Why so few DIYers
 

I find very few people are interested in working on their vehicles. Physical limitations and workspace constraints aside, what is the reason?

I consider myself to make a decent middle class wage but my hourly pay is not even half of the hourly labor rate for a shop. To me that means it is worth my time to fix my own car when i can. Why are so many opposed to it and refuse to even try when it is suggested?

I dunno for me it's tools and space, if I had a high paying job and all that I'd try to do as much work on my car as possible. However being an avid DIYer in general, I know that my craftsmanship...is somewhat lacking LOL. Stuff I toss together never looks pretty and is often not functional either, which is an argument for letting someone else do the work.

Time
Tools
Money
Has family
Some people aren't interested, they might like cars but don't care for the mechanical side of it. Though that might be the difference from someone whose into cars and someone whose a gearhead.

A lot of people are afraid as well. I say if you don't trust your self putting a picture frame on a wall, then don't touch a car.

Some may be intimidated. Rightfully so if they own new euro cars with all the tech inside them.

Laziness, even though I have an automotive degree and almost every tool known to man, sometimes I just don't want to work on my car. Usually I end up doing it anyway since I am a cheap bastard though.

I think a lot of it has to do with lack of resources as stated above, i.e. time, space, tools, etc. But I would also say that a large part of it is fear. Fear of doing something wrong, breaking something, running into a problem (seized nut, cross threaded nuts, etc.). It takes a certain mentality to be a DIYer in anything and not everyone can even if they want to. Some people are good with their hands and using tools. Some are not so they pay to have things done. This applies to anything DIY, not just cars.

I personally think with this car there are lots of DIYers. It just depends on what level, and what resources are available. Some might just be comfortable doing an oil change, others might be cool with installing an FI system.

The DIY section on the forum is an amazing resource. I'm rarely one to shy away from a project, but with the detailed instructions found here I can take on most projects with confidence.

The biggest reasons why I imagine people don't do less DIYs

1. Lack of tools. Seriously. What if I need to weld something?

2. No Garage....

3. Cost of convenience vs. personal satisfaction of knowing you installed it yourself. Sometimes the back pain and shoulder pain (arthritis) make it worth the extra few bucks to have it done

4. Skill, there are some jobs that you shouldn't tackle without having help or a great amount of resources around you. It's pretty silly to consider doing your own motor swap if you don't know if you have everything needed for a full swap, or how to figure things out like gauge cluster swaps

5. Newers cars have more electronics now that require specialized equipment to work on

I love working on my car, but I hate not having the proper tools to make the job easier. I'll do the easy bits without help like exhaust, but I'll take it to a friend's shop and have them help for tricky stuff.

Sometimes it's better to pay to have it done right IMO

Nick C.

thanks to places like harbor freight, not having tools is far from a legit argument when the standard auto labor rate is around $100 an hour.

One reason I see: These cars are so new that most of them are under warranty.

Why would we fix something that the dealer can do for free while risking screwing something up and voiding our warranty.
I even choose to let the dealer do the oil changes and scheduled maintenance because it then goes into their records.

Now installing aftermarket parts is a different story.

I have a job, a house to maintain, a wife to maintain, and two young girls. I simply don't have the time.

There's a certain amount of risk I'm willing to take on myself without guidance. Installing a new HD on my $1000 laptop, sure. Removing the bumper from my $28,000 car, no.

I would do more if I had friends/family nearby who could give me guidance, but my dad is really the only car guy I know and he's four states away.

I'm also a perfectionist, and I need things to come out EXACTLY RIGHT.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

I'm a big DIYer and really prefer to figure out everything myself unless it's something requiring specialty tools or an engine lift I don't have room.

Well, since my base auto hobby shop is closed, I have to buy all the tools needed to change my oil in my garage. And I might as well buy stuff that will last me, since I'll need to do all my maintenance in my garage. Oh, and a decent floor jack and jack stands, since I can't use the lifts at the hobby shop anymore. That's a decent sum of money just to change my oil. If I want to do anything specialized like pulling bearings or seals, that's more tools I need to buy. If I strip a bolt out, I need a tap set or helicoils. I probably ought to have those before I start working, because I won't be able to go out and get them if my suspension is hanging off the car. Some easy-outs, too.

DIY is expensive.

