FR-S vs BMW 135i
 

I posted this in the introduction thread, and I figured this was a place to do a decent comparison between my previous vehicle and my new! Enjoy:


My previous car was a heavily modded BMW 135i, with the N54 motor, a methanol injection, catless downpipes, full exhaust, tune, etc. Basically full bolt-ons. For anyone not familiar with the car, the 135i is one of the smaller cars in the BMW line-up, part of the lesser-known 1 series. For me, the car was perfect, love at first sight when one of my customers traded it in a little over a year and a half ago.

The N54 is a twin-turbo inline 6, comes stock with 300HP at crank, and is an absolute delight to drive, especially in a platform that only weighs ~3200 lbs. By the time I was finished modding, mine had over 420WHP, and was an 11 second car in the 1/4. I was, and still am proud of my little 1 series.

Fast forward to this month. The wife and I recently closed on our first home. The commute to and from work will be about triple of what it used to be, and DDing the 135i would probably be a nightmare, being that she gets about 14mpg. She suggested that, in light of our mortgage payment which is much higher than our current apartment's rent, we trim the BMW out of my life. Many fits of rage and sorrow ensue.

Well, after spending the majority of the last week lurking the forums on here, and doing my research into the mods this platform has in progress, I can safely say that I believe I will be in good hands. The 1 series does have one flaw, and that is there isn't an enormous aftermarket scene. There are only a few major competitors, only 3 viable aftermarket turbo developers, etc. This platform, wow. Has progressed further in a year than the N54 has since its inception in 2007. Never seen the like. And it dawned on me. I can probably get the FR-S to where my BMW is now, maybe even further if I let the modding community work abit.

So, here I am now. I had my dealership purchase a lightly used White 2013 Scion FR-S from a neighboring Toyota dealership. The car is 6MT, fully loaded with the touchscreen, premium sound, and only 5000 miles, and I bought it wholesale for only $23k. I save money in car payments, double my MPG, lower insurance, pay less for parts, gain a warranty. But most importantly, the wife is happy... She doesn't know that I now have a NEW project car though! :thumbsup:

Pictures of my BMW follow:

This is how it looks recently:

http://i41.tinypic.com/30nadg5.jpg

Euro Blackline taillights are very nice:

http://i43.tinypic.com/4ifwvp.jpg

Her "grrrr" face:

http://i39.tinypic.com/eqp45e.jpg

All business in the engine bay:

http://i43.tinypic.com/34isnph.jpg

And here is the replacement:

http://1-photos.ebizautos.com/used-2...5190-1-640.jpg

All around, I feel good, especially after driving it. I do miss the power, I do miss being faster than 90% of the modded cars in my town, but after driving the car, I didn't really think so much about killing the next CTS-V I saw, or murdering that M3 from down the street, or shaming that supercharged 5.0 Mustang I've seen in town. I just think... "...Man, I bet I can totally drift this corner at 50 mph." And, for now, thats enough for me.


The drive in the FR-S is much more involved and rewarding, and it makes me smile while doing the most mundane drives. The BMW always egged me on to go to ever more ridiculous speeds, but the FR-S stays fun at street speeds, which is a refreshing change.

Here are a few more pictures, of my car and my friend's modded 135i. He bought the hood from me, and some other parts too:

http://i40.tinypic.com/2guh1lf.jpg


http://i44.tinypic.com/2itgbyx.jpg


http://i43.tinypic.com/2ew358g.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/bzl3p.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/ztisd5.jpg


Interior is actually not bad in the FR-S. It is a little more spartan than the BMW, but I like function, and I especially like the Bluetooth automatically playing my music when I get in, from exactly where I left off last. Pretty nifty.

Another perk is the community here! I love that it's not all about rice and slammed cars and stancing, etc. I've seen some beautiful cleanly modded cars, and I love it.

I do plan on modding the FR-S, probably starting with some Rota RT5s, suspension, and blacked out lights, along with Tom's Taillights. Following that will be some UEL headers for Subie burble, and a quad exhaust for a sexier butt / sound. From there on out, Tune, then down the line, some sort of FI. All in good time though.

All-in-all, while bittersweet, I couldn't be happier with my decision. One of those rare occurences. I just have to pretend that I'm heartbroken, for the wife's sake. :thumbup:


Thanks for having me, and I look forward to spending many hours on here.

