Berk Dual Muffler Delete Municipal Code?
 

I live in a condo in SoCal (Burbank/Glendale) and one of my neighbors in the building left a letter complaining about the noise of my car.

I have a Berk dual exit muffler delete and I'm genuinely pretty conscious of the noise of my car around the building. The letter said if my car isn't modified to meet the code, the anonymous neighbor will proceed with his or her tithe against my vehicle.

Is there anything I can do or am I going to have to switch back to my stock muffler?

The municipal code the person referred to is:
9-3-212: SOUND SUPPRESSION ON GASOLINE AND GAS ENGINES:
No person having charge or control of any engine in which gas, gasoline, distillate or other similar substance is used as a motive power, shall run or operate such engine without having the exhaust pipe thereof connected with an underground air chamber or having attached to such exhaust pipe a muffler or other device so constructed as to deaden the sound of the exhaust of such engine and effectually prevent such exhaust from making any loud noise or disturbing the peace and quiet of persons in its vicinity. This section shall apply to the engine of a motor vehicle only if its exhaust equipment is not regulated by State law. [Formerly Numbered Section 21-35; Renumbered by Ord. No. 3058, eff. 2/21/87; 2383.]

Obviously if one of your neighbors has left a letter one of a couple things is going on:

#1: You might not be as conscious of the sound level around your building as you might think.
#2: You've done something to piss a neighbor off and he/she is taking this as a reason to take retribution.
#3: You've got a neighbor that doesn't particularly care for overly loud exhausts. Yes, muffler deletes are overly loud...

Most likely its one of those three options. Personally I don't understand how people run muffler deletes. The car is already pretty loud with headers and a cat back exhausts and I can't imagine how annoyingly loud it would be with no muffler at all. But hey, maybe it's just me and I'm an "old fuddy duddy".

Personally I like to think of it this way. If I had young children/baby, would the loudness of this exhaust wake them up every single time I cranked it up to leave in the morning? If so then you're probably pissing your neighbors off and I'd swap back. You don't want to be "that guy" in the neighborhood. Leave the muffler deletes/test pipes for the track.

As for a recourse, if your neighbor takes it to the next level the only action you will have available is to put the muffler back on or get a fix-it ticket. Not sure how anal the police are about stuff like this where you live, but here you would definitely get a ticket.

I go in neutral into my garage everytime. There's a Ferrari that lives in my building that's a lot louder than my car.

The muffler delete is the only thing I've done to the exhaust. I have that a CAI and a Unichip. So it's not as loud as you might think.

I left several notes about cars regularly parking in my spot (due to laziness and I know it's my parking neighbors that do this) so it might be some vendetta from that?

What constitutes as a sound deadening device? Obviously my muffler, but does having the rest of my exhaust stock count for anything?


I'm thinking of leaving a note in the common area saying it's stock exhaust, I'll try to be quieter, thank the person for leaving a note and that ill be more conscious of the noise hoping that works.

In California, I heard they are the strictest state against modified exhausts because of the emission regulation. If I were you, drive even "quieter" or sell me your exhaust. Thank you.

Unfortunatly, it doesn't matter, nor do the police care if another car is louder than yours. If they get a complaint about you specifically then that is what they will investigate. If they find you in violation then they may or may not take action.

I've heard 86's with muffler deletes, yes they are as loud as I think they are. Its possible you are just used to the sound. Remember that your neighbors can hear you quite a ways away from where your building is. You might be putting it in neutral and coasting into your garage, but if you are gagging it the first corner after your neighborhood then it sounds just like you are next to the building (especially on cold mornings/nights).

Maybe it is someone with a vendetta, but unfortunately it won't matter because you can't prove it and its not like it matters anyway. If the law says you have to have a muffler and you don't, you are in the wrong.

A sound deadening device is just that, a sound deadening device. What do you think a judge would think a sound deadening device is. I'll give you a hint, its called a muffler. ;) If you got a ticket for that most likely the judge isn't going to care if the rest of your exhaust is there. Then again if its just a local ordinance then they definitely won't care, you'll just have to pay up.

Leaving a note might work, or it might backfire because someone obviously knows you don't have a muffler and its not stock. Lying about it won't do you any favors if they do take further action. My suggestion is to put your muffler back on or get a catback exhaust that isn't excessively loud and maybe your neighbors will leave you alone. Keep the muffler delete for the track and put it on for those events. In the end, you knew it was for off road use only and chose to install it anyway. You are going to do what you want to do but I can tell you that living around a bunch of people that are pissed with you isn't fun.

OR, you could ignore it as it could be someone that won't follow through with calling the cops. My guess is that is not the case in this situation because if they have researched the actual section that you are in violation of, they probably have already called them and its only a matter of time before you've got bigger issues than just a note being left on your car.