The lack of a garage and secondary car make it difficult.

Theft is really high where I live as well, the radio was stolen from my MR2 twice!! Who seriously steals a radio?! Who will buy it?! Just last week the spare tire was stolen off of a coworkers Jeep in the parking lot.

Anything that isn't welded to the car has a risk of walking away so if it takes more than a single sitting in a parking lot it can't be done. :(

I don't get the time argument. I do, however, understand the lack of facilities though like living in an apt etc.

I can change my engine/tranny/diff oil and rotate my tires in 40 minutes, basically in just the time it takes me to drive my car to and from the dealership.

As for those with kids, IMHO it's not a bad idea to use this as an opportunity to teach your kids about cars, maintenance, changing a tire etc.

Time is the most valuable commodity. Once it's gone you can't get it back. It's up to each individual to spend their time the best way they know how. I used to do my own oil changes but I realize that trying to do that along with everything else I had to do on my Saturday was taking away from time for myself and family. In that sense it is worth x amount of dollars for someone else to spend x amount of time on doing my oil change. Cars may be a very important part of your life, but to someone else, it may be something completely different.

I like wrenching on my project cars, but when it comes to a car that I paid almost 30k for, I don't mind paying a little extra for an expert to handle the important stuff.

Pic related: My latest project.

http://i.imgur.com/fsR1aDG.jpg

All of the things you mentioned are things that I regularly do to my own car. And things like spark plugs, wires, air filter, etc. But often, things that should be very simple end up being a huge pain in the ass.

You've moved your other car out of the garage and pulled in, jacked the car up, put it on stands. You want to change all the oils and replace an oxygen sensor. The engine and diff oil go smoothly, no problems. Then you try to do the transmission oil and discover that the fill plug nut is square, not hex, so you have to dig out your open-ended wrench. You can't get enough force applied without the wrench slipping, so you try an adjustable wrench. It still doesn't work, and you've now wasted a bunch of time and elbow grease, and you're hungry and pissed off. Not to mention, the oxygen sensor you ordered has a different length wire on it, and won't fit neatly in the loom for the original sensor wire, and you have to remove MORE stuff from the underside of the car to get to where you need to put it. After you eat lunch, you realize that the job is going to take twice as long as you originally planned for, and you have to cancel your dinner plans with your wife or friends, or leave the car jacked up overnight with the other car parked on the street and work on it Sunday morning when you wanted to chill out and watch the F1 race.

And god help you if you round off a nut, snap a bolt, or strip some threads. Now you're out a weekend AND possibly money for a tow truck, depending on what you broke, AND you have to pay to have it fixed anyway. :confused0068:

I really enjoy doing my own work when I can. But I also realize that my time is valuable, so I don't hesitate to use the plastic wrench. :)

And be careful about comparing your salary to that of a $100/hr mechanic. Can you do the job in the same amount of time he can?

Along with everything posted I'd like to echo the sentiments of the "well it's under warranty" crowd. This car is new, it attracts not only enthusiasts but buyers of new cars who often want to minimize the amount of maintenance and time spent doing anything about the car aside from driving it.

In 5 years this forum will be full to the brim with guys asking how to do things themselves because they bought this car on a budget and want to do it all on their own.

Pics or it didn't happen.

IMO that is exactly the point. Even if it takes you twice as long as a "skilled mechanic" you are gaining more than just fixing your car. You are gaining knowledge to do it again and much faster than last time, you are gaining tools, and the most important thing satisfaction. Simple example, I can change my oil faster than I could drive to and from a dealer. Is that not worth a $100 jack and stands? I think so. And that is where the rabbit hole begins.


The first time I worked on my car I tried to upgrade a rear sway bar. I didn't use a jack or anything, just laid on my back under the car. The end links stripped and I learned quickly things will never go as planned.

Then I did brakes. Got a jack, torque wrench, tool set. Realized I needed tool to compress rear brake piston. Got that. Stuck rotor screws, impact screw driver. etc etc etc

Maybe overall I'm not saved any $, or even lost $, but I'd say the combined knowledge, tools, and satisfaction I have gained from wrenching is worth it.

I try to equate it simply for people like, did your mom buy a coffee pot instead of spending $5 a day at starbucks? Did your dad buy some weights instead of joining a gym?

