Thinking of getting an FR-S, but is it for me?
 

Hey guys,
I didn't find a similar post, I apologize if something like this already exists.
I am trying to decide whether the FR-S would be a right car for me. And yes, I will testdrive it of course, but I want to hear some opinions from people who have had it for a while.
I have a fair bit of knowledge about cars and driving and I enjoy a bit of occasional, casual spirited driving. I keep it on a safe side though, by no means am I skilled or experienced. I've never drifted before, I'm not a fan of burn-outs and I don't race.
My current 140hp Civic Coupe (manual) has a redline at ~7000 and it's pretty rev-happy (as far as I know, I haven't driven that many manuals). But occasional stiff/hard shifts into 2nd at high RPM and other minor shifter issues ruin the experience... So, my first question:
-Does it feel natural and non-destructive to operate FR-S closer to its limit? Does the shifter feel healthy and consistent all the way through RPM range?
-Would I be able to still have fun around the torque dip between 3500-4500rpm? Does it still pull adequately (I'm NOT a speed freak by any means) or is it actually annoyingly weak in that range? I'd be nice to not have to go past 5000 every time I want to overtake.

95% of my driving is to work and running errands, which I still enjoy with some good music, taking a corner or two a bit quicker than usual traffic, but obviously it's no track driving. Besides that, I just like using the shifter and feeling like I'm in something alive and beautiful, not in something like a beige-gray ecobox with "best-in-class dullness". So, the question is:
-Is it a pleasure on it's own with occasional fun driving (I'm not talking about creature comforts and bells and whistles)? Or is it not worth it unless I know how to drive a RWD car fast, drift it, mod it, etc?

I noticed that the general consensus on practicality was that FR-S is practical for a sports car, but still lacks practicality in a general sense. So,
-Is there anything terribly impractical for a young male driver with no kids, not picky about extra creature comforts, happy with the MPG specs, etc?

And finally:
-The infamous cricket/chirping fuel pump. Does pretty much EVERYONE have this issue? Do you hear it only when idling? Can you really hear it from the inside of the car?

Thanks guys!

Hey there OP...welcome to the forums. Before the flames come on, there are countless posts like yours asking for similar input. But I understand it's hard to discern from them if they aren't asking your specific questions.

I'm happy to share my input, take it with a grain of salt!

You can't find a similar new car with better handling/RWD/low center of gravity/excellent transmission for the same money. There's a reason the auto-journalists love these cars. They are affordable and well designed.

It is without doubt a pleasure to own just for driving around...but the car truly shines when going through curves.

It is practical enough for a sports car...and for a young man like yourself, it should serve your needs. I have three kids and there are times when it's tough to cart them around. Trunk is small, but rear seats do fold if you need to.

The one thing you may balk at is the stereo in these cars. I can't speak for the FR-S, but the BRZ one is quite mediocre with both operation and sound quality. An aftermarket upgrade can easily fix that though.

Don't fret the crickets. When they do occur for me, I only hear them at stoplight/stop sign...I have never heard them while driving the car.

This car is easy to drive at it's limits and most would agree it was designed to be driven that way. There's something really fun about revving this engine to 6K or more for each shift. The torque dip is a minor annoyance, and you learn to adapt your driving to get around it....there are aftermarket options to help here too.

Coming from your current car, you will love this car...go test drive and be prepared to want to drive it home.

Good luck and keep us all posted. Would love to see pics if you take the plunge and buy one.

^ pretty much all you need to know. Just never drive spirited with traction control off until you're in a safe environment. It's VERY easy to break the rear loose and if you have zero experience with having the rear come around you're gonna have a bad time. It'll possibly scare you to hell like it has with some of my friends lol. The stereo does suck indeed and you're gonna wish you had a better sound system if you do appreciate audio quality.

Welcome! I'll try and answer your questions one at a time:

Absolutely. The car comes into its element when driven at the limit.

The shifter? Yes - the only quibble some have is downshifting into first can be a little crunchy on a cold morning. I've rarely had this issue.

The torque dip is an annoyance, but also overrated. While I'd prefer it to be gone, living with it isn't an issue. If you want to engage in spirited driving, you'll only have to go through the dip once, every shift (at or near redline) will put you above the dip. The twins also have adequate power to pass without having to wind it out all the way, if you're passing safely.

Oh yeah. The only other car I've ever owned that I looked forward to hopping in, just for the drive home was my Miata. It's a car that will encourage you to find the long way home, and will reward you as you hone your skill at driving it.

