just have to deal with it. :slap:

I sound foolish because I made an opinion based on consistent observations I've made over the years? Lol...oh well, I guess you can't please people who live in fantasy land. :bonk:

No, it more has to do with throwing out blanket claims with little to no reasoning behind it other than your own opinion... If you had some facts that you threw in you wouldn't sound so foolish.

I am (sort of) gonna throw in with Lone on this. Although I don't think there are 40 or 50 threads there certainly are a shitload of them from back then.
There were undeniably issues with the early engines that have been changed since then and there is plenty of documentation here to support that as a fact.

Another aspect that I have not seen mentioned here is that there is a rather lengthy list of engines that were blown doing R&D for tunes and aftermarket parts. These pioneers knew exactly what the risks were while they pushed the limits to develop the best performance while keeping as much reliability as possible and fully accepted that they could/would blow up an engine or two. The boosted engines that are still going strong are the result of this R&D not in spite of it nor the exception to the rule.

I do however disagree with Lone on the fact that all the 13s are ticking time bombs. If the stock engine has had the fixes applied (especially the updated TSB tunes) and is properly maintained there is no reason to expect it to be any worse than the later ones. From what little info I have been able to glean on major failures the rate is no greater than the average new release of any other make. Engines that have been modded or boosted will last as long as the quality of work and materials that were initially put into them, how hard they are used and how well they are maintained.

@Tcoat for the voice of reason....

I've got 86K plus on a 2013 motor, 52K+ boosted. My car is still running fine.

What are your dyno numbers?

I put 40K of the boosted miles on the CARB configuration. Car was making about 220Whp/180Wtq on a Mustang. I put the Delicious FF kit, 69mm pulley, and Tomei EL headers on at about 75K. I haven't dyno'd the car since, but Driftem got around 300whp on a dynojet with a very similar configuration.

I'm not trying to compare my number to the numbers quoted by the OP, just showing that with a good tune and reasonable boost the motors can stay in one piece.

:cheers:

Oh I agree, it's all about the tune!

I'd wager there are two times as many cars (maybe more) running "cookie-cutter" tunes than there are dyno tuned cars. There are also "dyno tuned" cars that have went kaboom. Provide data proving that remote tunes destroy more engines than dyno tunes instead of your normal bloviating bullshit about how remote tunes are bad.

An important cornerstone of having an adult conversation is providing facts to back up your opinion that can be disputed or disproven. Saying "this is my opinion but I don't have to justify it becasue dumb" just makes you a child.

But had you provided actual facts instead of just pulling shit out of your ass and then getting keyboard tough, there's a couple of important points that you might have wanted to consider. Since I'm a nice dude and all, and actually have an idea what I'm talking about, I'll explain it to you:

1. 2013 motors were overwhelmingly used to test brand new parts, installations and tunes. Just because Visconti burned a 2013 car to the ground doesn't mean it had anything to do with being a 2013, it just meant that it happened on the first MY of the car before people figured out he was a clown.

2. With any platform, especially with a brand new motor, there is always a learning curve. Learning curve means popped motors, period. Sort of like testing new parts (see point 1), people also need to cut their teeth as tuners and will make mistakes early on. There is absolutely a trial and error process with tuning. Sometimes those errors have consequences, but again, since they started learning on the first MY of the car, you have more mistakes being made on 2013 cars.

3. Re: your "cookie-cutter" tune point - these tunes are also overwhelmingly done on self-installed FI. Since your "opinion" is based on your "observations" on a forum, I'm going to go ahead and assume you don't know how easy it is to make grave errors during FI install if you're not experienced in the process. Something as simple as the wrong spring on a wastegate can blow a motor. When you have people doing full install and tune at a shop that's done these things a number of times, the chances those types of issues occur are much smaller.