The simple solution is not to get married, isn't it obvious?

I have more respect for the person who modded the cars themselves compared to the guy who went down the block to Midas to get it done. It really does say something.

A lot of people forget that the knowledge you learn from working on cars can be applied to many other problems that require solutions by you.

Certain things i understand. You need to port your head? Go to a machine shop. Body work? Send it to a body shop. But something like an exhaust install, coilovers and lights is something any of us can do with some patience...along with trial and error.

Also.
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p75FaYGAsXk"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p75FaYGAsXk[/ame]

It's mostly time for me. I work 6 days a week and don't have time on my day off since I'm sleeping.

For me it's space and capabilities.

While I don't turn a wrench for a living, I can since I have to instruct and guide those who do for a living.

When it comes to working on any car - I live in a condo and it's a NO-NO for condos. When I lived with my parents, I worked on my MR2 in their garage a good chunk of the time (changed the alternator, changed the steering wheel, changed the wiring harnesses, etc.).

Also some things require specialized tools that at the time were too expensive for me to buy once and never use again (or rent).

I don't envision myself buying a house anytime soon since the house prices are ridonkulous around Toronto so I will have to rely on a respected tuner/shop to do my work for me.

Easy stuff like replacing trim pieces or stuff I can do inconspicuously, I will probably still do but you won't see me crawling under the car in the basement parking lot.

I would love to do more of this stuff myself on this car, but the issues I have you stated. Even if I had a driveway I'd make more effort. But I have street parking and no way to get the car into the back yard. So I pay someone to do anything I can't/wont do out there.

:thumbsup:

True for me, the enthusiast with a racecar, but we're not just talking modifying and upgrading, we're talking basic maintenance too which everyone should know how to do even if they choose not to or don't have the means. IMHO, if you have the means to be teaching these lessons to your kids, you should be and they'll be better for it. I still don't see the kid argument as an excuse either, parents should involve their kids in repairs, their hobbies and in the work and maintenance of the house. It's good for them and good for the parents.

Boy if you aren't kidding!

But we live in the day of the internet and countless online tutorials. If you've never replaced your tranny fluid before and you're not reading a tutorial first before attempting it, then you're doing it wrong. There's a reason why the term RTFM exists. :) Doing that first will eliminate 95% of all difficulties and surprises. But hopefully parents have taught these important life lessons (such as reading the manual) to their children.

I like to "do it myself".

Important to know how your car works just in case. I will never let anyone else touch my car besides myself or one of my close buddies who is just as meticulous as me.

Some shops are good, but most like to half ass things as my friend and I are slowly discovering working on a few local cars for people. My buddy had an expensive set of Recaro's put into his Z06 and they scratched the hell out of the back plastic, didn't use washers on some bolts which dug into the seat brackets pulling up paint and screwing them up, and scratched his very expensive door cards.

Not saying all shops are like this, but its unfortunately more common than I'd like to imagine.

My friend is 19 years old and works at an Infinti dealership as a mechanic, they had him do a full engine swap on his own on his 3rd week. All by himself, he thinks it went well. First time. You don't know what happens behind close doors? :lol:

lol i'm all for throwing yourself in with the wolves to learn, but on a customer car, not too sure on that :lol:

I mean thats how I learn, and learned on older cars (my cars of course). There is SO much information on the web today. Even when i'm sure of something, I usually still do a refresher and double check on things before pulling something off (some things). If you are unsure of something most of the time the answer is out there. The only way to learn is to dig into it, but thats a little extreme :lol:

pulling the motor on my STi was so easy. The thing was light too, if it wasn't for it being an awkward leaned over position I could have pulled that thing out without a hoist lol

The main reasons I do everything on my cars my self are:

1. I don't trust other people to car about my car as much as I do when it is being worked on. So when I do it, I know it was done properly and don't have to drive in fear of something falling off or blowing up.

2. Taking things apart and putting them back together has always been something that has come naturally to me every since I was a kid.

The two most extensive things I have done was a replacement motor swap and replacing my input shaft. For the input shaft I did have to bring the shaft with the gear set on it to a trans shop. I had to get the gears pressed off the old one and pressed onto the new one because I don't own and press and wasn't about to go at it with a hammer lol.

