AutoX crash in the BRZ
 

Not the prettiest video:

[ame]http://youtu.be/TbsFlUzWA6s[/ame]

And some pics:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8388/8...44e3edb0_s.jpg
roof damage 2 by jay and sandi, on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8385/8...c5419ca2_s.jpg
rear left quarter by jay and sandi, on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8245/8...feaca729_s.jpg
bumper damage by jay and sandi, on Flickr

http://i578.photobucket.com/albums/s...Z/IMG_1761.jpg

http://i578.photobucket.com/albums/s...Z/IMG_1765.jpg

http://i578.photobucket.com/albums/s...Z/IMG_1767.jpg

So as you can she is being fixed and will be back at the track soon.
And it seems one of the first to be hurt .... no used parts in North America. Fortunately found a good autobody guy that is putting time into fixing the panels. We only needed to order about 17 or so new parts. The driver's side mirror was very expensive, and so is that rear quarter window.

Jay

Ouch. Glad no one got hurt!

holy s*** man. glad you came out okay!

Gald you're okay. What happened? Looks like it just slid and had no steering input

I myself and I'm sure everyone here would like to thank you for rebuilding the BRZ and not scraping it for another one like so many [frs'] before you. :thumbsup:

Nothing more surreal than being on your hands and knees on the roof liner. Your mind wants to make the car right side up and the entire world upside-down. Glad you are ok, and if you've never rolled a car before, welcome to the club.

Yes first time up side down. I have done the roll simulator at Primitive Racing, different experience. Done a reasonable amount of different racing: autox, lapping days, karts, Rallyx, TSD rally and "hornet" racing (stock 4 cylinder cars, 1/5 mile track). Only one other major accident and that was in a $750 hornet car. Only question is why in this car and now?

That's racing I guess.

Did not make sense in the end to scrap it; salvage value is too low, and I did not feel like doing a part out. So that left rebuild.

point 1
thats a strong ass roof...

point 2
im guessing it was cold, tiny bit of moisture? understeer?

point 3
what have we learned?

understeer? give it a little bit of of brakes when you feel the tires give next time, dont slam just a bit of pressure

point 4
im glad you both are ok!


I watched the video again, looks like the weight transfer wasnt 100% complete, thats what caused the understeer.

the ass end of the car was still moving left when you tried to turn left, so the outcome was you went straight. hope this helps!

I think what happened is as I came around cone on right the back end might have kicked out a bit (I do not remember this happening) and so my "turn" to the left around the cone only ended up counter steering the back end and causing me to head straight to the bank instead of turning to the left.

Glad you're ok and all the rest, but man, appalling steering wheel technique.
I would get some proper driving instruction before hitting the track again if I were you.

Curious....you tried to start it upside down?

I think he was trying to kill the engine?

Anywho, glad you are ok! Looks like the back end came loose at exactly the same moment that you attempted to steer heavily to the left. RWD :word: Maybe they will take out those huge mounds after this accident?

Glad you are ok and able to walk out!!!!!

Glad your ok, but have to agree on the steering wheel technique. You don't give yourself much chance of saving a mistake with hands like that.

looks like understeer to me

glad you made it out safe! I'm surprised the damage wasn't more severe.

I am glad that you walked away OK from this. Sorry about the damage to the car. Thanks for having the courage to make this post. It is great to have videos like this posted on this site to show people what can and might happen at any moment. This is not just relevant to an autox or race track. This could happen on any public road with an embankment like that. It only takes one split second of indecision or one wrong driver input for everything to go wrong.

Wannabe boy racers and street drifters in particular should remember this.

this car doesnt like cold/wet conditions with sudden direction changes one after another... glad your ok buddy

The important thing is you didn't get hurt.

Were nannies off? I am going to assume they were, and being a RWD on Wet while trying to AutoX...glad you walked away though.

I wondered about trying to start it, cause I saw you hit the button to turn the car off, then a little later hit it again, so I wondered if that was an attempt to see if it would crank upside down lol...not many chances to test inverted ignition!

I'm about to start autocross racing for the very first time next month, and all I've got to say is I'm glad the place I'm going is just a big empty parking lot after seeing this. Glad you are ok, hurts to see the car mangled like that though.