Not at all, unless you regularly haul more than one passenger in addition to yourself. The backseat is useless for anything other than very small children.


*knocks on wood*

I've yet to have this issue. In others cars that have it, I never considered it that annoying either.

I had my heater fan bearing making noise..they replaced it once and it came back about a week after.. I guess just live with it..
you seem to be spot on as to what kind of power/experience you want out of a car.
I don't floor it that much and occasional acceleration is adequate. shifting feel is positive and i love it, now i want shorter throws though
the torque dip isn't THAT noticeable to me...at least..haha
as long as you are okay with RWD, and space/passenger seating.
I'd say go for it! but don't expect high quality craftsmanship I would say

OK it has to be said so I will step up!
Dude there are about 1,000 threads on this subject and 100,000,000 on the subject of crickets! You don't even need to search just read through some titles. Spend an hour or so just reading and all your questions will be answered.

OK that is over with so...

What the guys above said really!

A tune minimizes the torque dip. $550 from OFT. I've never had crickets, or at least never noticed them. There are a few used twins out there. I'd look for one of those now. Actually, I'd hunt for a well-sorted turbo or Jackson Racing supercharged car, preferably with a built engine. Let someone else spend the big money.

Oh, and if you want to get chicks, this is the wrong car. This might get you some dudes, but that's about it. If you want to attract women, get big convertible: Toyota Solara, 3-series, etc.

If this were the car for you, you would not be here asking a bunch of random strangers for their opinion: You would be on your way to the dealer to buy it no matter what got in your way.

If you do not have that kind of passion for owning a sports car, you should not buy one. There are lots of cars that make sense and are practical. This is not one of them.

Are you coming from an 8th or 9th gen R18 civic? If you are in an 8th gen with a manual, you probably have one of the best handling, fun to drive and practical economy cars.

If you get the FR-S you will obviously make a sacrifice in cost and a little bit in practicality. Our rear seats only seat two instead of three, and it is really really cramped back there. The suspension is very solid and makes for a bumpy and for some, an uncomfortable ride. There is no sunroof. You gotta pump premium instead of regular.

But when you wanna rip it, its amazing. The steering and suspension are so precise. Even just swerving around potholes feels so planted. The throws on the stock shifter are very short. The car is light and agile. Don't worry about the torque dip. The engine is 60hp more than an R18 civic. It will still feel a lot faster.

To me I feel its worth every bit of the extra cost in terms of money and practicality. But it's really up to you to decide how much you need or plan to use the extra performance. If you feel don't need the 200hp or the stiff suspension, then maybe keep the civic for a bit longer. Mazda3s and the base Golf can be pretty fun in manual as well. Even the 2014 Scion TC is not a bad alternative to a Civic EX coupe. People here make fun of the TC, but their looks and suspension were updated for 2014 and I think its pretty good value for its niche --a fun to drive economy car with all the practicality of your Civic EX/LX/DX. The FR-S is more of an alternative to the Civic SI. I don't know if you are considering an SI? FR-S is a slightly lighter, more agile SI, with lower center of gravity, less body roll, and rear wheel drive, but no sunroof, less interior space and no BWAAHHH sound when you hit VTEC. (I love that sound as might have figured from my username haha. But not enough to give up on rear wheel drive)

If this were the car for you, you would not be here asking a bunch of random strangers for their opinion: You would be on your way to the dealer to buy it no matter what got in your way.

If you do not have that kind of passion for owning a sports car, you should not buy one. There are lots of cars that make sense and are practical. This is not one of them.

Yes it feels fantastic shifting at the limit, working this car hard is where it feels the most natural.

On the flip side putting around town under 4k rpm is kind of a disappointment in my opinion, will probably feel very similar to your civic except less refined.

Ignore the crickets imo, it's a non issue. If you really care what people think this isn't the car for you, there will always be someone saying "Why didn't you get the Subaru/Mustang/Genesis/Miata/S2000?" problems or not.

It will absolutely be a pleasure on a smooth windy backroad, experienced or not.

Honestly sounds more like you'd enjoy a Hot Hatch, more practical and often times much more comfort focused. A GTI, Focus/Fiesta ST, Abarth, Civic Si, Mini, Mazda3 whatever else I forgot. Might be a little less intimidating and a better long term choice. They also afford you the opportunity to get into driving more competitively, you can take any of those to an AutoX or Track Day and have a good time (again you can do this with a Toyobaru, Mustang, Genesis, Miata etc. as well, just a different avenue to explore).

