Manual Transmission Virgin
 

Hey everyone,

Thread title says it all. I have not driven an MT before, though been in the passenger seat plenty of times. The plan is to purchase one of the Twins (leaning towards the FRS) next year and I want to be ready by then. In the mean time, I'll learn using my brother's RSX once he picks it up mid-June.

My question is, how do you drive an MT in heavy, stop and go traffic? I've watched plenty of how-to videos of actually driving one, but only 1 or 2 described heavy traffic driving.

Please correct me if I'm wrong in my thinking. :)
1. Do you simply leave the car in 1st gear then gas>brake>gas>brake, etc like you would in an AT?
OR...
2. Do you gas > clutch/neutral, brake > clutch/1st, gas > clutch/neutral, brake, rinse and repeat?

The first method would seem more logical to me but the guys in those how-to videos mentioned leaving your car in 1st gear while at a complete stop could stall your engine (I could be wrong since my memory hasn't been the best as of late).
Also with the second method, that would be a lot of clutch usage (I want the clutch to last at least 75k!) since I drive in the outskirts of downtown Seattle, and going down one street to turn onto the highway on-ramp takes 15-30 minutes. Furthermore, there's an incline with drivers stopping about 3-4 inches left from hitting my rear (I hate those people).

I would get the AT version of the Twins to make it much easier to drive in heavy traffic but I want one car to have an MT.

Anyways, hope my question and description is clear as I have a hard time explaining things in great detail.

Future thanks to anyone who takes their time to provide an answer!

Welcome
Guys be gentle

Gears work linearly. If the clutch is engaged and the car is stopped, the engine will also be stopped. Therefore, you MUST work the clutch when crawling (driving below vehicle speed which is lower than idle in first gear) in a MT car.

When I'm in real "stop and go" traffic, I do two things: 1) I leave larger gaps so I can creep with the engine barely at 1000rpm, and 2) I clutch in and pop it in neutral to stop, knowing I'm going to be stopped for a while.

Thank you for your reply. I do notice that drivers who have MT cars do leave about 2-3 car lengths worth of space to creep as you mentioned.

Yeah Seattle is pretty rough for stop and go on inclines. In this case you use your e brake.

Very difficult to tell you how to drive MT in print and there are all sorts of "tricks" that people will tell you that are dubious at best and can damage your car at worst.


This is actually a pretty good starting point: http://www.wikihow.com/Drive-Manual


Also spend some time on Youtube (keeping in mind some things are just not right) or find somebody that can actually show you. Many driving schools will only charge a $100 or so and that is really a very good investment to learn how to do things right.

let's say you're at a stop and traffic is beginning to move.
1.) clutch in
2.) shift from neutral to first
3.) let clutch out to engagement point and give gas as needed. At this point the clutch won't be fully out if im only moving a bit.

then lets say traffic stops again

4.) clutch in and brake
5.) go from first to neutral again OR leave in first and leave clutch in (depending on how long you think traffic will be stopped for)

someone correct me if I gave some bad advice lol

Forgot to mention check the phone when traffic stop

terrible....

smh

how else would you move up if you just want to move like 2 meters?

He's yanking your chain.

OP, the thing to remember about clutch conservation is to focus on spending the least amount of time possible with the clutch in slip, especially don't gas it while the clutch is slipping. Hard to explain in words. It's a rhythm thing easier understood when seen demonstrated. Like @Tcoat said, classes are reasonable and very much worth the cost.

In the end remember it's just a clutch.

Practice out of traffic first. It is difficult to get things right if you are trying to learn in a stressful environment.

Another thing to remember...If you're sitting still for a couple of minutes or longer (at a light or stuck in traffic), don't sit there in gear with the clutch pushed in. Put it in neutral and let the clutch out until you need to be in gear.

I tried not gas when clutch still slipping and the car jerks like crazy

I thought so but then I ended up second guessing lol

What hasnt been covered yet....oh yeah if you have an aftermarket exhaust, remember to wake up early every morning. Drive to the main road of wherever you live, clutch kick it, opposite lock. This will definitely help with throttle control. Trust me its what the pros do :thumbsup:

/sarcasm.

then in that situation, give it a little more gas to slip out of the jerk.

It's a balanced act, the amount of slip you give is the amount of gas you give on the start.

As a driver coming from auto, you should get a feeling of giving it more clutch (leaving your foot in the clutch more) even after shifting it into gear. This will smooth things out with much less jerk.

Honda clutch has less room for error, the clutch on this car has lots of room! But yes, it can still jerk if your timing is off or if its cold & not warmed up.

Don't worry about clutch Conservation yet, until you've learned. Clutch is a wear item just like brakes, it just last longer. You'll eventually have to replace it if you keep the car.

Like I said, focus on giving it more clutch since you're use to auto, and the amount of gas you give should be natural.

Oops. Yeah, I didn't express that very well. What I meant to say was try not to rev the engine too much when it's slipping.

Ok to rev the engine when the clutch is just starting to make contact but then less torque/gas as the clutch goes towards full engagement.

Typically from a stop, I goose the throttle and begin engaging the clutch while the engine is spooling down. Then I give it gas only after the clutch is fully engaged. It's not cut and dry and takes practice.

Just don't rev the shit out of it while the clutch is only half engaged. Consider that old trick of rubbing your palms together to warm them. Now multiply that by 50,000.

You can definitely gas it while slipping the clutch (in fact you should), just don't rev the engine too high.

