My letter made it into Car and Driver!
 

DISCLAIMER: This letter was not intended to insult the Scion FR-S or any of it's owners; it is merely a lamentation of Toyota's decision to market the Toyota 86 as a Scion in the U.S. Put your flamethrowers away.

My friend called me the other day saying he loved my article in Car and Driver magazine, and I honestly forgot I even wrote one! It was in response to Aaron Robinson's August column titled "It's Time for Toyota to Kill Scion", seen here: http://www.caranddriver.com/columns/...l-scion-column


http://i.imgur.com/DMMa0.jpg?6843

Here's the un-edited version of that letter:
Feel free to agree or disagree, but remember that I have no disrespect for anyone who bought an FR-S, just disappointment at Toyota.

Agree totally!

Subaru>Scion

Toyota 86 == Subaru BRZ

:w00t: Congratulation, and fantastic bit!

I think I can agree with that, but before this becomes a VS thread, let's just remember there are already 80 million VS threads in this forum.

So that being said,

Congrats on getting into the magazine! It was well written.

I didn't mind purchasing my FR-S over the BRZ.... but that's mostly because a Scion dealer actually happened to have one 10 miles from my house. :thumbup:

I guess I'm one of the few that doesn't associate brand with identity. A brand is just a manufacturer...a couple of emblems and a name on the title. I could care less if it was made by Ford, Chevy, Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, or whatever...if it's a good car and in my price range, I'll consider it. I've never said "that's a great car...if only it was made by X instead of Y".

I'll be the first to admit I wasn't excited to hear the 86 would be badged a Scion but there is a side benefit I hadn't considered before buying the FR-S. I love pulling up next to a high end badge (like BMW) at a stop light and think to myself: "eat your heart out, you've just been face slapped by a Scion!!"


:burnrubber:

Comically, at least here in Michigan where you are as well, the name on the title is Toyota.

Completely agree, but I dislike Subaru more and will be rebadging my future FR-S as a Toyota. The brand "Scion" evokes conversations with car-ignorant imbeciles who purchased a transportation lifestyle accessory.

I completely agree, I hope 5 years later we wont be seeing a Scion Supra.:barf:

well the 8th gen celica and the MKV Supra are in the works, cant wait... i hope the celica is RWD or AWD upon its return!

And congrats on getting recognized OP!

Celica? I heard MR2! Come on Toyota, we need another mid-engine car! LOL, not likely but it would sure be nice. I heard they would build one car above the 86 (Supra successor) and one below (MR2 or Celica I suppose)

I'm going to agree with you, I feel like we are very lucky that they decided to bring the car over here in the first place since we usually don't get the nicer japanese cars. I'm not going to cry over the badge on the car. And here in Canada most people don't have a clue what a scion is anyway.

PS: I will say right now, I plan to put on a Toyota emblem front and back along with the 86 badge at one point, just because :D

If I had the FRS I would absolutely badge swap it to a Toyota.

or how about bringing back an AWD corolla?

if they do a celica i hope the yamaha has a hand in building the engine :D

Its the Supra, Celica, and MR2 from what I believe. One above, one below, and one more mass market (guessing the Celica, but with a subi partnership here's praying for an all-trac version). I'm praying for a TTop MKii successor for the mr2, but a Mki wouldn't be bad either.

Congrats on getting your response published! Very well written and I think that what you said about marketing strategies rings true.

I also would have preferred that Toyota brought the 86 here to the states under the Toyota banner but I am with most here in the feeling that I am overall very pleased that we were lucky enough to have the car available to us at all in the states.

I have lived nearly 8 years in Japan and seen first hand the wonderful assortment of cars and bikes that never make it to our shores. I don't think that I am alone in my belief that, as an enthusiast, this is a tragedy. Cars such as the R32, R33, R34 GTRs and GTS-Ts, turbo 180s, turbo Silvias, Evolution I-VI would have enjoyed a lot of success here in the U.S. I know that there are other cars unique to Europe and elsewhere but my experience is only from Japan.

Personally however, I opted for the FR-S over the BRZ simply because of the styling and as long as the driver's experience is true to the original, JDM-spec 86, I am fine with that. It's just a badge at the end of the day and labels don't make cars better or faster.

Scott

All I am saying
http://www.motorstown.com/images/geo-prizm-06.jpg

Agreed, I was a little disappointed to hear it would be marketed here as a Scion. I don't think Scion cars aren't quality, but they look like they're designed by a Ringling Bros. clown. But, I bought an FR-S because a)cheaper, & b) I actually found one. I will be swapping Toyota emblems ASAP. The aftermarket will let people go whatever they want to the cars anyways, you don't have to be stuck with a Scion. Who knows, maybe if enough people swap to Toyota emblems, they'll eventually take the hint.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't care that my car is a scion, I just wish it had the GT86 headlights.

^^ See, that's the biggest part of my problem with their decision. I wouldn't necessarily have cared so much about the badge, if Scion didn't offer "mono-spec" cars. I.E. if you could get all the features on the 86 GT Limited/BRZ Limited in the FR-S, I'd swallow my pride and still get it. Buuuuut you can't, so if you want the goodies you gotta get the Subie.

Hence the reason I bought the BRZ, had my Celica for 10 years.
Got to the point where I wanted the little extras it came with, that the FRS didn't have.

