More power desires may be doomed
 

Just received the following Road & Track article: http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/news/...4_faster-scion

This news doesn't bode well for our wanting "more power" from the factory.

Though disappointed, I choose to think that our cars are increasingly rare and thus much more valuable!

This shit again?

I've read a lot of replies to the basic complaint that the FR-S doesn't have enough power. All I have to say is if you wanted a muscle car and you test drove the FR-S and still bought the damn thing anyhow,WTF!:confused0068:


Will it do a 10 second 1/4 mile, no! Is it fun to drive on a nice twisting road hell yeah!


Not enough power, sell the GD car and be done with it :mad0260:
Stop complaining YOU TEST DROVE IT!


Sorry, rant over now :)
:cheers:

My frs has plenty of power :)

Like the article says the FRS/BRZ isn't exactly slow. I think the engine has a lot of personality and I mean that in a good way. We all knew going in that this car would be a great platform for modification, a blank canvas if you will. This chassis is so well sorted and balanced, it can handle way more power. If that is what you want, the aftermarket has some great tuning options. :thumbsup:

It isn't exactly slow, until you have a passenger in it. The camry or accord with a passenger will eat them up. Then you realize what are you sacrificing for ? from a practical 4 doors sedan to a 2 door.

If you are an autocross person, or track the car, you will smile off, and book a trip to the closest SCCA event or track. If you are a common college student, you would be like....wow!!! with this face :cry: "I hate the Camry, and accord, grocery getter are faster than me" This is the reason why many others are switching side.....the reason why Subaru will keep on selling WRX and STI (more sold every year)

Honestly, the aftermarket can add more power with a better, safer tune for less than what you'll get charged extra between the current model and a factory FI'd version. All you pay is your warranty coverage for that section of the car and cash (which is better than what you're effectively paying when you finance even part of the cost of the vehicle). So, you're getting interest free, better performing FI.

This of course does require use of proper judgement and doing research, but that mostly costs some brain power, which is one of the only resources I know of which renews and grows itself the more it is used, so it's a win-win anyway.

Also, for those who don't want FI, costs stay low.

Here's to hoping this platform will be like the Miata: same basic concept for years and years, and around for forever.

Because that means in 20 years, we can be just as cheap as the Miata guys are, where a "uber cost-out-the rear" engine build costs at most $10k (look up "Targa Miata").

Hardly. I carry passengers on occassion and as long as I'm willing to go high rev, I can easilly pass the camry, accord, etc. carrying passengers.

Give me modified and tuned NA, and I can then do the same to WRXs.

If you are a "common college student" you should be so lucky to have the privilege to own this car.

Do you even own one?

I think he's one of the few who were dissatisfied.

90% sure he's an armchair quarterback, contemplating selling his Mitsu but was dissatisfied with the test drive. It's a testament to how entertaining our forums are that he's still here, talking down the Toyobaru every chance he gets.

Thankfully I can care as much about his opinion as much as I paid to read it... that is: nothing.

I went from an STI to this car and while I felt like I had to validate the STI purchase to myself constantly (those fuel costs really did hurt like none other, otherwise it wouldn't have felt so bad), I've felt absolutely guilt-free over getting the BRZ... except for the fact that I didn't hold out for a WRB model (that's it). It just annoys me that people think this car to be slow. Granted, if driven where WRXs and STIs generally are driven (about same tach range most folks drive their automatics: up to 5k max, and 4-5k is really pushing it), it IS slow. But if you drive this car it was intended to be driven, that is using the entire tach range from 3k-7k (2k-3k being cruise rpm range, where you need to downshift to move out of it swiftly just like in any other vehicle), it is not that slow. It's not that fast either, but its no slouch.

Consider that camrys and accords most likely (I haven't looked up the figures) weigh MORE and come with engines whose bhp output is significantly lower than 200 bhp.

If folks are getting easilly passed by the gas-sipping grocery getters on the freeway and getting pissed over it, then the fault is the with the driver for just mashing the throttle in 6th instead of following the proper steps for correct freeway chastisement of the offending sinner (do NOT do this on normal streets... if you do, I will laugh my @$$ off when the cop gives you that well deserved ticket):

1) smoothly downshift 1-2 gears (depending on current speed, current tach, and desired accel... basically your target tach when the clutch re-engages is to be ABOVE the torque dip)
2) smoothly apply throttle (all the way to WOT if needed, and if you were that slow to clue in that you were getting passed by an econobox)
3) extend vision ahead and check for traffic clearance
4) swiftly pass offending grocery getter with delusions of grandeur
5) profit

Easily done with ACN91 gas on stock tune and stock exhaust.

Now, against a pretentious v6 Mustang d*bag? Yeah, ain't happening stock. But that's his problem for having so small a manhood that he thinks that he has to fly by a car that was designed to run with much lower HP than his straight-line-only machine.

We should have a section of the website dedicated to these threads.

Title the section "A place where internet rumors go die..."

-alex

It should be obvious that I don't have a problem with "too little power". I bought the car for its balanced nature and pure fun-to-drive factor on public roads, in the twisties, and occasionally on the track.

Would I like more power? Sure, but I'm not willing to super or turbo charge the car until the warranty has expired.

The point is that the twins and variations for other markets are built in a Subaru plant and currently have the same power train.

If the economics don't make sense, Subaru and Toyota may eventually discontinue the car. It becomes increasingly unlikely that the companies would expend the time and $ to provide a higher-power edition in the future.

Had an STi version been available when I bought I would happily have jumped into its driver's seat! Still would trade if it were to be offered. Nevertheless, this car is great fun as it is. :burnrubber:

Good idea! Seriously. :thumbsup:

I don't fking care if Toyota or Subaru cuts the sale on 86. I have mine already.