Oh and don't let RWD scare you, my grandparents survived for decades driving RWD cars with much lower handling capabilities, it's a helluva lot easier to live with now.

You've never heard them while driving the car because the 'crickets'/noisy solenoid actuation is actually due to the HPFP's target pressure at idle. Try revving your engine a little bit at a stoplight, to where the HPFP kicks out of its target idle pressure and into the "normal" operation pressure- voila, crickets instantly go away.

Refer to this post for more info

Thus, it is possible there is a tuning fix for this issue... also explains why those who try to 'cure' crickets with injector additives are just banging their head against the wall at best, and hurting their engine/pocketbook at worst.

:)

Wow guys, I did not expect so many detailed replies! Thanks to everyone who responded! :thumbup:

Actually, I did spend at least an hour reading posts about crickets and watching multiple videos on youtube. I was pretty dissapointed because there were, like you said, 100,000,000 threads on the subject and that might have blown it out of proportion for me. I wanted to get an idea about whats its like in the interior, when you're driving which wasn't clear from what I've read or watched. In general, you only write about an issue if you have it and its bugging you, so that makes it hard to evaluate how bad it really is or how often in happens.
Anyway, in any case thanks for your and everyone else's input. I'm selling my Civic and really looking forward to taking FR-S for a test drive.

P.S. I feel like this forum is a bit more intelligent and respectful than the forums dedicated to other cars that I have previously read/participated in. I hope that's a reflection on the car :)

Hi there OP!

I was pretty much in the same boat as you. I loved cars growing up but I was in no way a speed demon or huge risk taker.

I do some spirited and technical driving from time to time and I think the car is great for both of those as well as daily driving. While the torque dip does exist, it won't prevent you from doing every day driving tasks. I am also in the same boat as you (young male, no kids, etc). I don't find the car to be terribly impractical; you just won't really be able to give more than 1 friend a lift at a time.

I have no experience modding, track driving, or drifting but I still find this car extremely fun to drive. I find that the car makes every highway on/off ramp and corners fun, even on a daily commute to work.

I've had my car for almost two months now and I'm 2,000 miles in. No signs of the crickets yet :D.

Hope this helps and welcome to the community (I have a feeling you'll be joining us)!

Ya I was hoping to stave off the dozens of "search" replies you will get but it remains to be seen if it worked!
I spend 14 hours a week for almost 4000 miles a month in my car and can say without a single doubt that it is a great one.
Crickets are hit and miss and if you read all the threads (or even a small fraction) then you know that solutions or non-occurrence's vary for almost every single driver. Even when you do have them though they are not nearly as bad as some guys make them out to be so don't let that worry you.


P.S. If you read much you should be able to tell that this forum can descend into total darkness as well. Just throw up some pics of your car with a big wing and stickers and see what happens!

Just go to a dealer, not just Scion, that has a used one and ask the salesman to keep it for a few days. Probably a good way instead of a 5 minute test drive.

Just test drive it in city traffic, highway if possible. Will give you an idea
what you are gettin

The torque from 2k to 3.5k is more than adequate to get around town a bit quicker than most of the commuters.
Actually, that's where mine spends most of its time, even on the highway.
Today on 50 to 60mph roads I passed a couple slowpokes by shifting down to 5th and moving on without even getting to "The Dip".
Pretty much a non-issue.

The high pressure fuel pump will make some noise because of the task it's asked to do.
Whack a bunch of liquid into a tiny aperture.
Finding non-ethanol fuel reduces the audible attributes somewhat.
I've heard that the fix for it is wrapping it with an insulation blanket.
Kind of a "Put a bird on it" solution.

Sunroofs. NOPE! Nope! nope! NOPE!
Mostly from people who live where it doesn't rain.
Don't want a damn hole in my roof. A convertible is right out.

I used to drive actual "REAL" sports cars. Alfa, Triumph, MG, Sunbeam & etc. Not supercars.
The twins have so much more torque than any of those did, but hold on to the road with the best of them.

Also had an 83 Civic S (carb before the Si). 86 is a big step up in handling and motivational force.
You won't miss it at all. If you have big packages, that's what a rental van is for.

It's a great car. Even with a 1year inks it's still pretty practice to drive. My son gets the biggest smile when he sees daddy's car.

As for the sound system, I added an aftermarket deck and a jl sub/amp. Sounds amazing. All the stock sound system needs is the ability to tune the speakers properly and an 8 or a 10 to pull some of the bass away from the door speakers. It's a factory 8 speaker system and anyone telling you the speakers are crap don't have it tunes right.

