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Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/index.php)
-   Software Tuning (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=88)
-   -   ECUFlash - Getting close! (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47322)

xjohnx 09-21-2013 11:09 AM
ECUFlash - Getting close!
 
Looks like the guys at romraider are making some progress.

Tactrix + ECUFlash probably not far away!

http://www.romraider.com/forum/viewt...8475&start=105

jamesm 09-21-2013 01:47 PM
Awesome!

xwd 09-21-2013 09:10 PM
I saw they are looking for map definitions. Is it possible for them to use or convert the TunerPro XDF files OpenFlash includes with their base tunes?

ft_sjo 09-22-2013 01:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwx (Post 1226796)
I saw they are looking for map definitions. Is it possible for them to use or convert the TunerPro XDF files OpenFlash includes with their base tunes?
Most likely yes.

wparsons 09-22-2013 09:08 AM
Does this redo the ECU encryption like EcuTek does, or just works with the OEM encryption to flash new ROM's?

xjohnx 09-22-2013 09:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wparsons (Post 1227281)
Does this redo the ECU encryption like EcuTek does, or just works with the OEM encryption to flash new ROM's?
Don't think they've ever used any proprietary encryption in the past, not sure why they would start now.

oh, and looks like they were closer than i thought:
http://i.imgur.com/CUp4LRh.png

EAGLE5 09-22-2013 09:50 AM
I donated to support their effort. You should too!

xjohnx 09-22-2013 10:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsimon7777 (Post 1227311)
I donated to support their effort. You should too!
What he said

wparsons 09-22-2013 04:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1227302)
Don't think they've ever used any proprietary encryption in the past, not sure why they would start now.
So with this we would be able to flash back to stock and the dealership would never know it was flashed (other than possibly the flash counter?)?

Sounds pretty promising from the thread on RomRaider!

MikeyBRZ 09-22-2013 06:14 PM
now we are speaking my language. I have used romraider/ecu flash for years on wrx's/sti's.

Fantastic piece's of software.


Even if you just need to fix a few tables like the tip-in fixes,cl loop to op loop transition, and of course if you for some reason your missing your cats you can fix the threshold :)

mike

SkullWorks 09-23-2013 12:26 PM
Did any one see the BRZedit thread pop up this morning, supporting OpenTablet's binary maps and user tunability with a lower price point.

Turns shit into a scramble fast when open source hits the market.

Glad to see this finally working on our platform.

Is it only the Beta version that will interface the BRZ or will the release candidate 2 out currently work? Guess i need to dust off the OP2.0 again.

EAGLE5 09-23-2013 12:35 PM
It looks like support is not really there yet, but quickly developing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullWorks (Post 1228909)
Did any one see the BRZedit thread pop up this morning, supporting OpenTablet's binary maps and user tunability with a lower price point.

Turns shit into a scramble fast when open source hits the market.

Glad to see this finally working on our platform.

Is it only the Beta version that will interface the BRZ or will the release candidate 2 out currently work? Guess i need to dust off the OP2.0 again.

SkullWorks 09-23-2013 12:46 PM
clearly, hence the question.

King Tut 09-23-2013 12:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullWorks (Post 1228909)
Did any one see the BRZedit thread pop up this morning, supporting OpenTablet's binary maps and user tunability with a lower price point.

Turns shit into a scramble fast when open source hits the market.

Glad to see this finally working on our platform.

Is it only the Beta version that will interface the BRZ or will the release candidate 2 out currently work? Guess i need to dust off the OP2.0 again.
Saw it as well. I am very interested in ECUFlash working on the BRZ, and I am willing to do some things to help.

Skyllz 09-23-2013 12:47 PM
I'm sitting back and enjoying the show for now, users are going to be the winners here with more solutions out there :)

Sportsguy83 09-23-2013 12:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Tut (Post 1228953)
Saw it as well. I am very interested in ECUFlash working on the BRZ, and I am willing to do anything to help.
anything.... ANYTHING???

King Tut 09-23-2013 12:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportsguy83 (Post 1228956)
anything.... ANYTHING???
I knew that was coming.

EAGLE5 09-23-2013 01:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportsguy83 (Post 1228956)
anything.... ANYTHING???
Yeah, Meatloaf.

King Tut 09-23-2013 01:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsimon7777 (Post 1229031)
Yeah, Meatloaf.
But I won't do that.

EAGLE5 09-23-2013 01:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Tut (Post 1229064)
But I won't do that.
Except for in a public restroom?

wparsons 09-23-2013 01:59 PM
Is there any options for people already tuned by EcuTek to use ECUFlash (short of getting a new ECU)? From what I know, EcuTek locks it so nothing else can flash to it?

xjohnx 09-23-2013 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wparsons (Post 1229091)
Is there any options for people already tuned by EcuTek to use ECUFlash (short of getting a new ECU)? From what I know, EcuTek locks it so nothing else can flash to it?
Pretty sure there are ecutek users with the OFT, no? And i'm almost positive i've seen ECUtek and BRZEdit users. If so, i don't see why this wouldn't work. @mad_sb may be able to chime in.

mad_sb 09-23-2013 02:10 PM
I believe the Ecutek'd ecu is write locked. You could read out the file then follow whatever the process is to go back to stock with ecutek. If you have an ecutek cable i assume they can give you directions, if not I assume your tuner should be able to do it. After that you should be able to flash the ecu.