There are shitload of parts to make things go fast.

But the fact is that I don't really feel the urge to make my car faster. All I just want is a set of lightweight wheels and sticky tires.

It's funny to say this because I'm coming from a modified Mazdaspeed3. I always wanted to go faster in that car, but not at all with my BRZ for some reason.

Maybe if I didn't go to the track with my BRZ, I would have wanted more parts. But then, I realized I'm a noob driver who can't even properly handle 200hp.

I do care if they cut sales. What if someone hits me on the freeway and balls up my car in about 7 years? I'd have to buy used (always risky) if they've already stopped production, or get a different car then.

I hope to still be able to buy a BRZ or FR-S new in 10 years if I have to.

These articles are funny. Yeah, the car's a bit underpowered, but I don't see why that's dissuading people from buying it. Of all the potential complaints to have about our cars, power seems like the silliest one to me. It's not like the car is retard-slow from the factory, and if you want more power it's not too difficult to go FI.

Personally I'm finding the engine sound to be the biggest letdown, mostly because I want it to sound like a six and there's no way to do it without an engine swap. Welp. Now that's expensive and impractical...

:clap: Should be stickied. You can even downshift 6th to 3rd on the highway in some cases. Basically if you're not running the engine from 5000-7400 rpm, the engine has plenty more to give. Just learn to downshift.

Haha I'm in the same boat, even with a CBE. It's made worse because I've also got a 350z with an amazing sounding V6. I'm wondering if a UEL header like OFH would be enough sound-wise to keep me happy.

Who is it you guys were referencing?

Our resident major malcontent ;)

Holy hell.. I'm supposed to know who that is?

I'm guessing Whitigr. I don't read his posts often so I wouldn't know. I just know he doesn't drive a twin but he tries to offer everyone his opinion of it.

Whitigir

Ok that's what I thought. You caught me before my edit. All he does is brag about his ZOMG 450 HP CAR!!! Why the hell is he even here?

http://24.media.tumblr.com/6dd8c1d37...scfko1_500.gif

That Derek Kreindler wrote a shorter version of that bs article on TTAC. I'm so tired of these "lack of power" articles, why these dumb auto journalists never made a big deal out of the "lack of power" with the Miata? BTW Derek Kreindler drives a Miata and he'll never do a bs article on his beloved car.

You have deduced correctly, which means you did indeed know who we were talking about ;).

The "problem" was Toyota putting this vehicle under the Scion brand. 1/2 the people I tell that my car is a "Scion" they don't know what it is..."Huh?...It's a sky-on? skee-on?" Then I tell them it's actually a subsidiary of Toyota and THEN the light goes on. Then some other comments are about how they like my FR-S better than some of those other "weird looking boxy Scion cars".

So, either they've never heard of Scion, or they associate it in the same family as "weird looking" cars.

Should've just released it as the Toyota FT86 here in the States and I bet it would've broke the projected sales targets just like Subaru did.

It's a tuner car. If you want more power, tune the damn car. FA Engine is a Boxer jewel, it has a lot of potential.

The FR-S's are still selling very well despite that.

I also think Toyota wanted to try and salvage the Scion brand, which is why the FR-S got the Scion badge. I speculate that they're hoping the success of the FR-S will help sell the brand better.

And to be fair, Scion seems to be doing okay. I see plenty of tC's and xB's riding around.

Is it me or are a lot of people caught up in this badge thing! just wondering as I see a lot of comments on this.


:cheers:

Sorry but my first impression of the car was that it needed more power. Not much but more. Maybe if the torque dip wasnt there I might feel differently about it. I absolutely love everything else about the car but I can understand why people comment on the lack of power

I don't give a crap about the badge, except for a bit of stock headunit envy as the FR-S gets the better headunit selection. If it's a FT86, I don't care if it carries a Subaru, Toyota, or Scion badge. It's an 86, and it's gorgeous. :thumbup:

I hate to say it but I see these "d*bags" alot with WRX STIs these days, and they won't floor their car until they get right alongside me on the road. They are probably pissed off since I have more STI parts than them on a non-STI badged car.

I can drive the BRZ plenty fast, I just wind it out like how you are supposed to drive older Japanese sport compacts. The BS thing is that if this car came stock with 30 more hp, people will say it should have another 20 more.

But they did test drive the car before that committed to buying it, yes?
I don't understand how some are surprised that it may be underpowered.
Did the dealer siphon off some HP before the customer took delivery of the car! :confused0068:


:cheers:

Absolutely agree! 100%


:cheers:

i dont see the problem..... if you want it to be zippy , headers tune and it should keep up with other car for a little over 1k.

if you want to pass those sedans, stop carrying fattys... there is a reason why we have factory bucket seats. think of it as a go/no go gauge.

if the girl didnt fit... sorry please exit the vehicle.

Those bumper stickers aren't just for show :lol:

(if you don't know which bumper stickers just complete this sentence, "No fat chicks...")

Yup, I see those funky tC's and xB's here and there as well...But they're the "funky", "hip", "not-your-usual-me-too" type of vehicles. The FR-S is a sports car and doesn't belong in that mix. It's like forcing a Jock to be a part of the Artistic crowd.

Even so, I have no doubt that the FR-S did wonders for the Scion brand, if Toyota indeed put the FR-S in that line-up to salvage it then I'd say it was a resounding success. That's how Toyota should be seeing it.

Badging a new vehicle to a lackluster brand (to salvage it), then complaining because it didn't sell as well as projected is the same as trying to have your cake and eat it too.

but at the risk of the warranty and smog nazis here. I would rather it just came with s2000 ish power from the factory. Ya I know thats lame to say but