Haven't found a similar post? Dude someone posts this question once a week.

People responded positively because clearly you had already done some research. As for the haters, well, they gotta hate.

From what you wrote, I would venture to say that the FR-S would be a good car for you.

Just pick a pretty color and a transmission that you are comfortable with ....:thumbsup:


humfrz

i love the FR-S. I am married with no kids, and I do admit, there are times when the impracticality of the vehicle comes into play (cannot drive both parents comfortably around town, friends, having more than 2 piece of luggage in the back)...but as someone said, the rear seats do fold down.

I have an automatic, but the car drives really well on the streets. It brings a smile to my face when i drive it to the grocery store, running various errands and such. Sound system isn't too bad nor great..i have it on the xB setting and that helps a bit.

Sometimes i wish there were more creature comfort features, but in all honestly, i really don't need it. Yes, heated seats and auto climate would be nice, but i figure if i had those, it would be one more extra thing that might go wrong in the future when the car gets old.

the cricket bothers me greatly. It's pretty darn loud and i have no fixed mine because other people tried it and the noise came back. I see it as a way for the car to make noise to the pedestrians walking in the parking lot, saying that i'm behind them.

The car is hard to get in and out but that's the life of a sports car. In all honestly - this is a great car and you will not regret it.

I recommend the Genesis coupe, Mustang, Camaro or new Civic Si coupe. Civic Si probably the best fit. Your apprehension regarding the tradeoffs indicates you aren't prepared to sacrifice all for the passion of driving a true sports car. Believe me, I have no business owning one of these cars. I'm 50, have a 7 year old and 16 year old, financially not really set to have 2 cars, but have them. I could benefit from another $35K or so in savings (at least what I have sunk in this car). But I am passionate and wanted this sports car in my life. Despite a financial decline experienced in the last few years I will never regret my decision.

If things improve for me down the road I would seriously consider the next Supra.

The Si is a good tradeoff.

It actually does.

The shifter is fantastic. Only when its really cold is where its the least consistent. If it warms up a little bit, it runs like normal.

Its weak in this range. However if Vancouver traffic is as slow as Toronto traffic...you'll probably overtake people at even the 3000 rpm. Basically exceeding 3500 rpm in 6th gear...you're well past most speed limits in Canada.

I actually bought it because its a fun RWD car that is still at its best when its not that fast. Just yesterday I realized I left something at work after I got home, normally I'd be too cross at myself to go back to get it...but I left early enough to recover it and thought...at least I get to drive the car some more.

I fit this massive box into the car.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...T86/FRSbox.jpg

If you carry stuff bigger than that often, then no.

I'm nearing a full year of ownership, no crickets.

:lol:

You haven't been on here very long have you?

:lol:Hehehehe! That's a good one!

OP the car is great....Just buy it! ;)

You guys have been great with responses, so I cant just go silent. It may be a couple of months until I can to the dealership and actually get one... But then again, more time to test drive and all.

I didn't know you could do that, I wonder what the dealer will ask for in return.

That's good to know about "REAL" sports cars, and a bit surprising. So they were all about revs and handling in your experience?

Haha, well I'm definitely more comfortable with an auto, since I've only driven a manual for 6 months. But if I was looking for comfort, I'd forget about a sports car buy my dad's Camry :D. So manual it is for me. Can't ignore my primeval urge to slide the stick where it belongs for thrills, pleasure and achievement of my earthly goals.
(English is my second language, so pardon me)

Thanks, thats some useful info!

I did consider the Si for the longest time. And it would probably be my fall-back choice if I can't/don't want to get the FR-S.
When I was a kid, I fell in love with the way RWD coupe sports cars looked like. Jags, Astons, etc. I can't afford those of course, and I have no idea what they were like to drive an own. But the FR-S, at this point of time, sounds like the best way to satisfy that craving. While I'm still young to not give a damn about back seats or trunk space.
Si will always be a FWD egg-shaped sports car that is based on an economy sedan, wouldn't it? As good as it is (and it is a terrific car).

I'm sure Vancouver traffic isn't quicker than Toronto.
And about unnecessary driving - quite often those trips turn out to be the best!

Nope! :)

Many thanks to all!

Yep, just need a drivers license and proof of insurance and you're good to go. Gotta schmooz the sales person and tell it you need to test it as a daily driver.

