To those who keep comparing the FRS to another car on specs...
 

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Wekfest 2012 Long Beach CA, Scion FRS by Moto@Club4AG, on Flickr

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Scion FRS by Moto@Club4AG, on Flickr

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Wekfest 2012 Long Beach CA, Scion FRS by Moto@Club4AG, on Flickr

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Visting Scion HQ by Moto@Club4AG, on Flickr

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6_1_2012_FRS_Crossroads_Meet-10 by Moto@Club4AG, on Flickr


If these photos and the life behind the wheel of this car, with each shift and steering input, with brakes on purely command as extension of your foot...

And the shape, sounds of the 12.5:1 compression, 7400rpm music, and workmanship all harmonized into a $25,000 package...

If these things alone doesn't stir your soul and you STILL need to keep comparing numbers or who is quicker... I really don't have the words for you. You are of a different breed of enthusiasts, and that's all good.

The FRS is really not for you really... But please don't bash on the inherent design of this car, its specs, and deficiencies till you really live with this car, and experience the community and life that surround it. As it is something not expressed in numbers or stats. It is a passion that kindles for the few, who "get it" And that is only something that happens to those who do understand, and need not happen to everyone.

For the same reasons, I don't gripe and hate on the Mustang having archaic suspension as that is what brings flavor to the current Ford Mustangs, for some that is something beyond the critics. Some pursue the greatest number of miles achieved by modifying a Prius, driving them 30 at a time on a raceway, squeezing ungodly mileages out of every drop of gas... That's all great too! Lancer Evo and Subaru WRX owners battle in the dirt and spend days getting covered in mud jst to see who can get to the goal checkpoint before the sun comes up. Lamborghini owners gather just to gawk at the gull-wing doors, and spend that afternoon drinking coffee. Land Cruiser owners forgo the new Jeeps and strive to build the trucks to see if they can go over another rock that's bigger each time. There's lots of ways to have fun on four wheels.

We just all need to be friends and understand this, and not try to trap and rope the FRS into every damn numbers game out there... It can hold it's own fan-base, and captivate the souls of those that understand it. That's all it really needs to be, and the rest is up to the owners to build and go seek their own competition. It's not that the FRS is slow or under-built, or feminine, or whatever... It's just a white canvas where a great $25,000 sports car exists with a great platform to make a car his or her own way.
Instead of putting it down, why not just appreciate that this car did come out for us, at great risks in today's economy and general outlook for sports cars. And covet it as enthusiasts, and try to look into the next 10 years, and see what we can do with them as individual owners, and as a community.

After seeing a few FR-S in person now, I just can't fathom giving up that sexy look for anything else. There isn't another car on the road for under $50k that looks this good. Getting inside is another revelation. It isn't like being at a car show and sitting in an $80k 911 S where I simply cannot see myself ever buying the car. The FR-S isn't so expensive that you feel like a yuppy. It isn't so cheap you feel like you're slumming it. Everything is in its right place. It just fits. I can't think of a better car under $50k and considering how cheap it will be to keep on the road, I'm not sure there is another modern car I'd rather own. It hits the sweet spot in so many ways.

Well said!

I'm thinking the FR-S is for me.

http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/x...FR-S/FR-S2.jpg

True sports car passion right there. As always Moto, its a pleasure to read your words.
~:3

Well said Moto. To further go along with what you said. In my opinion this is a more along the lines a bare/affordable proper sports car and with that it comes with features missing in a GT or luxury sports car, but in return you get a more raw driving experience.

In my opinion, this is the first car in years to come from Japan with a soul. Its appearance is striking and it moves me (in more ways than one). Admittedly, even I didn't "get it" at first. I thought, "Oh, it's only rear wheel drive" and "Oh, it's just a naturally aspirated 4 cylinder." But once I started to look into this car and understand it, it changed everything I thought I wanted in a car. Sure, more grip and more power is nice but that's just more of the same. This car though, offers something very different from any other car available today. And after test driving the FR-S a few days ago and getting the tail out with very little effort, my heart is now set on buying one.

It's almost like a love story. You see a girl who you are attracted to at first sight but think, "Well, she's probably not the one for me anyway." But then she stays on your mind and you start talking to her more and eventually you realize just how special she really is and that she makes you a better person. And then you get married I guess. Let's just hope problems don't arise in the relationship as we go on. :lol:

Pastor Moto has spoke! lol

But seriously, it's so true

Excellent post.

I get it. Too bad the stealerships don't. Eventually I will get mine in 3-5 years. Hopefully they will still be around.

And just like your favorite girl, you can spend money and dress her up to your liking! All it takes is a patient 10 year relationship, and understaning what floats her boat, and how you want things to be. A car like this shouldn't be built overnight. Sure, some aftermarket guys are happy to decorate mine in exchange for all the fluffy hits they might have on the net, but eventually with my OWN timeline, things will change and we'll see how many of them are still enthusiastic. :D As for me, it's a keeper so my mind is a lot more long-sighted than anyone who's in this for a marketing campaign. :D Passion is what floats my boat.

