A challenge for all the tuners out there?
 

So a friend of mine has been tuning engines for quite a long time. He's been my mentor over the years and what he produces is quite impressive.

I am curious to find out if any of the tuners or 'tuners' on this forum would be able to replicate the results he has?

For example, below is a superflow engine dyno graph for one of his 2 litre engines. No VVT, no direct injection, single scroll turbocharger, pump fuel (97-98RON). You'll notice over 300 ft-lb from ~3500rpm and a fantastic torque curve. Some more detail, 7.5:1 SCR, T3/T04E type turbo, journal bearing.

http://i.imgur.com/XgzzI44.jpg


I've never seen anyone produce a torque band as good as this on a 500bhp 2L engine. I'm hoping that some of the BRZ/86 tuners are capable of attaining this? This is a serious question. Who can do it?

Answers on a postcard.......

:popcorn:

I'm no tuner but I'll give it a go.

Lemme just find my ruler around here somewhere...

I think has to do with the cams being sized correctly for that powerband. The FA20 holds nice torque from 2500-6500 (with a header lol). If they were to size the cams to boost the VE above 6500 (at the expense of low end), you theoretically COULD attain that power band with a properly sized turbo. Holding a power band for 2000-3000 RPM isn't difficult.

Looks pretty close...

who needs tuning skills when you have photoshop skills! ;)

The innovate dyno looks exactly like this, done.

ROFL

OP's dyno looks like data points were taken every 500 rpm and a straight line was drawn between each. If that is the case the chart is misleading and a poor gauge to judge other charts by.

pff, you call this a challenge?

here, done

NEXT

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...48878637_n.jpg

I love your napkin dynos @7thgear

Great VTEC after 20,000 RPM. Should get a VTEC controller..

and that's just in reverse!

I couldnt believe OP even made this thread. Thanks for not dissapointing with the responces!

Sent from mission control

I know, it's terrible. Someone posting up a decent dyno graph. Shocking isn't it. :eyebulge:

So no tuners responded yet. Just the usual suspects. Marvellous.

who da hell are you?



sorry, let me clarify

my dynograph is, given the information that you have provided, just as valid as yours.

what is this car that's pushing 500bhp FLAT out of a 2 liter. Is it reliable? Pics? Pics of dyno run?

Who is this guys that built this engine, does she/he have a website? I googled "special engine services" and get little results, other than a website that doesnt work and a facebook page that hasn't been updated since April of 2012.

INFORMATION WE MUST KNOW!

otherwise the napkins will just keep on coming.

I don't see the point - there's plenty of older engines that can be boosted to make great power. But that's because they don't have to pass modern emissions, don't have to get great or even good gas mileage, and probably have a good head design. Having an iron block would help as well.

I got a tuner challenge - use more than 5 data points.

Ok, great. What can he do on an FA20???

:thanks:

I bet every single tuner on this board could build a 2.0 4g63 evo/dsm with that kind of dyno without much fuss.

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...ps43bf5179.jpg
"Guess what we're having for dinner boys? I posted an phony 500bhp dyno sheet on ft86club.com! Hahahaha!"

Scott

Last I checked, tuning is not black magic.

Here, more torque earlier. With a slightly different turbo this easily would have beat the chart you posted at all six data points.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22123

Hi Paul. Thanks for replying. I was starting to wonder if anyone would beyond all the fanboys.

I am intrigued by your comment about not seeing the point. What don't you see the point of? Having an engine with a nice wide band of torque? This is surprising as your AVO turbo conversion (at its current power level) has a nice band of torque itself. Surely this is a characteristic you'd like to try and maintain as you start to produce higher power conversions?

I was under the impression that the FA20 had a good head design, going by what some other tuners have said on this forum.

Do you see not using an iron block being a major reason for other tuners not being able to get a wide torque band?

I tuned my car to travel through time at 88mph. My car isn't tuned to spin donuts; instead, it spins the fabric of space time!

Now... can your tuner do that?

LOL, sorry man, he doesn't answer to "fanbois", only REAL tuners...

Alright, The biggest reason you are not getting a responses you want is for starters, that dynograph. This displays you have inexperience with the finer levels of engine enhancement using tools like a dyno. This is not a fault, Everyone starts somewhere, I know for certain I was not born with a wrench in my hand, otherwise my mother would be dead or turbocharged.

The only effect a cast iron block will have on the torque of an engine, is that of a supporting portion of a whole bucket of changes.
Say if someone were to create a stroker kit for this engine, It would likely use a 20 to 40 over piston. A cast block is safer for these clearances, That's it.

If you have past experience with larger engines, and judging by your obsession with torque curves you may, Try to keep in mind, these do not react as drastically as them. I have not opened one up myself, But from what I can tell, we are using a short stroked rod/piston combo, And I have no doubt, in a year or two's time, we will be seeing valve spring and cam kits all over the place, and these engine screaming along at 10k RPM all day.

Cut yourself some slack, Its been said time and time again, google things. The particular information on this engine may not be out there yet, but the basics are as old as porn itself. The answers are out there, just sometimes worded differently, or on another platform/engine, just dig a little.

If you have faith that your dynograph is real, Print it, keep it on another screen, whatever. Then google "Dyno" and click on images. Nothing ive seen in all of my years tuning makes a chart that looks like yours.

Keep your stick on the ice.

Of comparing any other engine design, especially if it is one built for turbocharging, vs. a completely different engine design - especially one that wasn't built for turbocharging.

The engineers at the manufacturer make design decisions based on what the engine is to be used for. If they are tasked with making a n/a engine, then they design all the components for n/a. If they are tasked with making a turbocharged engine, they design for turbocharging.

Just because this motor responds so well to being turbocharged doesn't mean it wouldn't perform even better if it was designed for turbocharging in the first place.

:laughabove::bellyroll::bellyroll::bellyroll:... Holy Spaceballs, how did i miss this...


:).......












...:laughabove:Fuck me, good laugh

Just because two engines are 2.0L doesn't mean they are/should/can be the same. So many other aspects to an engine than displacement.

Nobody up to the challenge then? Shame.

lol, did you just get bored and decide to troll? I am not at all a tuner just to be clear.

Then you sir, are NOT allowed to weigh in on this topic. For realz tunerz only.

A drastic change in cam profiles can make a world of difference in tuning. You can build a profile to build power early, or a profile for a high flowing turbo. There are a ton of tricks out there to get the desired powerband.

You still have the engine's design to take into consideration as well. Not all engines are designed for high rpm beating, likewise, not all are set up for big midrange torque. there are so many variables to this that are beyond what a normal person would consider.

That's right, stuff i expect tuners to know, hence this thread!