Front lower control arms, which set would you want?
 

A couple of weeks ago we posted a few pics on our instagram account of a prototype front lower control arm that we are considering offering in addition to the front lower control arms we already have. We have had our full race version control arms on the market for almost a year now, but we would like to offer an alternative for the guys that don't want to go all out.

The two options we are looking at are a non adjustable replacement that would use urethane inserts. The other set would use adjustable rod ends, but not as extreme as our race version. Both sets of control arms about 1 pound lighter than the OEM control arm, and are both 4130 chromoly.

Please provide your thoughts and opinions, and lets see what we can do to offer an affordable set of front lower control arms that will be of interest to the community.

A few pics for reference: (the black coated arms are the front lower control arms we already sell)

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/c...ps8877eddc.jpg

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/c...pscdacdd02.jpg

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/c...psb287ff55.jpg

Could you please tell me/us what the practical differences are between the two versions of adjustable arms?

Also price difference.

& how much camber to expect

I'd say adjustable with urethane bushings(yes that is correct).

As well as caster

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Main difference between the arms we currently offer and the adjustable arms we might offer are weight, and being able to adjust the arms on the vehicle. The cost is higher for the arms we currently offer due to the amount of hardware that we have to purchase, and time to build.

6 to 8 degrees of camber, which would be more than needed in most cases. We already offer urethane bushings, with the arms we currently offer. For the arms above it would be one or the other.

Non adjustable arms range: $475 to $495

Adjustable arms: $529 to $559

The adjustable arms have caster movement.

Adjustable

i will take adjustables...

C. Adjustable with urethane bushings

to be honest i didnt order the originals cause i think they look like shit. i mean they are function i get it, but if i am gonna spend money on a part i dont want it to look bad on the car.
the new adjustable design is spot on. i would order those.

Fair enough. Its important the car looks good for the alignment guy working under it.

if i have a rock crawler at home that has better looking suspension components on it than my car there is a problem.
especially considering how good the robispec arms looked.

You realize that the arms that are on the car now are stamped metal, right? Maybe you didn't because nobody ever sees them. The control arm is there for one purpose only, and it's not to look pretty.

Fair enough. You can do what you like at the end of the day. And I'm not really having a serious dig. More just having a laugh that something that is 100% for functional use, it being judged on cosmetics.

thanks i understand what a control arm is and does.
people do see them, you may not care what they look like but a high end performance part should look like one. welds should look good, material and fit and finish should be top notch.

I just fail to see how the current production piece is that bad. The new design maybe lighter, but it's also weaker.

Edit - If I was going to get LCA's I'd get these. All business.
http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoser.../267373301.jpg

We are keeping our full race design, they work very well. The arms we are asking about would be in addition to the arms we currently offer.

Thanks, for the feedback.

The RacerX parts I have fit those criteria. You appreciate the 2 uncoated arms are mock ups?

wat

I agree they look the business but I don't know if I could justify spending $1000NZ on them. They look nuke proof.

That includes 15% sales tax, which you wouldnt have to pay. So more like $870NZD. Then convert to AUD. Forex isnt that great (for you) at the moment.

You're getting serious quality there though. Racefab builld some crazy shit.

I'll give 6 sheep a piece NZ dollars!

I've been going back and forth on a design for arms on another platform and it's came down to this same issue. Stiffness vs. Adjustability.

On the original racerx arms I assume there is some extra caster built into them, but because of how the hiem joints are set up, you can only tweak caster and track width a small amount and the adjustments are linked together? The brace on them making them an A-frame however increases the stiffness.

On the proposed adjustables, now you have a ton of adjustment capability to caster and track width (independently adjustable too), but stiffness is going to be significantly lower. If everything is welded correctly and proper diameter and wall thickness is used, strength won't be an issue. But strength and stiffness is not the same thing and the question then becomes, how much will the lower stiffness impact handling? There is also a small concern with the forward link potentially reduces tire clearance at steering lock.

I am hypothesizing that providing that they are strong enough they would flex less than the oem rubber bushes.

There is no doubt they will flex less then the OEM bushings. But is that really the benchmark to beat?

You already know the OEM bushings flex too much...

I would imagine the average driver couldn't tell the difference between the two arms though anyway. They likely could feel the difference of a different alignment that would be possible with the adjustables though.

You have summed it up well. The arms we currently make and will continue to make are meant for racing, and provide amazing handling because of the design and stiffness but adjustments do have to made in small increments but will provide the camber and caster needed.

The proposed arms we plan to offer in addition at a more reasonable price, but a draw back to that is a reduction in stiffness. The adjustable arm is similar to other front control arms on the market, and also similar to the front control arms we have used on the MR2 for a few years. They do adjust individually and provide more caster than probably needed.

Do the current arms have some extra caster already built into them and then you can go +/- from there?

Agreed though, this style of arm is popular on several other platforms. E30/E36, 240s, probably most strut based cars that are raced really. I'm just coming from the EVO that has incredibly stiff arms from the factory so it's hard to put something on the car that offers less stiffness then stock. Not such a mental problem on this platform though.

Oh no! I'm quoting myself! Any comments here?

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50390

It's a fair argument and a valid one. Having suspension that are a crush zone makes sense. The problem is for us (the end user) is how much the arms cost.

What about adjustables with urethane bushing? Would that not bring the cost down a little from the rod ends?

Cost is about the same for urethane or rod ends. Which in most cases is why we charge the same for either option. The arms we currently offer have the option for urethane bushings.