When I'm 100% settle down (or 90%) w my financial stuff, I gonna buy FRS... or BRZ and I gonna keep it til I die or FRS/BRZ die.

No, woman nor baby/child gonna make me sell it or trade it! :D

I'll have mine in 5 years, and I'll have many more buddies, events, activities... So not worries! Not everyone is in the right position in the right era to buy a new car. I've had the same issue with the original AE86, I was a high school kid with 1985 AE86 sitting there in the showroom, thinking "someday" And that passion ignited in 1992 when I had a chance to build one, and after 6 AE86's over the next 2 decades, the passion created a huge network of friends as my web community, Club4AG.

That lead Mr.Tada the Chief Engineer to seek input from all of my friends, and the result was this car. Its all in due progress of life, chances, and continual passions.

I'll be there if I am the last person on Earth to still own one, and even then, I will be waiting for you to get yours. Take your time, build your life, and aspire and plan to be in a position to buy one when you are ready.

Thanks Moto. Once my commute cuts down to less than 100 miles a day I'll be right there. For now my TDI keeps me happy.

you are coming across as preaching a religion and apologizing for the lack of power and torque. In this respect, you're only making the situation worse. So it's no wonder you're afraid to make comparisons. What about those who want to take a critical look at the car and it's position in the market place? You should have said, you have nothing to say to them as well. Why shouldn't prospective buyers take a comparative look at what different manufactures offer in this segment of the market? You obviously have nothing to say to people who want to take the considered and rational approach. You want people to be an ostrich like you, with your head firmly buried in the sand.

You talking about dolls or humans? LOL, JK, JK. But yeah, I'm the type that waits for something good and then sticks with it. My Eclipse GSX is 14 years old but I still feel the same about it as the day I first saw one as a child in '97. The FR-S being so unique justifies me keeping the Eclipse. If it had been what I originally thought I wanted (a faster, grippier, modern sports coupe), then I don't think I could have justified keeping the Eclipse. Having two cars seems like a pain but I see that many of you have 2 or more cars! My uncle for example has 6 Jaguars. :D

So with the Eclipse, FR-S, and the Ninja, my garage will be complete. But I will always be improving them. :)

It didn't sound like he was saying to not compare the FR-S to other cars. Sounded more like he was saying that everyone has their own idea of what makes a "good" car and that people should focus more on their own desires and less on others' opinions and that we should all be a happy family of car enthusiasts.

Awesome post

No no, the responses have made it seem so... I'm not trying to buy the hearts of religions, or start a cult here...

All I am saying is that I am seeing all these comparative articles making hard objective races and stats, and almost sounding like if the FRS was something else, this barely even when the cars are coming out into the public. I just wanted to assure folks that this car has its own attributes besides the benchmark numbers, something intrinsic that justifies the costs of ownership, and a very good set of them, to keep people happy.

It's just a counterpoint to those who only see cars in 0-60 times, and lateral G specs...

Besides, all those things can be had with enough resources and personal plans to change what came out of the factory, as modifications and tire changes, and a million other ways to individualize it. And as such this car also is a great platform for all of this with the elements like ease of access and changes for smaller sub-components, and also the ultra rigid uni-body that's not common to cars of this price range.

So please don't take it with such threats... I don't mean this to be a huge insult to anyone LOOKING at the numbers, to make his choices. I am merely elaborating on other neat attributes of the car.

I don't apologize for the power output, as engineers and product planning gave us exactly the numbers they promised, give or take a few in different test results at times. But that is again, another variable that happens on every car, as no climate, environment, air, and conditions are the same when testing machines in a real world.

Yes, my other cars right now are Lexus LS430, and Prius, as well as in the past having owned over 23 cars over 26 years since I obtained my driver's license. From BMW M3 to 2002's, multiple AE86's, S13, VW Jetta, to Porsche, Minivans and Big duallie trucks to haul my toys at certain stages of my motorsports career and events organizer. I'm still fascinated by all sorts of cars. And with a broader love and perspective, hard stats just became less important to me, and have never been the only reason to keep it over other elements.

In other words...

http://img.izismile.com/img/img5/201...mes_640_11.jpg

You want comparison?
Here comparison!

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6776

Another astounding post brought to you by one of the FT86clubs finest, but the real question is... where did you get those wheels eh?

you clearly havent driven this car for what it is, you got into the car with a predetermined prejudice in mind. you fail to understand that this car stands alone because it opens its own market segment, like the iPad when it first came out. Everyone has a notebook/Mustang before and it gets the job done but doesnt ignite passion. Some others have fancy phones/sport cars that push the boundary and draw look but still limited to what it can deliver/cant be a daily driver. Im no fanboy, i dont have an iPad but i have a tablet that is thanks to the iPad was born to first bridge the gap between phone and laptop then later create its own world of use. You think its a compromise thats why you compare it to things/cars that exist before it but its not. Until someone can make a car that with passion and practice a driver can squeeze every ounce of horse power and torque and handling and max them out all at the same time, nothing can be compare to it.

a religion is when everyone worship a single divine/car but this car is making a new culture which people are excited of also what is coming. i have an frs now but 10 years down the road im not gonna bash on the car from Honda that is born from my car, lusting maybe. also a religion/cult will not recognize anything else but as an frs owner i still want a range rover to go offroad, a gtr to track and hell a lambo to flash. those are the cars that are leading in their own worlds, different world than the frs/brz/gt86 world.