Hm thanks for your input.
Before I switch back I think ill head down to the police station and ask if my muffler delete is okay. Apparently my local police station is actually pretty nice about car modding questions and applauds that behavior.

Good luck! And I'm sure you know this, but I'd be EXTREMELY careful pulling into the station. The last thing you want to do is tell on yourself with a loud ass exhaust and walk away with a ticket when trying to do the right thing. They are probably going to tell you to put the muffler back on, but who knows.

Either way, you are probably best to extend the distance away from your building where you are taking it easy. ;)

Muffler are part of the exhaust system to regulate the emission and sound. If you don't have those, then you are agains the law.

I think that you pulling up to the police station is a bit stupid.. don't get me wrong.. but you know you are againts the law and then go ask the cops if it's ok..

If you ask yourself if it is legal... then it's probably not...

I wasn't planning on driving up for those obvious reasons. I live walking distance from the station so I'd walk in as someone interested in buying the part. Some people at my old school got their mods pre approved by someone working in the station in writing before actually purchasing anything so they're used to it.

California's exhaust laws state that it is illegal to modify your exhaust to make it louder. So, yeah, you are illegal there isn't anything to question about it.

The law your neighbor quoted is about things like generators and not cars.
The car laws are here:
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/di...le=27150-27159

And
So either make up with your neighbor or put your stock exhaust back on because you are going to be ticketed.

Berk Dual Muffler Delete Municipal Code?
 

Hm interesting. Is there any exhaust that's technically legal then?
In California*

Only the ones that are SAE tested to be 95db or less. AFAIK only Tanabe medalion systems are rated this way:
http://www.tanabe-usa.com/touringmedalion.asp?id=7

How annoying. I need to move haha.

The cops are technically supposed to have a dB meter to measure anything they think may be above 95 dB.

Modifying an exhaust after the catalytic converter is not illegal as long as it isn't above 95 dB. That is state regulation. It outweighs any municipal code.

If you feel the need to, contact the SEMA action network. www.semasan.org They represent the interest of motor vehicle enthusiasts at the state and national level. They may be able to tell you how to proceed.


Sent from my iPhone

Agh thanks for this. This was what I was hoping to see.

This is mostly true. While I can not speak for california state law since I don't live there, municipalities are allowed to enact local ordinances that are more strict than state or federal laws. These are city codes and while you may not have to appear before court when ticketed with them, the fine is still a very real possibility regardless of what state or federal law requires if your city has such an ordinance.

this ^^

As a follow up, cities are allowed to enact local ordinances to restrict loud and annoying sounds as they so choose. Just out of curiosity I looked up my town's ordinance and it limits sound from automobiles to 60db with an exemption to public right of ways. Meaning as long as its on the road you are exempt from that requirement.... but wait theres more.

If two parties complain that shall constitute a violation of the ordinance regardless of where the violation occured. It also specifically states that all vehicle exhausts must discharge through a muffler. The ordinance provides for civil fines of $100 per day up to 5 days. After 5 days the fine goes up to $500 per day. There is also criminal penalties involved that constitute a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment not to exceed 30 days or by fine not to exceed $50.

Keep in mind this is only applicable to my town and your town's local ordinances might be (probably are) different.

So yeah, if you think that just because the state has different requirements or allows certain sound levels means you don't have to follow local ordinances, you might be in for a rude awakening.

Just for extra fun, my town also has an ordinance against rapid acceleration that is defined by "It shall be unlawful to operate or accelerate a motor vehicle in such a manner as to cause squealing or spinning of tires or to propel sand, dirt, gravel or rocks by the tires."

Fun times.

Just a heads up on this, I was driving to work one day in my corolla that just has a pretty quiet aftermarket muffler. I got pulled over and the cop gave me a ticket. I asked for a db test because it is really that quiet..

He told me it was modified so he can give me a ticket.
At the end of the day I learned that regardless they can give you a ticket and it's something you dont want to deal with. No matter how nice the cop is, they'll ticket you.

Your delete is far louder than my car, if I was you I'd rather replace the muffler than have a cop come by to give your car a full once over and pick up more than the just the noise!

GL

Drive it harder/louder, in defiance.

too bad too sad..
i have a berk dual delete... and i know it make noise...
i enjoy it, but i try as much to take care of my surroundings

but once someone target you... what can you do.. i mean.. it's not like you didn't step on their grass... you have a nice noisy exhaust,.... who isn't nice to others...

if something like that happened to me... it would just become a track day exhaust, as i dont feel like my own self pleasure outweight other's disturbance!

So he is going to tell on you? What a joke. I would continue to give less of a shit and continue doing what you want. Still respect the noise level and keep it down but I would ignore your neighbor. People like that need to learn how to communicate better, not leave a note.