Hey VTEC! I see you have the Invida N1 Exhaust. I have the same and I really don't notice the torque dip much (does the cat-back help increase the low end torque? Maybe). I do know that on the highway at 65-70 even in 6th gear the car seems pretty damn torque y. I was waiting for "this car" for the last 30 years... (I had on my list the Civic coupe, 350Z, Mustang (almost embarrassed to admit this..but I was focus on pure torque of a V8) but how often could you really get to use it. I rarely get above 100 while commuting back and forth to work (maybe twice a day)...Do I really need to be "doing 120" on the highways (I would if I had the Mustang...but that would be a bit silly).

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Its funny because its true, but you attract old women with solaras, don't do that

But in all seriousness OP, 20 year old here and have had it for about a month now, just hitting 2000 miles today. Its been hard to not find the long way home a lot lately. Once you start learning the small limits of the car, you realize that she can do more, and more, and more, and eggs you on to continue to find out what she is made of. My $.02 might not be the heaviest compared to most that have already replied. The RWD + snow weather brings out the hoon in me sometimes and it gets kinda fun, It doesn't hurt to do it once in a while. Casual driving isn't bad, you can still get pretty good MPG out of her if you really want to.

I absolutely love this car, hope you will too if you decide its right for you.

I don't know about just attracting guys... My RS1 attracts the ladies just as much as the guys :thumbup:

OP, get the car. There is nothing in it's price range that compares in terms of smile-per-mile. I had to drive my friends Subaru (a nice one) and I could not believe how dead the thing felt. It's a very special little car that we are lucky to have.

Tromatic, thanks! I hope that would be my experience as well.

Come on, it couldn't be that bad :). Girls aren't the reason I want to get this car, but I'm sure it would do better than Solara in that department... Convertibles are rare in Vancouver anyway, it rains way too often for it to be worth it. And 4 out of 5 girls I drove in my Civic Coupe, complimented it :thumbup:. Maybe it's a Vancouver thing...

I'd rather take the car for a spin than take a ride on my motorcycle, most times. It's that much fun at legal (or maybe just a bit above) speeds. Re the "torque dip", there is a relatively cheap way to take some of that away, but half the fun of the car is learning to drive around that dip. It's like a two-fiddy' motorcycle. It takes some effort, but it's more than well worth it.

Not affiliated, I have one: OFT Tablet. Get one, fill up with E85, flash, grin like idiot.

And I seem to be covered in female repellant, so no help there.

ETA: Drive an AT and MT if you can. The AT is really good. If I didn't have hip trouble....

I've gotten many compliments from guys over cars I've driven. There are three cars I've driven that got compliments from females. 1. Mercedes 300E Convertible - compliments from a hoard of teenage girls. And a request for a ride. 2. Toyota Solara Convertible - compliments from a daisy-dukes-wearing blond in a raised Jeep. Kapow. And that happened with my wife, infant daughter, and late-50's female friend in the car. 3. My current Fiat 500e - a middle-aged woman magnet.

For the record, grandmas buy cars that every woman wants. They just finally have the money.

The right car leads to opportunity. You can take it or not. Other cars lead to dudes. An FR-S convertible would attract babes like no other. An FR-S attracts dudes.

Lol come on guys you should have no problem picking up younger girls in an FR-S. It's a pretty sexy car. It will be at least as good as the OP's civic coupe. If you're going for 25+ women then ya they start looking for the guys with luxury cars cuz they want to see that you've established your career. But there's plenty of other ways to flaunt your money if that's what you wanna do. You can pick up girls in a corrolla if your spending enough money buying them food and drinks. (As long it's not some 1995 Corrolla with the bumper pushed in. Then you should probably just save your money)


Ya I don't think the torque dip is that bad. I also own a Honda which had no torque at all before I modded it. A little torque dip is better than no torque at all. Maybe the exhaust did help a bit I'm not sure. I didn't keep it stock for too long haha. But usually exhausts make you lose a bit of low end torque. But I also have a K&N air filter which supposedly helps the throttle response. So maybe they cancel each other out lol

Hey Squad!

Nope not Squad. Dude is just going around and throwing random cut and pastes from other peoples posts on. Guess he figures it is funny.
PS: I see he is gone already!

I'm guessing someone by the name Squad posted the same question somewhere? I admit that I only skimmed through the topics and a few threads regarding SOME of my questions. Which I'm sure are still legitimate and non repetitive since most of the people who responded were pretty enthusiastic about sharing their experience :)