Very cool story. Yes, you are deinfintly way down on power based on what you are used to, but from a practicality perspective you will probably double your MPG, while at the same time, have a fun car to drive (in other words, the FR-S is far from being a Prius!).

I love the 1 Series BMW, but after dumping a ton of money into a BMW 10+ years ago I quickly realized that they were not practical for daily driving unless you lease a new one every 3 years that is fully under warranty.

Look forward to seeing your future mods. I came from a more powerful car as well, but I am actually pretty happy with the power in the BRZ. Yes, it could definitely be faster, but 90% of the time the power is more than enough.

Congrats and welcome to the world of the twins. Mod away and enjoy!

Thanks! Yea there was a "BMW Tax" on pretty much all the mods I got, lol. But to be honest, the maintenance on the motor was manageable. Just routine stuff mostly... Expensive stuff though, lol.


I just ordered a set of S-Techs lol. Didn't take me long!

Hello comrade. LOL. I am actually trading in my 2008 135i later this month for a black BRZ. I had a Cobb and some other goodies on it. The reasons are similar. Gas is expensive, I drive more now than I used to, maint fees are looming and my CPO ends next year. I started to think about things like... what happens if my adaptive headlights break out of warranty ($$$$) or automatic rain sensor ($$$$) I sat back and looked at it and I just don't utilize the power and when I do I'm eventually going to get in trouble or there will be an accident.

I've had the 135i for nearly 2 years. IT has been fun but it is time to go. As thill mentioned the car just doesn't seem that practical economically to DD. I only own the 135i and hate having a garage queen (tried it with the miata.) The BRZ seems more aligned to my goals right now.

My most immediate past cars were:

92 miata
94 240sx coupe
97 impreza wagon

So the BRZ is a good fit. 1addicts may think we're crazy but I think we just know whats up! Now back to counting the days until my BRZ arrives from Gunma.

Yep, sold our 135i and I'm likely picking up a BRZ soon too. I never warmed to that car, it was fast, solid and reliable (aside from HPFP issues), but not very engaging. The BRZ feels much more like my M Coupe, which is much more fun than the 1er, even if not as tunable.

wow interesting... a friend of mine just bought a 135i and we're constantly on edge about whose car trumps whose. Im faster than he is autocrossing, but i feel that his car is easily faster than mine minus the driver, around the cones

Is his stock? A stock 135i is an understeering mess. RFT's, no limited slip, a really soft suspension and the relatively short wheelbase make for a sloppy car. Switching to the M3 control arms, stiffer shocks and non RFT's makes them much better, but a stock BRZ is more composed, even with the stock tires.

His is stock at the moment - he has a muffler delete and stoptech pads on order. he did make a comment about the understeer, but i felt that was because he is still learning to drive.

No, the 1er is not nearly as sorted as a 3er in stock form. They understeer all day long, and the staggered tires certainly don't help either.

Nice, congrats and welcome. Never seen side-by-side pics with a 135i. Interesting how much lower/wider the FR-S looks in comparison.

Wow turns out there are alot of people who made this switch lol. Glad to meet all of you.

Yea I never noticed how much wider the FR-S is than the 135i, kind of crazy.

The 135 understeers? That's disappointing - I've never driven one, but I did drive a 128i with the M-sport package (which I believe changes the suspension), and it didn't really have a problem with understeer. The lack of an LSD was a bit irritating when putting power down out of tight corners (the dealer was awesome and let me take it on an hour+ test drive by myself), but for the most part, it was an excellent car to drive.

I bought an FR-S...and a couple weeks later my buddy bought a 2008 135i. The amazing thing is that when it was all said and done, he ended up paying almost EXACTLY what I paid for my car---we both ended up at $29,xxx after tax, title, license, etc.

http://distilleryimage8.s3.amazonaws...0a9e299a_7.jpg


Yes, even with the M-Sport suspension it handled pretty badly, even on Pilot Super Sports; general understeer with power oversteer.

It's currently on Ground Control + Koni Yellows with 18x9's all around, and it handles a lot more neutrally. Unfortunately...it still understeers at the limit. He plans to do M3 LCA's next because his front camber plates are maxed and he still needs more camber.

