Nine Lives Racing Wang mounting discussion
 

I know many 86 owners that track, TT, race, etc are using the Nine Lives Racing Wang on their cars as have I.

I have noticed, that the trunk lid actually flexes due to the design of the trunk hinges, allowing the AOA of the Wang to change as downforce increases, inducing drag. See for yourself, go pull back on the Wang and you will see the front of the trunk lid (by the rear glass) lift up, changing the angle of attack.

Has anyone modified the trunk, or the mounting, to make everything more solidly mounted? I asked Nine Lives if they had, or could design, a body mount solution similar to the Miata trunk hinge mount and didn't get much of a reply.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/02...g?v=1649865589

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/02...g?v=1664491160

Since my Wang mounts were damaged due to my Sebring tire wall meeting, I am looking for a better mounting solution ideas for the replacement Wang and trunk, thinking of bolting the front corners through the trunk into the body...whatcha think? Any other ideas or solutions that you are using?

I also found that it flexes/compresses, enough that the trunk lid rubs on the top of the taillight.
I recorded this image at ~80mph, zero-ish AOA.
https://i.imgur.com/Uhb2zSn.png

While I didn't rigidly mount as you're discussing, I did make some stand-offs to stabilize it.
https://i.imgur.com/xciWMSr.jpg

I remember seeing pictures of someone on here has their wing mounted to the hinge mounting points. A good solution if you're willing to cut and pin your trunk lid.

Even my little APR GTC-200 flexes the trunk quite a bit. I am running a much larger 65" from winglogic this year so I am working on a solution myself. Haven't decided if I am going to trunk mount it and reinforce the trunk, or go to the chassis like @Takumi788 did. I'd prefer to have the trunk securable. I have been thinking keep trunk mount, but add a reinforcement with quick latches down to it........maybe. I dunno yet.

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...&postcount=434

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...&postcount=441

Thanks, that was the one I was thinking of.

If you look at the hinge assembly there is a place to install a bolt that will support the vertical load.
That and replacing the rubber stops at the back of the trunk(as shown in previous post) will help a lot.
I also welded in a metal pad where the at the rear where the new bolt contacts the body.
I think these mods mostly eliminate the problem.

The timing of this thread is just lovely. I just received my new Nine Lives wang and will be mounting it soon. Any pictures and any more suggestions are greatly appreciated!


Any tips for installing this thing would be appreciated as well!

I have a similar set up to this on my wang trunk/hinges, have not had the car out in that form to see how well they work.

So I like this idea, and have done something similar but I'm referring to the lift at the rear glass side of the trunk lid. While this type of stop keeps the rear of the trunk from compressing downward, it does little to nothing to reduce the lift at the front.

I understand what you are talking about but am a bit skeptical it's a problem. Are you sure that it is actually lifting on track? I'd be curious if you put a camera on it to see how much, if any, it moves.

*Edit* I pulled straight back on my Wang about as much as I dare and was able to change the AOA 0.5 deg. I'm still curious if this is actually happening on track. For now I'll chalk it up to DRS.

This got me to thinking so I went and took a look at the way it's set up. I honestly don't see an easy way to keep the front edge from lifting without completely redesigning the hinge for the trunk lid. The idea of putting stronger support on the back/bottom edge seems to the the only way to try and counter the issue.

I was looking at the trunk. The hinge bolts go through the body and stick out on the inside. I am thinking of building a brace that mounts to the bottom of the trunk hinge on the inside and runs across. Then running something like a quick latch to the trunk to stabilize it from the brace.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...e597efe253.jpg

Think I'm going to implement two things to address this, a stand-off like redlined600 mentioned at the rear of the trunk...and a stop to the trunk hinge like ROADRACER mentioned. I didn't understand what he meant until I watched this video for another brand wing and then I understood. Watch 1:10 - 3:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBwpgoIfYbo

I think the combination of thse two supports will limit the movement quite a bit.

So since the old trunk and Wang mounts were damaged in December due to my wall brush, I mounted the new Wang mounts tonight, with some of your suggested improvements to reduce trunk deflection under load. Trunk is 99% solid now...

Deck lids will flex. This is why chassis mount is best practice.

My small ARP wing has flexed my decklid to the point where it has cracked paint. Reinforcement is good.

Thank you for sharing your photos!

I have two questions:

1. How long were the bolts that you used?

2. How is everyone sealing the new holes in the trunk lid for the uprights? I asked Nine Lives and they suggested Flex Seal, or silicone. I see the Verus wing comes with some fancy VHB double-sided tape.

1a: For the mounting the stands to the trunk (4 top holes): Button head allens, 304 Stainless Steel M6x1mm thread, 22mm long, with 304 Stainless steel flat washers (topside) & 304 Stainless 25MM OD Fender Washers (inside) secured with 304 Stainless Steel Nylon Insert Flange locknuts, M6x1mm thread.

1b: For the mounting the stands to the trunk (2 rear holes): Button head allens, 304 Stainless Steel M6x1mm thread, 22mm long, with 304 Stainless steel flat washers (topside) into M6 Zinc Plated Carbon Steel Rivnuts.