A badge is just a badge. Who cares what you call it. It's still the same car no matter what way you slice it.

BTW turbo, did you get your order in for your car? I remember you missing out on the first one that came in.

Could you imagine a Scion with a sticker price of $30,000 or more? :lol:

Aside from the dealer mark ups...

LOL, well what's the problem in getting the BRZ over the FR-S then? Why is the badge such a big thing??? It's here, it's available, those cars are indentical and the Subaru has what you want, why not get the subie? You blame scion for pushing wrong visions on their target market, and at the same time you really care about the badge on YOUR car, and toyota is pretty much known for making boring car for the last 10 years. Sounds paradoxial.

Congrats on your publication though, very well written :)

That's a good point... No one would buy the Scion with that price but I'd considered if that same car had the Toyota on it!

Same stuff over and over.

Nice car, 2 different brands. One offers more luxury items the other is more basic for a lower price.

What's the big deal?? Scion made it possible for more people to get in on this by keeping the price point lower to start. You have Subaru if you want extras. OMG Toyota doesn't have their version with different extras from Subaru!!! This is a job for Chevy, Pontiac, Oldsmobile and Buick. See how well that goes over nowadays? :laughabove:

How Toyota handled the marketing and introduction of their FT-86 collaboration reminds me of how we the consumer bailed out financial institutions and manufactures recently. It defines to me the lack of trust in their investment with the company they collaborated. They chose not to brand their main moniker, instead using the strength of the concept to bail out the death spasms of a line of cars not worthy of heritage or mechanical recognition.
I did not choose FR-S initially, my local Subaru dealer did that for me in their lack of customer loyalty when the used car manager refused to take the WRX wagon I bought from them cause I powder coated the wheels black.
I chose the AT for innovation, and availability. And I know this will not be my only FT-86 platform car. It is my first new car ever, and my first AT ever for that matter and I am 46. I have always bought used and caressed them to my specifications. I applaud your words and the fact they were published. I may wait for a Supra or a mid-engine offering from Akio Toyoda. Either way I have always thought Toyota was going to dominate the automotive market, this just took some of that glimmer off the brand.

Blame Toyota for allowing itself to be associated with boring appliances here in the US. In Japan (and other markets) Toyota has had interesting cars to sell, but ever since they created the Scion brand all of their "interesting" cars have gone under that brand here in North America.

For better or worse, anything that's not the rolling equivalent of a Kenny G concert gets sold as a Scion.

I don't mind that the FR-S is a Scion. If that's where it fits best based on Toyota's North American divisions, so be it. If they'd sold it as a GT-86, I'd have bought one too.

The only thing I don't like is the lack of options that are normally available on the GT-86. I personally have no use for farkles and gadgets, but lots of people do, and those people are by default being pushed to Subaru.

30k otd in Canada :iono:

I haven't ordered another one yet. My dealer sold out their allocation so I'm waiting until we can order more; save myself a little money over buying one at MSRP elsewhere. I'm also saving more $$ for a bigger down payment, so as a first-time buyer I won't get denied financing. Planning for late winter/early spring!

you also have to think of it this way, you're getting subaru/toyota quality for scion money.

the car doesn't "feel" like a scion.

The irony in the article and OP's complaints is hilarious to me.

We demand a new awesome sports car and we got a new awesome sports car... but they called it by the wrong name!!!111oneone :(

Denigration of the superficial hipster mentality while crying about the badge on the car?

Call it an Edsel for all I care.

You are upset that Scion is selling a car that Toyota designed, Subaru built, Subaru Assembled, and Scion (Toyota mind you) is selling? You are getting upset over the way a vehicle is branded?

Doesn't that sound like something a "hipster" would do?

Buy which ever car you want and make it your own.

Congratulations on being published though, the article was well written.

Fixed

Feel free to right click and copy the Image URL and use it in your original post.

http://i.imgur.com/DMMa0.jpg?6843

We who own them .. don't really care about this jibber jabber. Why? Because we're busy enjoying the car.

Does anybody know what the real marketing strategy was behind making the FRS a Scion instead of a Toyota?

My only guess is that they prob thought the FRS would appeal to a more younger generation, which is what scion is really about. Although I think they would have actually had better sales numbers if it was labeled a toyota.

I don't really mind that I got the scion, because had it been a Toyota with different trims. I would've still opted for the base 6speed.
But, it would've been nice just for it to be an option for other people.

That's exactly why I wanted a Subaru from day 1. I nearly settled for a Scion and had a deposit on a whiteout. Luckily I was able to find a Subie dealer in Colorado that would sell me one for a fair value.

FRS drivers are probably not your typical "hip" Scion crowd with wakaba badges, native nation's flag on the rear view mirrior, stickers on the car, hypebeasts etc. There's a certain group of people that drive Scions. I hope FRS owners will help break this Scion stereotype as I love the FRS nearly as much as the BRZ. I really wished somebody convinced the Toyota marketing team in the US to sell it under Toyota though.

US Toyota marketing believes the Scion brand is more appealing to youths. Even though Toyota has clearly taken their focus away from sports cars in recent years, the Scion brand isnt known for attracting enthusiasts; this is an enthusiast's car.

They probably thought they were going to get higher sales numbers with Scion but I doubt that is true considering the limited quantities of these cars being available. These cars would sell like hot cakes regardless.