So with suspension + muffler delete (I imagine that frees up a couple ponies) + Pilot Super Sports we went to an autocross together. I honestly consider him to be a bit of a better driver than me, but we're about equal, so we always have good battles in our respective rides. His best time? 46.8. My best time, in a 100% stock FR-S? 46.7. :party0030:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7304/8...751482f8_b.jpg

The 135i is very fast in a straight line, even though it's a fat pig (~3400 lbs). It's quiet on the highway and definitely has bigger rear seats than the 86. I actually think quite often about how I could have had a 135i for the same dough. But do I ever regret my decision? Hell no! If I had to make the decision over again, I'd pick the FR-S every day of the week and maybe a BRZ on Sunday :burnrubber:

The difference is your car is brand new with a 3yr/36K bumper to bumper and 5yr/60K powertrain warranty. His car is 5-6 years old (depending on build date). The cost of ownership is going to be way more for him than for you over the next 3-5 years that's for sure (even on gas alone). For what he will be paying for maintenance and repairs (and I know this because I owned a 3 series that cost me lots of dough around year 5) you could put towards mods or your next car.

I too am one of the converts from a 135i to the BRZ.

How much is loads of dough?

I have spent around 2.5 grand in repairs on my car over the past 4 years... and my car is 11 years old...

I do need to spend $1600 on a complete suspension overhaul and 2 grand on a full body paint...

First off, welcome to the club. Nice to hear a convert's story. looking forward to your build thread.:party0030:

Owned the car 2 years (it was 4.5 years old when I got it) and put about $4-5K into it. Some expensive repairs. I loved the car but would probably not buy used again unless there was still warranty coverage.

Did you do the repairs yourself or went to an indy?

Congrats on the new car, and welcome to the club! As to your 135 I gotta ask:

What in the hell did you do to that car to get 14 mpg? My brother's 335i easily tops 30 mpg highway, even cruising around 80 mph.

Its alllll city driving to work. 14.5-14.7 is what it hovers around. As soon as you tune and mod the N54 its a glutton for gas.

In stock configuration I could get 16-17mpg all city driving. But, this car also made me drive like a nut. I think if I babied it every where I could get 19 mpg in the city. For 2 MPG, you might as well drive it the way you want.

The mpg is not why I got rid of the car. It was 3 AC system repairs in 3 years. 3 HPFPs in 3 years. And, main because BMW service and I had a disagreement over a flat tire on a loaner car. BMW will not repair RFT tires, they will want to bill you for a new tire on their loaner cars.

Yeah I don't blame you for avoiding that. Shit like that is why I stay away from BMWs. A real shame as they used to be one of my favorite automakers.

Indy. I was living in Washington DC at the time with no garage and and working 60-70 hours per week. And everything costs way more in DC. I don't remember every repair (this was like 10 years ago) but I remember needing to get a new radiator, new brakes, new tires, new battery, new A/C compressor, new window motors. There was always something with the car and it was my daily driver. On the plus side I just about got what I paid for it when I sold it after two years.

I just have never had luck with German cars. I also owned two VW's that were always needing to get something fixed. That said, my best friend had an Audi A4, and his car was rock solid and all it needed was normal maintenance for the 7+ years he drove it.

That sucks about the loaner.



For what its worth, my wife's Audi A4 has been a champ. Not a single issue so far, knock on wood.

I didn't really mod my 330Ci, but going from that to the BRZ was a little bittersweet. The money I was saving was definitely sweet, though. $5k in repairs that I was completely incapable of doing myself in 4 months, and I was done. Ready to put that towards car payments instead of down the drain.

Remember the twins are an all Japanese built and designed car. Parts are unique and the DI is just as unproven as BMW engineering. And in the last decade the Subaru boxer reliability has been worse for major engine repair than BMW in-line 6. Time will but in a few years of road time maintaining a Toyobaru may be just as difficult as a BMW, this isn't a corolla by any means. Also an I-6 is much simplier to work on than a crammed in boxer.

I don't think long term reliability is a given over a BMW 1 series by any means.

That said the chassis of the Toyobaru is much better than the 1-series. BMW dropped the ball with the 1-series with too much under-steer and too much weight, it could have been a return to their roots but those are gone.

