Thoughts on a 7 speed manual?
 

Que?

I have yet to try one, though there seems to be debate if there should be that extra gear.

too many gears

Depends on the car... it might actually be fun on a car like the s2000 or rx8.

On the Vette though, totally pointless. That car needs maybe 4 gears, that would actually be more then than having 7 with half of them locked out....

Kind of like having 700HP. You cannot use it 99% of the time so who really needs it? 7 speeds and 700HP (or 500HP) just looks good in the sales brochure and sounds good when you are bragging at the local car meet.

I don't see the problem. I wish my Cayman had a 7th gear. Keep the 6 it has right now (pretty close ratio, good for high-performance driving), and add a ridiculous overdrive 7th for highway cruising and good gas mileage. Right now, I'm at ~3krpm at 75mph in 6th, and I know the car could pull a taller ratio.

Except the gearbox affects the driving experience and fuel efficiency in daily driving...the Vette's 6 speed gearbox had extremely wide gear spacing; while it can spin tires in the first 3 and while it has a very early torque peak, since it's such a big engine a little bit less rpm can be a lot less fuel in absolute terms (maybe not % though) around the city.

Yes you "don't need" 7 gears, heck you don't even need 5, they might as well ditch gear 4 in the C56 because I don't really use it. But even with your C60 and 2ZZ, are you really perfectly happy? On the freeway with the C60 you're at 3300rpm doing 70 when modern autoboxes are spinning 1.8L engines at 2300. From a performance standpoint as well, a shorter 1st and closer spacing in gears 1-4 would be better imo. I haven't driven a 6 speed but the 2nd gear is only shortened by 5%. Imagine a 7 speed with 4.3 final drive, and ratios 3.4/2.23/1.6/1.25/1.0/0.85/0.67(this could be lower) ish. You'd have a tad under 2600rpm @ 60mph, similar high speed performance to the C64 but slightly more kick in gears 1-3. A 7-1 downshift at 35mph would be so much fun with a 2ZZ.

I feel like any performance car could use 7 (or more) gears. Econobox 4-cylinder engines would be fine with 6. Isn't rowing gears most of the fun?

No kidding. The AP1 definitely needed a 7th gear. I would be on a road trip at 70mph in 6th gear and the engine is a 4k rpms and that wasn't cool.

Not sure how it'd work in terms of shift pattern. I think it'd be confusing to do a HHH and try to do something similar to reverse lockout.

Maybe a Maltese Cross type shift pattern, where 3rd and 4th both both get split, such that you'd do left then forward and back for 1st and 2nd, forward then left and right for 3rd and 4th, right then forward and back for 5th and 6th, and back then left and right for 7th and reverse.

7 is the new 5 spd brah! 8 is the new 6...

lol

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I wish there was extra gear. Make the 6th little more shorter and make 7 for cruise gear..

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBAiYRb91vg"]Shifting the 7-speed manual in Porsche's new 2013 911 Carrera - YouTube[/ame]



Personally I don't know what to do with the 5th gear in the Toyobaru, cruising at 40-55, just use 6th, want some adjustability or torque use 4th. Need to downshift to pass on the freeway: straight to 4th. The only time I'd use fifth as more than an intermediate gear would be on the track. I honestly wouldn't have been too disappointed with a 5 speed in this car. Instead of a 7 speed I'd say just make fifth and six a little taller for the Toyobaru, hell just make 6th taller so 5th feels useful.

It's really only useful if you want a magazine to post up good times around a track while still cruising on the freeway <2,500 rpm at 75 mph.

We already have a @7thgear

Adding gears is not necessarily a good thing for performance. Shifting takes time with a manual. Now maybe with dual clutch paddle shifters it would not be a detriment but if you have to row it yourself then going through 7 gears is going to cost time. There is a reason most race cars only have a 5 speeds or sometimes even less. You only use those five and anymore than that is simply more weight and rotating mass.

Yes, I am satisfied with the 6 speed in the C60. With a 4.53 FD it is still geared low enough in sixth that it will pull without downshifting on the highway, the rpm is low enough that it is not deafening at highway speeds and I get 38.3MPG in a car that will run low 14sec 1/4 mile and corner like a go-kart. I cannot see where a 7th gear would improve much of anything. When you only have 1.8L to work with less weight trumps almost everything performance wise.

Shifting takes time true, but most race cars having 5 gears? 6 performance gears seems like the standard to me, at least for road going performance cars it has been for the last 15 years (Porsche, NSX, F20/K20, Lotus C64, the Italians, etc.). My argument is that since it seems like no one outside of F1 is bothering with more than 6 performance gears, why not keep the 6 (which by consensus people seem to think is a good number) and add a 7th for the highway, which many cars desperately could use. You wouldn't be rowing through 7 to go fast, you'd be rowing through approximately the same number of gears as before but in some circumstances you'd have an extra shift or a skip shift if you're accelerating quickly on public roads. Think C64 with an extra gear, you'd use the same gears as before except you'd go to 7th instead of 6th for cruising most of the time. 6th wouldn't be useless as it has decent passing power on the highway since it'd be shorter than my current 5th. To speed up a little you would downshift to 6th instead of mashing the throttle in 7, to pass you'd skip down but now you have the choice of 2, 3, 4 or 5

Of course, when you throw in hybrid/forced induction then the story changes. Large engines would still benefit from a 7th but the smaller engines could be fine with 6 since the BMEP to FMEP ratio is smaller.

You could probably get better gas mileage and make cruising quieter with a 7th gear. However, using my Spyder as an example, it would not pull the mountains in West Virginia without downshifting. It will pull them with the 6 speed.

My opinion is that the 7th and 8th gear are more marketing hype than real world beneficial. They add weight. They add complexity. I like minimalist cars. Therefore, I own a MR-S and convinced my son to buy a FR-S. 6 forward gears is perfect for lightweight sports cars like these.

If someone gave me a 7 speed gearbox that would fit in my Spyder for free I would not make the effort to pull the 6 speed and put in the 7. But then I like simple so maybe I am simple! :bonk: :D

tbh i really want a 7th gear for Highway cruising and a better 6th haha
could make it like how our reverse needs to be lifted but to the upper right :P
that way no misshifts going to 7 instead of 5 haha

I saw that either Hyundai, Volkswagen, or maybe Nissan is adding a 9th gear to one of their cars. Most likely automatic though.

Soon all those Fast and Furious memes that make fun of the amount shifts will become a reality.

I'll be granny shifting into 12th gear in 20 years.

7 is ok depending on what car. The Lexus ISF is 8 speed automatic, which I still think is crazy and awesome at the same time. My hand would be sore from shifting 7 all the time though.

I have never owned a six speed manny tranny so I really can't speak for how a 7th gear with the extra row would feel like.

But I agree with other peeps in the sense that the 7th gear is really for highway cruising.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I actually prefer the Automatic in the twins because the 6th is a taller gear for highway use. I'd definitely be for a 7th in the manual that was about the same as the auto 6th.

I didn't think you got much past 4th on a track anyway, and because it's an overdrive you might not even have the power to go faster in 6th than you could in fifth, so by the time you're at 6 and 7 it's only for low rpm cruising in my mind.