1c: For mounting the Wang to the stands: Button head allens, 304 Stainless Steel M6x1mm thread, 22mm long, with 304 Stainless steel flat washers (button side) secured with 304 Stainless Steel Nylon Insert Flange locknuts, M6 x 1mm thread.

1d: For the fancy stand offs: 304 Stainless Steel Socket Head Screws, M6x1mm thread, 40mm long secured with 304 Stainless Steel Flange nuts, M6 x 1mm thread into M6 Zinc Plated Carbon Steel Rivnuts.

Stainless because no rust, and look better.

2: To seal the trunk holes I used some left over tool box drawer liner I had, cut to the shape of the mount. Works great...matter of fact I re-used the peices off the old Wang mounts on the new Wang mounts.

I used silicone. My paint and body guy was not happy.

Where have yall been. This is the 9lives builders kit I have been running for 3 years, and some other 86 track guys have been running it like this too. just uses the trunk hinges as the mounts and need a slit in the trunk to slide over the upright. But really the little trunk flex you get with the normal mounts isn't going to matter.


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0

Can't remember every post :bonk: I knew there was one had a bar across with quick latches. I think I was initially thinking of your car and not Takumi788's .

What you don't remember every post?! Do you even forum? lol

You are lovely human being. Thank you very much for this detailed response!

I'm using doubled sided tape temporarily until I wrap/paint the spare trunk the wang is on. After that I was going to use marine grade silicon to seal it off. The VHB has not been tested as that trunk/wang is off the car for the winter.

This I like.....wish 9Lives would've mentioned this as an option....

Johnny wants to sell kits.

Just want to say thanks for the info on this thread. You folks rule!

I installed a 9lives wang on my ‘22 86 and was looking for a solution to the flexing of the trunk. Just ordered the bolts, nuts, and rivnuts. Wish me luck that it works/helps. They should come as part of the wang kit.

Anyone have a problem with an upright not sitting flush on the trunk lid? One of the mounts must not have been welded on straight, resulting in the attached photo. Quite frustrating, since I didn't find out until after I had the wing powdercoated.

I'm trying to gently "bend" things into place, but unsurprisingly it's not going well.

Suggestions?

EDIT: Nevermind. There is no way I'm attempting to mount this thing. Not only is the mount crooked, but it is also welded a 1/4" further inboard than the other. What a waste of time.

There is a right, and a left, upright. Are you sure you have them on the right sides?

Yessir. The right stand lines up perfectly. The left stand is the one in the photo above. Its mount is welded onto the aerofoil too far inboard (compared to the right) and on an angle. This leaves the angle/gap you see in the photo I attached in my previous post, as well as the rear hole nowhere nears where it needs to be (attached photo, not my car).

I've reached out to Nine Lives and am awaiting their response.

Has anyone done this on a Gen 2 car?

I can’t figure out where it’d make most sense to install some support to keep the trunk from bending/flexing with a wang.

Would it make sense to replace the rubber supports on both side of the latch with hard bolts, and removing the plastic piece on the edge of the trunk so the bolts have a hard point to rest on?

This. I ran a 9LR on my S2000 when they first came out, after a season my trunk lid itself was cracked about 25% of the way around the top feet.

https://i.imgur.com/hvi4fV5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ZeGKGZD.jpg

You can mitigate that with a backing plate on the inside to distribute load across a wider area, if you have room on the inside of the lid. It will probably still flex, but should help it from tearing. I am going to have to do that with the little APR universal mounts I bought.

Well, isn't that terrifying. Thank you for sharing!

Yeah, a lot of reinforcement is needed for deck-lid mounted wings. It's pretty easy to make a few hundred pounds of downforce at high speeds, and even more at "peak" (ie: strong head wind + high speed).

Most mounts have fair small footprints- maybe 8-10 square inches at most. You're talking hundreds of PSI there.

I'd be more concerned about reinforcing the actual lid itself. Localized pressure is going to be rough on thin sheetmetal. You could probably bond some sheetmetal to it. Again, not idea, but it would help with localized loads a ton. Remember, rigidity increases cubically (power of 3) with thickness.

Rubber mounts are fine, IMO. If anything, they can flex a bit and that's a good thing. Maybe just make them bigger or more of them. The Viper ACR, which has a MASSIVE "double decker" wing that is deck mounted, runs rubber mounts. They just have a bigger landing pad than the non-acr versions. I think they also basically bond a second layer of carbon to the deck lid. A little different, as it's a pure carbon body panel, but same concept.

I actually really like the wing mounts on my GTC200 and have been thinking about reusing them with my new wing. They have a very large footprint.

Yeah, those are monsters. Not very aesthetically pleasing, but great for load distribution.

At the track yesterday I noticed that the rear mounts were pushing down away from the bolts. These were tightened down to the point of bending the the trunk a bit with a backing washer. On the top I am using backing washers, but I'm highly considering building some plates similar to the ARP ones above.

https://i.imgur.com/0vWfZNm.jpg