Doing it myself helps keep me from buying more car parts. Seriously! Wrenching on my car, taking care of it instead of throwing money at someone else helps satisfy my "got to drive or mod!" urge. It's like that's satisfied and I can settle for "naaaaah, I'll wait till when I originally decided to get x part." When just throwing money at it, no effort expended and you sit around while someone else enjoys working on your car instead of you.

Certain things I WILL let someone else do. New radiator and installing an oil cooler? Yeah, I'll let someone else do that. Exhaust system? I did/am doing that myself (though fixing that troublesome leak turned out to be best taken care of by taking it to an exhaust shop... I only spent $15). Coilovers or springs (if I do them)? Yeah, I'll do that myself. Obviously tire mounting is done by a shop, and might as well let them put the new wheels and balance them while they're doing that. FI install? I'll get a few friends to help with that. Oil changes? Do it myself once dealership oil changes are expended. Transmission/diff oil? Did it myself.

I'm enjoying this car far more by doing the work myself. I'm not just the automobile owner, I'm the driver and I take care of it. It's like the difference between being the owner of the Packers and being the head coach.

I like to do all the clean stuff myself.

Installing a differential? I'll pay someone to have that headache.

^ This!

I don't trust anybody but myself when it comes to cleaning my car.

I echo the reasons mentioned above.

I pride myself in that I've never had a shop touch my Miata for anything other than mounting tires on wheels - including extensive interior work; full suspension install; fairly extensive brake work; and teaching myself bodywork (sanding/primered body; shaved bodyline & antenna; hand fabricated headlights & rear panel/tails); not to mention taking care of a LOT of mechanical issues along the way. It's easier for me on that car since it's not a daily driver & it can be put up on jackstands for months at a time.

On the FRS, it's pretty much always been a daily driver (just bought a truck a couple of months ago to flip in a few months). I need that to be ready to go at any time. If there's something easy that can be done in a couple of hours (assuming I have a couple of hours free), I'll do it. When I did my coilovers, I had to enlist the help of a local shop because I couldn't afford to not have a car for more than a day.

Lately, I've been working 70+ hours a week & whatever free time I can get is going to be spent with the wife, or knocking shit out around the house on the "honey do" list. I love working on cars (and driving), it's my release from the world & IMHO the next best thing to sex and drugs, but there's just not any time...

This. My skill set is somewhere else. if its obviously easy I'm in. But screwing up something major has an intimidation factor. Leaving two options, "Just do it because YOLO" Or Paying someone that will back their work, and Has hte expertise.

But I get OP's question because I laugh at people who take their computers to a shop.

It's amazing what you can do to a car with a jack and good weather. I'm a gearhead and just recently became a mechanic. I work on my friends car when possible since I have no kids I got enough time...it's quality time really! Beer and friends wrenching away.

As for tools they are one of the few things in life that you can buy and are an actual investment, especially if you plan on driving all your life. I loooove buying tools. Saying cars are getting too complicated is an excuse, the drivetrain, suspension components and brakes are things that can be tackled easily. You just need to plan and be ready to have the proper tools.

The worst of wrenching is the occasionnal rust/broken bolts. The more you work the less you'll worry about them.

A great mechanic/DIY will also fix EVERYTHING around the house (maybe minus 120 AC electricity). Save money and buy the lady flowers

I was never really a car guy until I got my FRS. I would change tires and some other really basic stuff, but just couldn't be bothered on the other cars.

Different story with the FRS. Since I am planning on tracking it there will be more maintenance required and in most cases specific things that I want to try.

As far as cost goes, by doing my transmission fluid, oil changes, and brake changes myself I will have paid off the new tools I required in one or two change out cycles.

That said, time is still a factor for me. The kids aren't an issue, but I have other hobbies/stuff that takes most weekend time so anything that will take a long time will need to be scheduled.

DIY auto repair shops are pretty common in the UK. They're like the "self checkout lanes" of auto maintenance. When I saw this on a few British car shows years ago I thought it would be a good business idea around here but haven't had the balls to borrow 1/4 million dollars to start one.

Here's one in Kansas:
http://diyautorepairkc.com/

Connecticut:
http://diyautomotivecenters.com/Services.html

Colorado:
http://diyautorepairshops.com/index.html

Even found one close to home in Kent, WA
http://selfservegarage.com/about