I was close to buying a 1-series but chose a new FR-S instead, but my fingures are crossed. There are no guarantees in this industry anymore.

^Historical trend though has definitely been in the direction of increased car reliability over the past 25 years. Still one wonders what the impact of all the complex technology that's been added to most cars in the last few years is going to be on that trend. The luxo German brands are already showing the impact of including that tech on their reliability scores.

The new DI motors are also having reliability issues, primarily sludge buildup on the valves. The twins may be OK on that score with their hybrid injection system.

This was my exact experience and the reason I made the switch to the BRZ. The final straw was the power steering pulley hit the aluminum cross member under hard acceleration causing the belt to break. The belt wrapped behind the crank pulley pushing the seal and belt inside the timing chain cover. At a BMW dealership all of these repairs would easily amount to over $10k. My warranty expired and I was unwilling to risk the unknown repair costs and down time.

That said, I love everything about my BRZ but I REALLY miss the ridiculous amount of torque from my lightly modded 135i!

I'm very surprised to see the size comparison between the two vehicles. The 135i is a rather small car, but makes the FR-S look tiny!

Here's a fun story of one car enthusiast's quest for power...
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrM9NFHhl0Q"]My 900+ HP Toyota Supra TURBO - YouTube[/ame]


+1 :thumbsup:

I watched that video and that guy fucked up a perfectly good Supra. Even when it's stock it's pretty fast and if it could talk it would probably say it just wants to drive not be constantly modified and raced at some two-bit drag racing event that will mean absolutely nothing in the big picture of life.

Great video, get the sense that guy has no idea how much risk is involved taking a 20 year old car 180+ mph. Not me. For my Scion Supra (how the local dealer service center has her logged in their database :clap:) I just want +50 HP and no torque dip.

A 135i has a lot in common with an old Supra, both have a turbo I-6 with unlimited straight line potential.

The Twins are nothing like a 135i or Supra in a straight line and very difficult to squeeze out just a few extra ponies , but they handle better than either.

German cars... Fun to drive, not fun to own... I sold my M3 with 115K miles on the odo.. Tracked it and never babied it.. No major issues with it...
But was needing new steering rack, VANOS noises getting worse, AC compressor noises.. I didn't want the hassles of it all.. Sad to see it go.. Thought the FRS would be a care free replacement with warranty.. So far so good..
Missing some of the torque and the refined pull from the I6.. But the FRS is more fun at slower speeds.. Spending less also makes it more fun to beat on..
I really like the lightweight and skinny tires on the FRS.. While it might not be as good at the limits like the M3 was... It's better for everything to the limits..
:thumbsup:

My BRZ's final salute to my old 135i - captured today. 2002 miles. For those that don't get the reference the 135i was supposedly inspired by the BMW 2002ti.

Hey man! Don't know if you remember me from 1addicts I have a BSM/Coral and I drooled over your car forever Hehehe. Anyway, it surprised me a lot to see you here. I thought I was nuts considering this switch from the n54, but now I see in definitely not the only one!!!

My reason is that I'm most likely relocating to South Florida soon (from Puerto Rico) and wanted my DD to be a bit easier on the pocket (not that I've had any problems with my 135i). I'll be paying attention to your build and probably will bother you a bit for updates on the 1er vs Brz. :cheers:
Also I've considered looking for a Brz already FI but don't know about losing warranty and reliability yet.
Regards Bro and congrats on the house and the new project!

I remember you bro, welcome to the forums. Its like 1addicts here, helpful and snarky in equal amounts. :cheers:

That reminds me, I saw this on the way to work this morning. I was surprised how small they really are - I hadn't seen one in a while, and they really are tiny cars. I wish BMW still made truly small, lightweight RWD cars...

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5q02npo0w2...227_092317.jpg

I came from a 135i as well and after blowing the water pump at 60k miles and being told that's to be expected I decided I couldn't afford maintaining that car when the pump and thermostat cost $600 and were very difficult to replace even with a lift. I do miss the torque peak at 1500rpm, I had just a tune and catless DPs and mids but that car was an absolute blast. With just those mods I was able to sit right next to a tuned 2013 5.0 that my buddy drove, definitely one of the more exciting cars for the money if you can find a nice one used.