Oh come on and get real.....just look at the title, "To those who keep COMPARING the FRS to ANOTHER CAR on spec".

I love what the FR-S and stands for, but there are tons of cars out there that invoke passion.. I love that people on these boards are passionate and love these cars. You should. But to pretend that no other car invokes this same passion from drivers and owners is rather ridiculous and comes across as arrogant.

As soon as I heard about this car, before I saw the concept, I wanted it.

Then I saw the concept, and knowing it wouldnt be exactly like the concept, I definitely wanted it.

When I saw the finished product, I had to have it.

And driving it around, I am glad I have it.

Big fan of Toyota, loved the lines on my Celica, and this car is sexy as hell.

The history, the community that has developed around Scion in the US is pretty cool too.

All I ask is that you be relevant to the topic. You'll note the title, "To those who keep COMPARING the FRS to ANOTHER CAR on spec". "

I think thill has answered you thoroughly

Surely you could tell this thread was going to be a serious example of overdosing on the company koolaid. Sometimes it's just best to leave a thread that is going to wind you up alone.

Folks are going to be ridiculously up themselves about this car for quite sometime. Regardless of how silly it is, it's harmless enough.

sure im totally biased but im biased toward this car not against other cars if that make any sense.

Thank you Moto-P for your thoughts.
It was you at the Wekfest. I rode my road bike down to the Queen Mary on Saturday and saw all the cars. It was too early to get in @10 am. I asked the guy at the back gate, where the cars were coming in, if there were any FRSs'. He said one and it was you, cool. :thumbsup:

But you know, this car is bringing in passionate drivers from all over. The people on this board really know their stuff and love driving in its purest form. For example, a guy just posted a video of himself in an FR-S racing a 350Z on here and said he needed to either boost it or sell it now because it lost a drag race on the highway. That was the typical poster on the Mitsubishi DSM forums. But on here everyone was like, "Who cares?" Loosing to a car in a race doesn't hurt our egos. The numbers/power comparison game is pretty silly when you think about it. At the end of the day, it's still a road car so it should be designed to give you as much fun on the road as possible rather than being able to lap the Nurbergring as fast as some supercars or to out-drag everything you come across.

exactly, I have owned 23 cars in my life, ranging from Alfas, VW, Dodge Ram trucks to Chevy duallies, to Porsches, and many Toyota, Honda and Nissan...

FRS is just one of them... :D

It's SSR Type C-RS, 17x7.5 +42. (OOOPS edited: They are 18x7.5 +42 with 5mm spacers, and 225/40-18 Falken Azenis RT615K)

It's actually a set made for Prius by VIP AUTO Salon in Orange,CA, who happened to be retiring the Mio Prius project car, and his set was available for me to use for a few months. I bought some Falken RT615 since I have a track day coming up in June and wanted to just decorate it up a bit for the two shows it will be attending this month as well.

The offset isn't ideal so I slipped a 5mm spacer in the rear, and waiting on 10mm adapter spacer before the track event. Eventually I will work out a good fitment and get my other set sometime in August when all scheduled suspension settings and alignment are complete and I can actually get the true and accurate measure of where my wheels will sit against the fenders (as well as dynamic point of ideal load on hubs.)

Nice to meet you too!!!

Actually it was me dosing Kool Aide to Toyota staff in Japan since 2007 when I came on board with this project, before it was ever a concept car. :D

Never said the FT86 siblings were better than another car, and that's what I am getting at...
I doesn't have to be. It fits my wishes and it was a result of collaborating with a car company, which was an experience I covet as much as the result...
Probabaly something that happens once in my life, and have never expected... I only had a passion for many different cars and adhered to that love of cars all my life.

Exactly! Like you I have owned many cars. Some of them I was very passionate about. Others? Not so much and only kept them a year or two. I still think of my 1990 RX-7 Turbo II I owned when I was much younger and all the blood sweat and tears I put into that car and wished I still owned it today.

DUde, the FC3S RX7's were totally awesome in it's days. It still is. Some blame Mazda for its likeness to a Porsche 944 but I don't think that is something to be upset with.

Turbo II's and Japanese Enfini RX7 in various trim were the fun cars of the early 90s!!! Too bad they all fell apart a bit early, and despite the high initial sales, the car just couldn't stay together without some passionate upkeep in later years after 10 years. Still love those things.

Yes, it makes total sense. Just work on the English language articulation, as you have automotive passion fine and down! :D haha!

Well said Moto. I had to literally stand up and applaud.

The FR-S was the only car that made me willing to give up my Evo 8 since I got it 5 years ago. Sure I can feel the power difference, but I feel the car as a whole makes up for it. The way it handles, the hum of the engine, the sleek body lines on the car. To me it's everything they claimed it would be and what it would represent - passion. I will miss my old car, but I don't regret giving it up.