If you can, try to get a picture of him using his phone while driving, then leave a note. Moo ha ha ha

Before you know it, we won't be able to take a sip from our water bottle while driving...


I just got my berk single exit track pipe soooooo I am excited to hear the loudness - suck it California

Just out of curiosity, how old are you? Do you think you will feel the same way in 10 years when you have kids if you don't currently have them? If not, maybe you should rethink how you interact with other people, because I promise that one day you'll reach a point where the things you thought were cool suddenly become less cool. If you've driven around and not given a single thought to everyone else around then you won't have a leg to stand on when that stuff starts to bother you.

Okay, did my research and based off this CHP Bulletin: http://www.bobsmuffler.com/chp.htm

(To put it simply)
An officer can't give me a citation unless he/she personally hears the car running. He/she also can't cite me on purely visual inspection of not having a muffler since the definition of muffler isn't stated. A muffler can be integrated into a straight pipe with baffles and technically count as a muffler.
If an officer does hear/see my muffler delete, I get a fix-it ticket.

The exhaust has to be 95 db or quieter from 20 inches away from one exhaust exit. After looking through Dsport's BRZ/FRS exhaust tests including the sound levels vs stock,
my muffler delete is most likely not under 95 db.

Also, city municipal laws regarding sound are invalid. If I get a citation, the CHP bulletin says that the citation is invalid since the sound law is state wide and cannot be affected by city placed regulations.

Here's the sound chart for the Berk single exit. I have a dual exit but it should be around the same.

http://dsportmag.com/showcase/scion-...b_berk-non.jpg



Also, there are exhaust silencers or baffles that dampen/quiet exhaust noise and can be put into the exhaust exits. A cop in one forum said that it's common to see people in Cali just place a baffler in each tip right before being tested since it's completely legal to do so. The law states that it only has to be under 95 db at the time of testing.

http://i.ebayimg.com/t/INSERT-REMOVA...9SmjK9/$_3.JPG
http://d3d71ba2asa5oz.cloudfront.net...-sr78135-3.jpg



So what I'm going to do is just be even more conscious coming in and out. Barely enough gas to go out, continue rolling in neutral to come in. The likelihood of the person getting a cop to intercept me in the garage is pretty slim since I go in/out during the middle of the day.

I might get two baffles and put it in my exhaust exits after I park, just so whoever is out to get me sees that there's been some change. Also, incase the person brings an officer down to attempt a visual inspection he/she has something to look at lol. I need to start going to the HOA meetings also lol.

Someone in my city got dinged for something similar and he collected a list of ~300 cars around the area with the same modification and brought to the board saying they have to cite everyone and not just him. My city ended up just dropping his citation lol.

Nice find! Thanks man.

Thanks for the lesson teach :thumbsup: but I am already 10 steps ahead of you. No but seriously, you may have overlooked some of the obnoxiousness in my reply. I am not being 100% serious - I was giving somewhat of an exaggerated response. I am completely conscientious of how I treat others as well as how I drive. Being considerate of others and showing respect is very important to me, however, being a buzz-kill is not. From what I can tell, the OP-er is not habitually trying to be inconsiderate nor is he trying to make a fuss, yet his neighbor is (at least in the way he is choosing to "deal" with it - buzz kill). His neighbor sort of comes off as passive aggressive which I think is not the best way to handle it. Lastly, I love California but you can take the "suck it California" seriously - moouahahaha


I get your point, and I can't disagree - I would just handle it differently if I were his neighbor is all. Hope that makes sense - cheers.:cheers:

Thanks. I try to be as considerate as I can be. I mainly got the muffler delete because it's the cheapest option to hear my car. Coming from an '02 miata, I was used to hearing my car loudly in cabin. So the muffler delete seemed right for me.
Odd thing is, there's a Ferrari parked one level higher and when he keeps his car idling I can hear/feel it 3 stories up in my bedroom. I wish my neighbor would confront me in a respectful way and maybe we could work out our differences.

But I just had my friend sit in my patio and listen to me coming out of the garage as quietly as I could. He said he didn't hear me until he could see my car a little ways down the street and even then it was quiet. So it looks like I found a nice way to leave.

I hope that continues to work for you without any problems or retaliation of some sort. I completely understand your reasoning for getting it too - I got my single exit for a similar reason, so I can hear the engine kickin ass lol. Plus the post you provided regarding the single exit exhaust's dB level basically refutes that original note left by your neighbor - game on!

Get a Dashcam, then you can maybe see who left you the note.

I was thinking of this too. Do you have one you recommend?

I wired this one to my wife's car because she parks in our parking lot at night. It works perfect.

Blackvue DR500 Vehicle Drive Recorder with Power Magic Pro Power Adapter, Car Black Box / Dashcam (32 GB, Black (Full HD))
http://amzn.com/B00ECCIZCM

Thanks! Ill most likely get it around Christmas.