Experience w/ Catless Headers?
 

Hey guys, thinking about running catless headers - that being said, our state's got some wonderfully tight laws on emissions. I've always been compliant but now that I'm contemplating doing some extra work on this car, what are some ways that I would actually get in trouble or caught for having headers in the first place?

I really appreciate any insight I can get here :thumbsup:

Well, you can argue with the pd all you want but all they need to do is write you up a ticket to have the state ref look at your car for approval. Most stuff needs to be carb legal and if it isn't. Well you know what comes next... Easiest way to upgrade without a hassle would be a tune. Add e85 to the tune and you will have a well running car without the worries of the emission laws.

What exhaust are you going to run with the headers?

I felt the same way. My main concern was getting pulled over for having a loud car. I'm currently running the RevWorks UEL header with the Invidia N1 catback and I don't regret it one bit. My girlfriend and I love the sound but a couple of my buddies say it's too loud.

Living in the east side of san jose I come across cops alot and havent been pulled over yet (knock on wood.) I've had them driving behind me and beside me. They dont seem to mind. As long as you're not being a douche and driving responsibility, I think you should be fine. Good luck!

FT86 Speed Factory is working on a catted header system that I believe is almost ready for release.

Might be a viable option for a "middle ground" if you're looking to at least fill the legal requirements of the cat plus it may aid in a visual inspection.

It's the option I've been eyeing as I would like to stay as close to legal as possible with all the mods on my BRZ but also really want to get rid of that torque dip.

Visual will not pass, unless you know a guy. But its also not a difficult to swap them.

In reality if you dont drive like a **** and keep the muffler and some resonators sound should be ok. Getting something without huge shiny tips to stay more stealth would help too. But really the only ones worried about crap like this when driving normal are CHP.

I am considering the catted headers... I'd probably run with something quiet to give it that growl with the headers. I'm loving the sound of my Nameless Axleback right now though! 2.5" x 5" mufflers...

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Hmm, you don't need to take it to a SMOG station for 6 years so you have that time do to what you want with out taking it in for a SMOG check. IF CHP or someone sends you to the REF then swap it back then.. Figured with the missing CAT you will need to get an O2 simulator, if not then the CEL will be on.

Right, but am I correct in thinking that my OpenFlash Tablet can clear the CEL?

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I'm thinking of running FT-86 Speed Factory catted UEl. (already on the waiting list). with Arc GRiP cat back and see how it goes for volume. if i feel i can go louder i finish out the exhaust with an over pipe and front pipe.

OFT can clear the CEL no problem. they actually have a OFT and OFH combo going that looks pretty promising for power too.

You can clear the problem aka CEL, but your car will always be in relearn mode, therefore fuel trims will be all screwed up and mileage will drop.. You will need to put something in there therefore eliminating the need to reset that thing every time you get to 55mph or higher.

OFT will not just clear the CEL, it will avoid the CEL. If you run the stage 2 tune it takes care of things if you are running a catless header.

I actually have to take a few of my cars in for smog soon... when I am in there I will ask when they think the new OIS system will take over for CA smog... supposedly sometime in mid-2014 I hear. What will happen when that comes into effect, is any cars post 2000 will not require tailpipe emissions check, just hook up computer to OBDII and if no CEL codes, you pass. :w00t:

I've run the FA20club.com EL catted header, it's loud, it flows great, I returned the CBE to stock to reduce the exhaust noise.
Current Setup
EL Catted Header, Perrin Overpipe, Nameless Performance Catted Front Pipe with Helmholtz Resonator, stock exhaust system.
The primary cat is easily replaced with a straight pipe on this header

that will be amazingly car modifying friendly:cheers:

yes, although there is still a visual inspection so if you have headers and it's easy to see/tell that you have no cats, that may still constitute a FAIL... I guess if you are friendly with the smog tech he can "look the other way" or overlook that fact. Or you can get some kind of OEM-looking manifold heat shields to cover them LOL.