If not, there are going to a shit load of people pissed off at EcuTek.

xjohnx 09-23-2013 02:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wparsons (Post 1229091)
Is there any options for people already tuned by EcuTek to use ECUFlash (short of getting a new ECU)? From what I know, EcuTek locks it so nothing else can flash to it?
just found this post from delicious that states it's not locked:

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeliciousTuning (Post 1213294)
When the BRZ/FRS ECU is reflashed it is NOT locked as you have shown us with OpenFlash Tablet. In fact you can pull the map right off and review it, with no problem. The ONLY systems that are truly locked with EcuTeK are the 02-05 Subaru WRX.

When the BRZ/FRS ECU is reflashed back to stock. It is as stock as it is going to be with the EcuTeK License built into the ECU ROM. You can even reflash it with other systems and this goes for all makes and models EcuTeK offers their tuning system for.

Shiv@Openflash 09-23-2013 02:56 PM
I wrote my ecu with an ecutek rom I pulled off a customer car. After writing it to my ecu, I could not write over it using the OFT. I couldn't even write over it using some of Rombinhood's development tools I had access to. This is due to their write protection. The only way to recover my ecu was to borrow the ecutek cable that belonged to the customer who orginally had that ecutek flash license and flash it back to stock using ecutek's stock rom file. After that I was able to do restore my flash back to stock or OFT tune status.

This is why we recommend that all ecutek users flash their ecu back to stock (with ecutek cable) before installing the OFT. Not doing so can introduce an ecutek-induced nightmare. I ended up purchasing another ecu mistakenly as I thought that the ecutek cable wouldn't work in my car due to VIN mismatch. Luckily this was not the case and I now have an extra ecu :)

vgi 09-23-2013 03:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu (Post 1229243)
I wrote my ecu with an ecutek rom I pulled off a customer car. After writing it to my ecu, I could not write over it using the OFT. I couldn't even write over it using some of Rombinhood's development tools I had access to. This is due to their write protection. The only way to recover my ecu was to borrow the ecutek cable that belonged to the customer who orginally had that ecutek flash license and flash it back to stock using ecutek's stock rom file. After what I was able to do restore my flash back to stock or OFT tune status.

This is why we recommend that all ecutek users flash their ecu back to stock (with ecutek cable) before installing the OFT. Not doing so can introduce an ecutek-induced nightmare. I ended up purchasing another ecu mistakenly as I thought that the ecutek cable wouldn't work in my car due to VIN mismatch. Luckily this was not the case and I now have an extra ecu :)
interesting. so EcuTech users can make a full image of their ECU using OFT and then clone it to other cars. I recon they would need to watch out for any ECU hardware differences though. Curious if we may see soon EcuTech license key generators :D

Shiv@Openflash 09-23-2013 04:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vgi (Post 1229347)
interesting. so EcuTech users can make a full image of their ECU using OFT and then clone it to other cars. I recon they would need to watch out for any ECU hardware differences though. Curious if we may see soon EcuTech license key generators :D
I don't know how much value there is in ecutek licenses at this point but I suppose anything is possible. That said, I was only able to read out a few ecutek roms with the OFT. Some of them were locked from being read. Or perhaps it required different reading protocol. I did not care enough to look any further.

vgi 09-23-2013 04:41 PM
I don't know. Why do people crack photoshop when there is a gimp

xjohnx 09-23-2013 04:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vgi (Post 1229432)
I don't know. Why do people crack photoshop when there is a gimp
because gimp's interface terribly clunky. However, comparing ecutek license keys or cloned ecutek roms to OFT/BRZEdit/romraider/ecuflash is not really comparing two like things.

photoshop and gimp both have the capability of editing photos.

but with a cloned/pirated ECUtek rom flashed on your ECU (or a fake license key), unless you've got a vendor's license and software then you're still not able to edit the map you pirated. it would be read only without those tools.

whereas when using OFT/BRZEdit/romraider/ecuflash the end user could edit their tunes at their leisure.

vgi 09-23-2013 05:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1229444)
because gimp's interface terribly clunky
yep, i would guess number of folks would rather use familiar ecutech interface and features they know how to access.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1229444)
photoshop and gimp both have the capability of editing photos.
yep, so does ecutech and OFT/BRZEdit/romraider/ecuflash
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1229444)
but with ... pirated ECUtek [using fake license key], unless you've got a vendor's license and software then you're still not able to edit the map you pirated. it would be read only without those tools.
it's like saying that if you have a pirated photoshop license key and software installation binary or disk then once you install and register this photoshop with pirated key you will only be able to see the images but not modify or save them.
the clones would only be used for figuring out the licensing algorithm/handshake between the tune and software using authentic cable.
as for modifying cloned ecu, if you're interested, using the original cable - you should ask shiv if it's doable, i would guess yes since he was able to flash back to stock tune.

but again, these are just my speculations and you might be right :iono:

neither do I care. when I decide on what to get - I will just pay the money to support the solution I like.
imo, OFT shouldn't have tried reading and deciphering EcuTech tunes. This is IP of other people and that's how they make money. Now though it's been compromised. Now that BrzEdit allows reading and flashing free tunes from OFT it also may hurt sales of OFT. It's a war out there.