You see my friend, what you've done is made the classic "correlation versus causation" error. I'm sure you're absolutely right that there are WAY more blown 2013 motors out there than any other MY. That's natural. It doesn't mean there's anything in particular wrong with them, or that they are "ticking time bombs". Now, I don't have the patience to explain correlation and causation to you, and I'm not sure you'd understand anyways.

WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER! :fighting0040:


Honestly though more than likely it is a little of both. I do think the early engines obviously had more issues at first (especially the direct injection issue), most of which have since been fixed. That said, I do agree that the large majority of these are likely just a correlation. Assuming it's once or the other seems ignorant.

Pile it on smart guy. I'm glad to see you have the time (see: no life) to craft your momentous and enlightening wall o' text. Yeah, I don't understand correlation vs. causation...LMAO...that's why I passed the CA Bar Exam the first time I took it. Derp.

Funny, how I get flamed for a a comment made in passing but there are countless threads where people spew crap left and right with nary any repercussions. Must have touched a nerve with all you mature, articulate folks...

PS. Your veiled personal attacks with a touch of sarcasm are really quite witty, don't quit your day job...:laughabove:

Two times as more just means that less people care about doing it the right way and want cheap and fast like I said... So yeah there are tons of blown cars on this site with cooke-cutter Delicious tunes. And of course you're going to see dyno-tuned cars kick the bucket as well, but they're not doing it at 270-300WHP... If you want to take a chance on someone else tuning your car remotely without ever seeing what it's actually doing, be my guest! No way I'd take that chance running boost on a 12.5/1 CR engine.

Delicious Tune Blow-Up: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91521
Delicious Tune Blow Up #2: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=13

Both running identical Supercharger kits that Delicious did the initial tune on... Both running cookie-cutter tunes below 300WHP and both blew their motors with SAFE boost. There are plenty of others, but here are some good examples for you of engines that should have never kicked the bucket when they did. If you're going to spend $5k on a supercharger, why skimp on the tune?

Spitting a rocker arm has absolutely nothing to do with the tune, that's a rare event associated with valve springs. The second one you posted has no info other than they burned pistons, could have been a failed DI seal, bad gas, or a number of other things.


Come back with some hard data that's viable to your argument. You posted two not "tons" and the two you posted have not been proven to be tune related.
You seem to just be bashing delicious. Why?

The following is a joke....
1300.01 GENERAL

1. Any person with a valid California State hunting license may harvest attorneys.

2. Taking of attorneys with traps or deadfalls is permitted. The use of currency as bait is prohibited.

3. Killing of attorneys with a vehicle is prohibited. If accidentally struck, remove dead attorney to roadside and proceed to nearest car wash.

4. It is unlawful to chase, herd, or harvest attorneys from a snow machine, helicopter, or aircraft.

5. It shall be unlawful to shout "whiplash", "ambulance", or "free Perrier" for the purpose of trapping attorneys.

6. It shall be unlawful to hunt attorneys within 100 yards of BMW dealerships.

7. It shall be unlawful to use cocaine, young boys, $100 bills, prostitutes, or vehicle accidents to attract attorneys.

8. It shall be unlawful to hunt attorneys within 200 yards of courtrooms, law libraries, health spas, gay bars, ambulances, or hospitals.

9. If an attorney is elected to government office, it shall be a felony to hunt, trap, or possess it.

10. Stuffed or mounted attorneys must have a state health department inspection for AIDS, rabies, and vermin.

11. It shall be illegal for a hunter to disguise himself as a reporter, drug dealer, pimp, female legal clerk, sheep, accident victim, bookie, or tax accountant for the purpose of hunting attorneys.

BAG LIMITS


1.Yellow Bellied Sidewinder22.Two-faced Tort Feasor33.Back-stabbing Divorce Litigator54.Big-mouthed Pub Gut25.Honest AttorneyEXTINCT6.Cut-throat27.Back-stabbing Whiner28.Brown-nosed Judge Kisser29.Silver-tongued Drug Defender$100 bounty

Is that not redundant?


Also a joke!

Tuning has a lot to do with it