Went to smog the tC today and they are still doing the rolling 15 and 25mph tests (it passed of course). I asked when they would adopt the OIS process and he said he wasn't sure, the state was being vague maybe sometime this year. Can't wait since personally the new OIS will help me out on more than one car. ;)

Dude one of these days I have to listen to your Exhaust setup at one of the meets! I'm also on the fence of whether to get a catted UEL or a catless UEL. With this said, I'm probably not going to do headers until I finish suspension and wheels (haven't done that yet lol). It doesn't hurt to start researching early though! :bonk:

Ugh. I am still torn. I have a Nameless Axleback right now, and any louder would be too loud for me personally. I suppose I can go cat less only if I swap to a more quiet system overall? Or I'd have to go with a carted header. Definitely want to add the Nameless catted and resonated FP/OP combo regardless though.


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Got pulled over yesterday in the Berkeley area. Cop was super cool, said he had a '11 STI and understands how loud these cars can get once you open up the exhaust. Didn't even give me a warning, just let me go with a fist bump.

I have the Nameless catted+resonated FP/OP combo and it seems to really help with the drone. The rest of the system consists of a JDL UEL and Milltek non-resonated catback. Overall, the volume is there, but I don't think it's annoyingly loud. The regulars at the usual South Bay meets can probably give better feedback, since I don't usually get to hear my car from the outside. hahah

Sweet, thanks. I do remember hearing your car in person - though I'm more of a pansy when it comes to sound haha! I actually ended up with catted headers, though I think catless will be a consideration in the future :w00t:

If you don't mind me asking, what did he pull you over for in the first place?


Was it exhaust-related or was is coincidental that you guys started talking about exhaust volume?


...just curious.

Just to chime in, I've been looking for a catted option just because of the issues above. Don't want to deal with swapping out headers just because - clearly it's a pain. I rather have a good working header than I can have catted and throw a super charger on it that's carb legal down the line.

Other than that, not much I would want to actually do. If OFT made a catted header, I would jump on that without even thinking, but everyone is making headers without a cat so in california, and without a garage, i'm not going to deal with swaping it in and out when it comes time to smog.

Weight reduction is a big thing, since it's, what 25lbs down to 12/13? That would be an increase on it's own.

I'm running OFT 1.55b Stage 2 EL header with catted header from FA20club.com. P&L, JDL, make catted and uncatted EL headers only requiring one pipe/ piece to be removed /replaced that will work as well. I've gone that route with mine, one vband clamp and two bolts to swap out cat.

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the problem is, in CA any header that doesn't look OEM (and isn't separately CARB certified) will not pass the visual inspection part of the smog check. Even when they get rid of the rolling/emissions part of the test (supposedly later this year) there will still be a visual inspection as part of the check.

one solution to this would be to have some kind of OEM-looking heat shield over the headers so the smog tech wouldn't notice it's aftermarket. I believe the Crawford Performance BRZ has something like this over its header (though judging by the rest of the engine compartment you're not fooling anyone there haha). Another solution would be if you knew a guy, who uhhh, doesn't look that carefully for the visual part... ;)

I learned something new, Thanks. Florida doesn't inspect cars anymore. Tough Laws in your state but California sure has great wine

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It was exhaust related. I have a catless front pipe and a non-resonated cat back. Pretty loud above 3500rpm. It was at night and he heard my car from a few blocks away.

Federal government's view on emissions:
http://www.epa.gov/otaq/about/faq.htm#question13

I doubt anyone here will come across a federal agent that is going to inspect their vehicle for emissions. But, the sound of breaking federal law sounds bad.

IIRC, there have been a few stints in the Bay Area with mobile smog stations in the past few years.

In regards to aftermarket catted headers and catted front pipes if it is not listed below, I believe it is deemed non-compliant in the views of CARB.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermk...ktcatdbase.htm

For aftermarket exhausts, law enforcement officers can say that he/she thinks it exceeds a certain decibel level under CVC (forgot what number code) and issue you a fix-it ticket to the state referee. It costs ~$100 for state referees to run the test and issue a certification that states the exhaust complies to the legal noise level limit. BTW, that certification has an expiration date of a year or so.

If whoever pulling you over believes that your car has altered emissions equipment, he/she can issue you a fix-it ticket to see a state referee to have them run a smog check on your car. It is no fun dealing with state referees. They will do everything by the book; cross every t, and dot every i.

I'm going to run catted UEL, FP, and resonated 2.5" Perrin Catback - the FT86SF headers should allow for the stock splash guard to go back on... hopefully that helps?

You should be fine. I've heard this setup similar to the one you're going to run in person. It was as loud as mine without the rasp and had a bit deeper note. Good choice on Speed Factory headers, great piece.