Shiv@Openflash 09-23-2013 05:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vgi (Post 1229511)
yep, i would guess number of folks would rather use familiar ecutech interface and features they know how to access.

yep, so does ecutech and OFT/BRZEdit/romraider/ecuflash

it's like saying that if you have a pirated photoshop license key and software installation binary or disk then once you install and register this photoshop with pirated key you will only be able to see the images but not modify or save them.
the clones would only be used for figuring out the licensing algorithm/handshake between the tune and software using authentic cable.
as for modifying cloned ecu, if you're interested, using the original cable - you should ask shiv if it's doable, i would guess yes since he was able to flash back to stock tune.

but again, these are just my speculations and you might be right :iono:

neither do I care. when I decide on what to get - I will just pay the money to support the solution I like.
imo, OFT shouldn't have tried reading and deciphering EcuTech tunes. This is IP of other people and that's how they make money. Now though it's been compromised. Now that BrzEdit allows reading and flashing free tunes from OFT it also may hurt sales of OFT. It's a war out there.
There is no "deciphering" of ecutek tunes. They use the same map addresses as the stock tune. And we read an ecutek rom using the standard read protocol used to read stock roms. We won't even bother trying to crack the ecutek security because, IMHO, it's not necessary or even worth doing given other (better) options.

stugray 09-23-2013 05:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu (Post 1229522)
We won't even bother trying to crack the ecutek security because, IMHO, it's not necessary or even worth doing.
In fact beacuse of the STUPID DMCA law it would even be illegal.
The DMCA makes even attempting to reverse engineer ANY encryption illegal. That is why it is even illegal to make a pdf or *.doc viewer without permission from the original vendor since the compressed nature of those files are considered "encryption".

If I made a hammer with encryption on it, it would be illegal to reverse engineer the hammer. That is how stupid the DMCA is.

wparsons 09-23-2013 09:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1229142)
just found this post from delicious that states it's not locked:
Awesome, thanks!

xjohnx 09-25-2013 05:11 PM
oh man. shit just got real.

Quote:
Here is a full ROM for ZA1JA00C to get you started. I'll be posing up a beta for and EcuFlash version that does the "OEM style" 0x8000-0x13FEFF reads and writes in the next day or so, just to get you started while I work on finishing up a kernel based reflash which will be quicker and more flexible, along with being able to read out the full ROM. Since there is no longer a kernel loader in the stock ROM, I will be adding a patch to allow for this. I'm also working on another patch to add fast and complete logging capability.
just part of the latest update on romraider...

Sonolin 09-25-2013 06:50 PM
Nice! Very excited to see where this goes.

bfrank1972 09-27-2013 03:52 PM
Very cool stuff! So correct me if I'm wrong, the only expendature is a $170 tactrix cable?

xjohnx 09-27-2013 04:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfrank1972 (Post 1238060)
Very cool stuff! So correct me if I'm wrong, the only expendature is a $170 tactrix cable?
assuming you know how to tune yourself, then yes.

bfrank1972 09-27-2013 04:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjohnx (Post 1238079)
assuming you know how to tune yourself, then yes.
I don't, though I'd love to learn how to. I'm assuming as Romraider/EcuFlash make their way to the BRZ/FR-S market people will adopt, tune, and maps will be available.

robot 09-28-2013 12:40 AM
Tactrix cable and ideally a wideband O2 gauge (iirc innovate's can log alongside the romraider stuff).

Also a k-line obd ii cable could be used as a Tactrix cable (ver 1). Not sure if a generic k-line cable will work with the new can bus ecu we have.

Edit:

http://www.tactrix.com/index.php?pag...mart&Itemid=53

Yep innovate's wideband plugs right in.

Im really interested in how the DI tables look. After seeing how much is addressable it should be interesting. Looks like you can squirt whenever and wherever you want. That's a lot to explore.

xjohnx 09-28-2013 12:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot (Post 1238889)
Tactrix cable and ideally a wideband O2 gauge (iirc innovate's can log alongside the romraider stuff).

Also a k-line obd ii cable could be used as a Tactrix cable (ver 1). Not sure if a generic k-line cable will work with the new can bus ecu we have.

Edit:

http://www.tactrix.com/index.php?pag...mart&Itemid=53

Yep innovate's wideband plugs right in.
ordered one the other day in anticipation of this coming out. Granted, i likely won't be using it on my car right away unless my tuner is ok tuning in it. but i'd be more than happy to help out some locals if they want to be one of the firsts to try.


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