Just go by "feel". If you drive like most automatic drivers you will soon get annoyed at all the starting and stopping, and will adapt your driving accordingly. I try to not brake and just roll in 1st or neutral until I'm forced to a stop. If traffic isn't completely frozen, I accelerate in 1st (or 2nd) and either coast with clutch in or roll along in 2nd or 3rd or something.

Here is a good video for first timers::

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0O0Ta8tzXs"]J's s2000 vs Amuse s2300 Touge , Best Motoring - YouTube[/ame]

MT drivers that spend a lot of time in stop and go will often try to stay in second gear as often as possible and just let the car pull itself along at idle. With our cars, this works out to about 13km/h. It gets frustrating though as when the gap gets to big, it fill up with lane changers, and you have to come to a stop anyways. :(

soapbox
With respect to the gap, remember, drivers are required to maintain enough distance to allow another vehicle to merge unobstructed. People don't do it but it's the flip side to the law saying the merging driver must yield to already flowing traffic.
/soapbox

Leave it in neutral, open the door, and push it forward with your left foot.

Originally Posted by Atticus808
how else would you move up if you just want to move like 2 meters?

this is done in the garage a lot!

2 meters? Don't even lift off the clutch completely. It should still be slipping. Most transmissions are not fully engaged to move that distance from the start.

If it makes you feel any better, this is my first ManTran car also and I learned it AFTER I bougt the car LOL

This. It's a feeling thing. You'll get it pretty quickly I'm sure :thumbsup:

To add to the above comment, I think of the clutch and gas as a constant and equal ratio. As one goes in the other comes out. It'll take some feeling to get the balance but once you get it you'll know what I mean.


Also, you're a lot like me lol. You're building it up a lot in your mind. Take all the info here into consideration but the best way to figure it out is getting in a MT and learning man.

Good luck.

Haha... I do that all the time because go-kart.

Maybe in Canada, I've never heard of a US state that has that requirement

I guess Cali is pretty vague. Oregon says in http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/811.485

A person commits the offense of following too closely if the person does any of the following:

a - ...
b - ...
c - Drives a motor vehicle when traveling upon a roadway outside of a business or residence district or upon a freeway within the corporate limits of a city in a caravan or motorcade whether or not towing another vehicle without operating the vehicle so as to leave sufficient space between vehicles to enable a vehicle to enter and occupy the space without danger.

Thanks for the helpful tips everyone! These, combined with the countless videos I've watched, should make the learning curve a bit easier. Now, I got to wait until my brother buys his RSX so I practice on it. I'll also look around the area for a class that teaches MT driving (as work schedule allows). Furthermore, I'll probably have to learn quick with one of the Twins since I'll be driving it from the dealership to home. xD


One last question to ask, if y'all don't mind. A few members mentioned "clutch slipping." Quick Google search came up to a Wikipedia section mentioning what it is. Won't that wear out the clutch faster compared to normal usage? Or as another member posted, don't worry about clutch conservation for now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clutch_...ing_the_clutch


Yup, I like to get the theory part down first then go to the practical application part. Its how I went from zero knowledge about how computers/networks/etc. work to working in a big IT company in less than 3 years :)

for sure a feeling thing. I really only started understanding the gas/clutch balance by moving my friends car in and out of the my garage on to a sloped driveway to detail it. you'll feel the car "squat" at the clutch engagement point.

after that I was able to just drive MT without too many issues

The clutch should never be used as a tool to maintain a stationary position while on a hill. Basically, the less energy you dissipate through the clutch the better.

But again, it's just a clutch. Don't abuse the piss out of it and you'll be fine.

Best advice is don't stress about it. You'll suck when you start and stall a bunch of times, people will honk but screw them just do your thing.

Then one day you'll be driving and realize you didn't even have to think about it.

Everyone stalls, my only vehicle for the last 6 years has been a manual and I still stall sometimes.

NOOB! JK :)

I learned on my BRZ...stalled like 7 times on the way from the dealer. I feel bad for the clutch and it'll probably last me only 70-80k miles but oh well. I learned it and I'm proud of it.

Another tip to add to what everybody else has mentioned:

When (because it will happen at least once) you do stall while driving in traffic, don't get nervous or feel pressured by the driver behind you. Take your time, remain calm, start up the car, and ensure you get a smooth launch. This will most likely occur when you first start learning how to manage going uphill in traffic.

What everyone else said basically.

I learned to drive manual after buying my BRZ as well.

I think my biggest mistake was when I slowed to a crawl after cruising at normal speeds. I was still in 6th gear and forgot to downshift after slowing to <5MPH, car started shaking, lights started to flicker lol.

I've also stalled on a highway before (in traffic). Like everyone else said, dont panic, forget the guy behind you, just start the car up and roll on. I dont think I even got honked at that time... the person behind me was probably not even paying enough attention to notice.

Clutch slipping is to be expected when you first start because you're not used to how your clutch works yet. Eventually you'll know exactly where the engagement point starts and ends by muscle memory and you'll be in the clutch slipping zone much less.

For all those that have been driving stick since childhood, would you say you stalled the 86 like a noob driver when you first started driving it?

The spring-assisted pedal definitely threw me off.:bonk:

No issues on the test drive I took lol

That's why I'm not going to be hitting hills when I get the car; I even avoid hills if at all possible in the current car that I have! Just to save gas...

/CheapAsian

Anyways, I know I'll have to encounter a hill living in Seattle so guess I got to start some time haha