This. And that is a horrible venue for Autocross.

Glad you're alright.

That did not look like the 50ft of space that the SCCA suggests. I understand you need to work with where you are, but it looks to me like safety guidelines were flat out ignored.

OP, I'm glad you are OK, and I hope you will work with the event organizers to make sure the future courses are safer.

I don't think ANY car does

Glad you are OK

Other than hand-over-hand in the turn, there was no other criticism of his technique, imo. He used both hands, didn't let go of the wheel in the turnaround & actually fed the wheel back straight (a LOT of people let the wheel go), etc. Granted, he could he reacted quicker, but wheel technique had nothing to do with that.


OP. as stated, glad you're okay & I'm really sorry what should have been a routine spin is dodgy conditions, ended up very badly for you. And as Dave mentioned, that venue was no place to hold an AutoX, with the cones so close to embankments. I'm sure they'll rethink the decision to slalom so closely to that big berm...

Wow, glad you're okay and THANKS for posting this! That crash seemed to have come out of no where. I think you're right when you say your initial steering input was counter steering the back end rather than turning.

Aren't all cars supposed to automatically shut them selves off when the car is upside down? I was under the impression that for safety reasons something in the fuel system is supposed to starve the engine of fuel which would in turn kill the car. The fact that the car stayed running is concerning.

Let alone that big ass concrete wall at the beginning. And if you ever wondered 'Why do I need a helmet at an AutoX', now you know why.

I hope this educates you: [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Understeer_and_oversteer"]Understeer and oversteer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

Before I watched the video I was thinking, "how on earth does one crash at an auto-x?" Maybe into a light pole in the parking lot or something, but every autox I've done has had LOTS of open space around the driving line of the course. I can't believe the club set the chicane up right by that hill of earth. How irresponsible of them!

The 10-2 position is non-sense. It slows you down and is less precise because you're off balance. Most of the time both hands are going up (or down) simultaneously and it takes a lot more muscles (and force) to achieve. It made some sense when power steering didn't exist but it is totally outdated.

A 9-3 position makes your arms work in opposition, resulting in a more stable position along with faster and easier movement. It enables a better *flow* in your steering input and gives a wider turning angle without letting go of the wheel too.

In this particular case, I believe that the slow and insufficient steering correction lead to the crash. A proper steering technique could have avoided landing that poor BRZ on its roof.

hah DITTO


edit: saw your avatar, are you a Duquesne grad or is that a coincidence?

This is the unfortunate truth. But to the OP, get it fixed and get some tuition and you should hopefully avoid doing it again in the future! Don't let it put you off.

Sorry, but faster hands may have been the only way to have avoided this (possibly). Being behind also affected his situation.

And, BTW, a friend of mine who's an SCCA National Champ in Solo & Pro, steers @ 10-2, maybe even 11-1 lol. His hands move incredibly fast on the wheel...

Your friend must be the exception... In the mean time, I suggest you watch any on-board video of pro racers in categories using street-like steering racks (Le Mans GT3 and GT2 series come to mind).

Thanks for the pointers on the hands ... had to go back and review some videos. There is room for improvement. Although to be honest I never felt the oversteer. Planning on some more instruction time this year before this happened.

Did not try to start when upside down, was trying to turn off.

And as for the venue: where we are there are only two venues available and both are short track ovals. I guess the only other option is not to AutoX. There is a venue on the mainland, but that means close to $200 in ferry fares, an hotel room and other associated costs (I know, cheaper than what happened). And it is under extreme pressure from the locals as being too noisy. We do try to make the courses as safe as possible, and you usually drive to the conditions (no room for error in some sections). Accidents are rare, but not as rare as a parking lot / airport course.

That is an awful autocross design. Since it's in Canada, they probably do not need to adhere to SCCA standards, but no way should a slalom be that close to something you should be avoiding!

Yeah I came into this thread wondering how someone flipped a BRZ in autox! But man, that's such an unsafe setup for autox. Also, what were those people doing so close to the track @12 seconds in the video? Maybe they were fixing cones or something, but they seemed to be leisurely walking through the course

Crazy. Good thing you had the neck pad.

Crappy situation but cars can be rebuilt. Good thing is you're up to see another day.